End of Software Support - Clarifications

End of Software Support - Clarifications
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M
Userlevel 4
Badge +1

Here’s another thought, given there are lots of eyes on this forum at the moment a few of them have to be bright spark techies or electronics wizards, unlike myself I hasten to add😁 

what we need is one of these clever guys to whip the top off a play1, 3 or 5 and figure out how to retrofit a line in,  aux Jack, possibly even a Bluetooth module. I love the sound quality of my Sonos kit and always have and I would personally pay to have my gear retro fitted and thus make it independent of any software shenanigans. I think people would queue up for this to be done. 
 

come on one of you bright sparks get the soldering iron out and get yourself a profitable ready made business all in one go 😁👍🏻

The play: 5 has a line-in already and just to say the Play:1 and 3 devices are not part of the annoucement .. hope that assists. 👍

Hi Ken,

yep my Play 5 does have a line in but it still needs the Sonos app to work, I’m talking about making each unit wholly independent of the software and app, a standalone powered speaker. Whilst the 1’s and 3’s are not the issue at the moment Mr Spence’s mealy mouthed reply sure made it clear they will be part of the issue at some point…...

Just to say (briefly) the line in, when set to Autoplay, will always work without the Sonos App and without WiFi for that matter. Some folk take them from Home to Work and run them off their mobile with the usual 3.5mm cable. Just so you know that option remains open to you. Not that I think you will ever need to go to such lengths, personally speaking. 

I’m intrigued by your comment about not having to go to such lengths? Insider info or just a gut feeling? Thanks for the tip about Autoplay, is that something I will need to set from the app? Or will it work just by plugging in?

O
Userlevel 1

My answer to Patrick's mail:

 

“Dear Patrick

Thank you for your message, but unfortunately you didn't listen to us properly.

It's very simple:

  • We bought Sonos to listen to music, that’s the point, not to "communicate" with Alexa or whoever - there are other devices for those who want to.
  • We bought Sonos so we could group the players and run them in partymode (!). That's one of the significant added values that Sonos brings us. And we were (!) willing to pay a reasonable price for it.
  • But you're destroying that core value by making it impossible to run all our devices in partymode. In other words, by disabling a key feature, you're destroying part of our assets.

You see, Patrick, the central demand from most Sonos owners who are potentially financially damaged by you is that it will continue to be possible to run new and old equipment together in one partymode.  

This will certainly cost Sonos money and time, but it will be much less than the price Sonos will pay if you stick to your uninnovative policy.

So let Sonos' top developers create a sustainable solution that preserves the value of our previous investments, not destroys them! Then we will invest in you again.”

 

J
Userlevel 4
Badge +3

I am a bit curious - Sonos had other crises in the past, for instance the one around requiring registration, as illustrated by the following cut-out from Amazon.de:

How did Sonos manage to stear through this crisis - and the previous round of retiring products? What arguments or acts ended up calming down their customers again?

As for the registration, I myself got annoyed but then just registered; as I remember it with a kind if reasoning for myself that I was registered with so many other vendors (and also already with this one), so it wouldn’t make much of a difference for me. But others were unhappy - did they leave, did they end up accepting the new terms, or what happened?

No replies to this?

I had a feeling, and this could perhaps confirm it, that nothing happened - Sonos didn’t need to do anything to repair the damage. Instead, the customers just moved on after the first few days of complaining as if nothing had happened. And now the change is part of everyone’s life with their Sonos products.

So, now I wonder if the CEO, seemingly an intelligent person, is calculating with this behavior? Maybe he simply expected a couple of days of uproar, followed by business as usual - apart from the change introduced. Afterall, it is the easiest way forward for everybody involved - customers will just start replacing old equipment and soon be ready for the next attack that will also quickly be forgotten.

“This is a chance now to come up with a system that doesn’t cause massive planetary damage in exchange for disposable stuff,” Proctor said. (https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/3a8dpn/sonos-makes-it-clear-you-no-longer-own-the-things-you-buy)
C
Userlevel 1

Cant help but think that Sonos has just created its own “Kodak” moment and we all know how it turned out for them.

Below is a copy of the email that I sent in reply to CEO Patrick Spence.

 

 

Thank you for your communication re the future of the products that I have purchased from you.

 

Unfortunately, your email does little to inspire confidence in the longevity of my current system of sonos products. Having invested over £1000 in your products over the past 4 to 5 years, my expectation was for your  products to be fully supported for a period in excess of 10 years, and it now transpires this will not be the case.

 

You say “we are not forcing them into obsolescence” whilst this is patently what you are doing, and the more cynical amongst us might say that this is a ploy to drive sales of your new products. You further say you wil provide updates for “as long as possible”, a statement so blatantly indeterminate as to be meaningless.

 

I can only hope that those looking to purchase your new products take into consideration your current actions on your “legacy” products, re-consider their decision and opt for your competitors.

 

Your offer of 30% discount on replacement products in no way compensates for this loss of facility, nor does it inspire me to have confidence that any of your new products will have the life expectancy i would expect.

 

I can only say that your actions on this subject have been a PR disaster and a gift to your competitors. I further hope that your investors are currently reviewing the management and leadership of Sonos in the light of your decisions and actions.

 

I will NOT continue to be a customer of Sonos, and am considering raising a complaint via the UK trading standards authorities and/or action via the civil courts.

 

Amusingly the ancient scottish ballad of Sir Patrick Spence who led the scottish fleet to destruction in the 15th century, after ignoring all warnings, may prove a salutary lesson to you, or perhaps you view ill considered actions  to be an inherited family trait.

 

O forty miles of Aberdeen, 
'Tis fifty fathoms deep; 
And there lies good Sir Patrick Spens, 
With the Scots lords at his feet. 

 

 

A

We announced yesterday that some of our oldest Sonos products will be moving into a legacy mode in May of 2020. Our commitment is to support products with regular software updates for a minimum of five years after we stop selling them, and we have a track record of supporting products far longer. 

Here is some public information we’ve shared, gathered into one place to respond to some of your questions in one easy thread, so that people can find the correct information easily.

Beginning in May, software updates and new features from Sonos will only be delivered to systems with only modern products.

After May, systems that include legacy products will continue to work as before - but they will no longer receive software updates or new features. 

Sonos will work to maintain the existing experience and conduct bug fixes, but our efforts will ultimately be limited by the lack of memory and processing power of these legacy products.

We don’t expect any immediate impact to your experience, but access to services and overall functionality will eventually be disrupted, particularly as partners evolve their own services and features. 

 

Customers with both legacy and modern products have time to decide what option is best for them. You can continue to use your whole system in legacy mode - in this case, it will stop receiving updates and new features. 

You will also be able to separate your legacy products from your modern products, so that the modern products can still receive updates and new features, and legacy products can still be used separately. We’ll have more information on how to do this in May when you can take that action.

Another option available to all customers with legacy products is to take advantage of the Trade Up program, which allows you to upgrade older Sonos products to modern ones with a 30% discount. Trade Up will be open to customers at any time should they decide to upgrade. 

We recognize this is new for Sonos owners, just as it is for Sonos. We are committed to help you by making options available to you to support the best decision for your home.
 

If you have any further questions, please don’t hesitate with asking.

Update 2/22: A message from our CEO

We heard you. We did not get this right from the start. My apologies for that and I wanted to personally assure you of the path forward:

First, rest assured that come May, when we end new software updates for our legacy products, they will continue to work as they do today. We are not bricking them, we are not forcing them into obsolescence, and we are not taking anything away. Many of you have invested heavily in your Sonos systems, and we intend to honor that investment for as long as possible. While legacy Sonos products won’t get new software features, we pledge to keep them updated with bug fixes and security patches for as long as possible. If we run into something core to the experience that can’t be addressed, we’ll work to offer an alternative solution and let you know about any changes you’ll see in your experience.

Secondly, we heard you on the issue of legacy products and modern products not being able to coexist in your home. We are working on a way to split your system so that modern products work together and get the latest features, while legacy products work together and remain in their current state. We’re finalizing details on this plan and will share more in the coming weeks.

While we have a lot of great products and features in the pipeline, we want our customers to upgrade to our latest and greatest products when they’re excited by what the new products offer, not because they feel forced to do so. That’s the intent of the trade up program we launched for our loyal customers.

Thank you for being a Sonos customer. Thank you for taking the time to give us your feedback. I hope that you’ll forgive our misstep, and let us earn back your trust. Without you, Sonos wouldn’t exist and we’ll work harder than ever to earn your loyalty every single day.

If you have any further questions please don’t hesitate to contact us.

 

Patrick Spence
CEO, Sonos

I am no techie geek but surely if the main problem is that you claim the processors can not cope with additional upgrades there is a simple fix to please us long serving customers.   Offer to upgrade the processor or whatever needs upgrading by us the customer returning our products to be serviced with chip replacement.   This can be done at a nominal price and not at the extortionate trade up price.  I would be happy to do this and I am sure many others would be too.  The end result being less waste,  extra jobs created for service upgrades and value to the customer not to mention being environmentally conscious. Everyone's a winner.

A

@DK_Madsen

“Imagine buying 2 speakers ~4 years ago, paying over $1000 for them, only to be told they are obsolete now.”

Yup, that is me as well!  Feel like a right chump!

Now I have calmed down a bit, I know what my plan is.  I am not going to buy any more speakers until the May announcement.  Then I am going to watch these threads and wait and see how it all plays out..  Time will tell.

….and it wouldn’t be useful either to do so if they work only when being daily comfirmed by a Sonos server plus regularly updated.

They don’t - you can lock your system off completely from the internet and it will just carry on local streaming…. However, a lot of people like streaming via Spotify etc, so may prefer just to lock off the update process instead.

J
Userlevel 3
Badge +3

 

Just to say (briefly) the line in, when set to Autoplay, will always work without the Sonos App and without WiFi for that matter. Some folk take them from Home to Work and run them off their mobile with the usual 3.5mm cable. Just so you know that option remains open to you. Not that I think you will ever need to go to such lengths, personally speaking. 

I’m intrigued by your comment about not having to go to such lengths? Insider info or just a gut feeling? Thanks for the tip about Autoplay, is that something I will need to set from the app? Or will it work just by plugging in?

Just a short while ago I mentioned in a post that I occasionally deliver presentations to small groups of people and take one of my Play 5s to the venue where I connect it to my iPad using line-in from where I can play the appropriate music. The line-in facility on the Play 5s can be used to hook them up to any device with a headphone socket, TVs , MP3 players, Tablets etc. I’m assuming that this function will still work but would welcome clarification. This is what I meant when I said they won’t become totally obsolete as there will be a use to which they can be put - they’re not going to be totally useless.

T

I think I stopped reading around page 20, jumped here. Basically in same boat - lots of investment, expect "legacy" and new to work together. Be this in party mode or in the surround system I have using a Playbar and sub coupled with a now "legacy" connect:Amp powering my built in rear speakers. The ability to combine these products was part of the appeal, the beauty - it made it all simple.

 

There is ALWAYS a technical solution. People's fear of change and financials get in the way of executing and implementing. Don't leave all your long time loyal customers - the ones who've made your company successful for over a decade - out in the cold. 

P
Userlevel 5
Badge +1

Cant help but think that Sonos has just created its own “Kodak” moment and we all know how it turned out for them.

Below is a copy of the email that I sent in reply to CEO Patrick Spence.

 

 

Thank you for your communication re the future of the products that I have purchased from you.

 

Unfortunately, your email does little to inspire confidence in the longevity of my current system of sonos products. Having invested over £1000 in your products over the past 4 to 5 years, my expectation was for your  products to be fully supported for a period in excess of 10 years, and it now transpires this will not be the case.

 

You say “we are not forcing them into obsolescence” whilst this is patently what you are doing, and the more cynical amongst us might say that this is a ploy to drive sales of your new products. You further say you wil provide updates for “as long as possible”, a statement so blatantly indeterminate as to be meaningless.

 

I can only hope that those looking to purchase your new products take into consideration your current actions on your “legacy” products, re-consider their decision and opt for your competitors.

 

Your offer of 30% discount on replacement products in no way compensates for this loss of facility, nor does it inspire me to have confidence that any of your new products will have the life expectancy i would expect.

 

I can only say that your actions on this subject have been a PR disaster and a gift to your competitors. I further hope that your investors are currently reviewing the management and leadership of Sonos in the light of your decisions and actions.

 

I will NOT continue to be a customer of Sonos, and am considering raising a complaint via the UK trading standards authorities and/or action via the civil courts.

 

Amusingly the ancient scottish ballad of Sir Patrick Spence who led the scottish fleet to destruction in the 15th century, after ignoring all warnings, may prove a salutary lesson to you, or perhaps you view ill considered actions  to be an inherited family trait.

 

O forty miles of Aberdeen, 
'Tis fifty fathoms deep; 
And there lies good Sir Patrick Spens, 
With the Scots lords at his feet. 

 

 

Clogs to clogs in 3 generations as we say in Lancashire!

P
Userlevel 5
Badge +2

In addition to my many legacy components (2 Connect, 1 Connect Amp, 2 Play 5, 1 CR200), I purchased a pair of Play 1 from Costco in the last month because I thought my Play 3s were overkill in my 5.1 system (playbar and sub) and I could re-purpose the 3s in my guest rooms (thereby introducing more of my friends and family to Sonos). Given this new policy I see the writing on the wall for the Play 1s and Play 3s so no point in spending more money.

I will now, for the first time, try to take advantage of one of the benefits of a Costco membership, the no questions asked return process as I have disposed of the packaging. 

If asked why the return, rest assured that I will be explicit that it is solely as a result of this new policy.

P
Userlevel 3
Badge

So clearly I want a whole home system, not two separate systems. If I keep my system in legacy mode then how can I add other products. Answer....it doesn’t look as though I can and therefore Sonos  have forced me to either:

 

1. Never buy another Sonos product because I will not be able to add it to my legacy system. 

 

2. Pay 70% of the price of my legacy items to Sonos for the speakers I have already bought and then I have the option to buy more if I want .... in the hope Sonos make nothing else legacy. 

 

3. Run two systems, in which case I don’t see why I would not take the opportunity to invest in a new brand and use them as the basis for a new ecosystem and phase out the Sonos stuff. 

 

Option 2 is a non-starter,  I’m not stupid enough to trust Sonos again, so options 1 & 2 remain. Either way Sonos have cut me off as a repeat customer. 

 

Surely Sonos can’t be that daft? Can they?

Have I got this right? Or am I mistaken?

H
Userlevel 2

My letter (very repetitive to what others have said)

Mr. Spence,
I, along with many other customers were very early adopters of your products. It took me many years to build my current system (10 items) and I never minded paying the premium price because I felt the quality justified the price. I have also been a brand ambassador since the beginning talking these things up to friends and family and even giving them as gifts.

I found out about these changes from a sales associate at Best Buy as I was putting 2 of the new Moves into my buggy that I was adding to my collection. he told me I might want to rethink that and explained the changes. I immediately put them back on the shelf after confirming what he told me via a google search.

I feel like I’ve been completely screwed over. Even after your apology letter, it’s clear you don’t care about the customers who helped to build your brand and my trust for your company is gone. I frankly don’t care whether you support the legacy products or not as I plan to sell off my speakers on Craigslist in protest.

As others have said, years from now, this will be a business case study in how management missteps can quickly destroy a great brand and possibly a company. I hope you are proud.

Sent from my iPad

 

 

So after sending this, I shockingly received this reply from Patrick. I believe they have heard us. I will try to calm down and take a couple of weeks to see what happens.

 

From: Patrick Spence <patrick.spence@sonos.com>

To:xxxxxx

 

Jan 24 at 11:50 PM

 

Mr. Hedrick,

 

Thanks for being an early adopter. My apologies for the mistake here, and I am not proud. I'm sorry that didn't come across in my email.

 

I understand & respect your decision. Thank you for having been a customer & sorry for letting you down.

 

Sincerely,

Patrick

 

A

 

Where did you buy a gen 1 Play:5 two years after Sonos discontinued sales?

I bought a new Play 5 Gen1 in Swaffham about six months ago…. As far as I’m aware, they still have another for sale…. 

L
Userlevel 4
Badge +3

Just a short while ago I mentioned in a post that I occasionally deliver presentations to small groups of people and take one of my Play 5s to the venue where I connect it to my iPad using line-in from where I can play the appropriate music. The line-in facility on the Play 5s can be used to hook them up to any device with a headphone socket, TVs , MP3 players, Tablets etc. I’m assuming that this function will still work but would welcome clarification. This is what I meant when I said they won’t become totally obsolete as there will be a use to which they can be put - they’re not going to be totally useless.

When I moved house last year, I had a two week wait for broadband to be installed. I couldn’t even set up the Sonos without a working Internet connection. Setup in the early years was an entirely off-line process. They’ve moved a lot of local functionality into the cloud and now they’re reluctant to support it.

T
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In the UK 30% isn’t actually 30%. As far as I understand we have to purchase from Sonos.com which is nearly always much dearer than buying from other respected retailers. If we have 30% please let us purchase from cheaper sellers and get the FULL 30% off. 

A

 

 

So, now I wonder if the CEO, seemingly an intelligent person, is calculating with this behavior? Maybe he simply expected a couple of days of uproar, followed by business as usual - apart from the change introduced. Afterall, it is the easiest way forward for everybody involved - customers will just start replacing old equipment and soon be ready for the next attack that will also quickly be forgotten.

Yes, that’s exactly what they’re hoping...

U
Userlevel 6
Badge +4

So after sending this, I shockingly received this reply from Patrick. I believe they have heard us. I will try to calm down and take a couple of weeks to see what happens.

 

From: Patrick Spence <patrick.spence@sonos.com>

To:xxxxxx

 

Jan 24 at 11:50 PM

 

Mr. Hedrick,

 

Thanks for being an early adopter. My apologies for the mistake here, and I am not proud. I'm sorry that didn't come across in my email.

 

I understand & respect your decision. Thank you for having been a customer & sorry for letting you down.

 

Sincerely,

Patrick

 

I’m not clear on what’s made you feel better about the situation in that message (though I agree it’s surprising that you got a personal reply at all)? All he’s said is sorry (again) and that he can see why you didn’t buy more units. Nothing that suggests a change of course, or even that they’re trying to find one.

It almost literally says ‘it sucks to be you’...

 

 

R
Userlevel 4
Badge

I am a bit curious - Sonos had other crises in the past, for instance the one around requiring registration, as illustrated by the following cut-out from Amazon.de:

How did Sonos manage to stear through this crisis - and the previous round of retiring products? What arguments or acts ended up calming down their customers again?

As for the registration, I myself got annoyed but then just registered; as I remember it with a kind if reasoning for myself that I was registered with so many other vendors (and also already with this one), so it wouldn’t make much of a difference for me. But others were unhappy - did they leave, did they end up accepting the new terms, or what happened?

No replies to this?

I had a feeling, and this could perhaps confirm it, that nothing happened - Sonos didn’t need to do anything to repair the damage. Instead, the customers just moved on after the first few days of complaining as if nothing had happened. And now the change is part of everyone’s life with their Sonos products.

So, now I wonder if the CEO, seemingly an intelligent person, is calculating with this behavior? Maybe he simply expected a couple of days of uproar, followed by business as usual - apart from the change introduced. Afterall, it is the easiest way forward for everybody involved - customers will just start replacing old equipment and soon be ready for the next attack that will also quickly be forgotten.

This is probably not far from the truth. I’ve got 5 amps going legacy. I’ve got more amps not going legacy as well as a beam. I looked around. The competitor systems make no promises on support or longevity of the system or components. So quite likely this will just happen again if I jump ship. Jumping ship can only really be done all or nothing. Staying put and slowing upgrading can be done as and when I can afford to on a component by component basis. So most likely I’ll be staying on Sonos. Sure I’ll be a bit disgruntled but most likely after May my system will work as it does now for months or even years

S
Userlevel 5
Badge +3

So after sending this, I shockingly received this reply from Patrick. I believe they have heard us. I will try to calm down and take a couple of weeks to see what happens.

 

From: Patrick Spence <patrick.spence@sonos.com>

To:xxxxxx

 

Jan 24 at 11:50 PM

 

Mr. Hedrick,

 

Thanks for being an early adopter. My apologies for the mistake here, and I am not proud. I'm sorry that didn't come across in my email.

 

I understand & respect your decision. Thank you for having been a customer & sorry for letting you down.

 

Sincerely,

Patrick

 

I’m not clear on what’s made you feel better about the situation in that message (though I agree it’s surprising that you got a personal reply at all)? All he’s said is sorry (again) and that he can see why you didn’t buy more units. Nothing that suggests a change of course, or even that they’re trying to find one.

It almost literally says ‘it sucks to be you’...

That’s exactly how I read it too, maybe the recipient got so star struck about receiving a reply that the message didn’t fully sink in 

 

 

S
Userlevel 3
Badge

After calming down marginally I think that Sonos have seriously undermined their whole value proposition here.  Ultimately we all get technical obsolescence, Sonos can’t bend the rules of technical progress and an IOT device will at some point be bypassed by new standards, new technical requirements, etc.  But the way Sonos should deal with that is by making new features only available to the devices that can support them, call that out clearly to customers so we all have an opportunity to buy new devices if we think the new features warrant it.  But what they can’t do is undermine the whole purpose of a Sonos eco system by not being able to support new features.  And the reason I suspect most of us got Sonos was the seemless integration across the devices.

 

I think that’s been the serious miss here.  What Sonos have done is shine a massive spotlight on the fact that they can’t guarantee that their USP will always been supported.  And if that’s the case then why on earth would you buy a Sonos system, get a Bluetooth speaker.

 

Sonos need to resolve and declare - 

  1. All Sonos systems will work as an integrated solution for the foreseeable future
  2. New features will start to not be available for old devices because it’s just not possible.  When this happens those new features won’t be available to the older devices but the legacy feature set will remain untouched

If they can’t resolve the continued existence of the original Sonos USP then the only debate is how long Sonos will take to die.

K
Userlevel 6
Badge +3

The fact that MusicCast is just a tiny fraction of Yamaha’s business portfolio only makes it easier for Yamaha to segment older generations of equipment (as they’ve already done and just like Sonos is doing now) or to abandon MusicCast altogether if its no longer profitable. Anyone who thinks Yamaha will never do to them what Sonos is doing now isn’t paying attention. 

True, hence why I will never invest in these type of systems as I have done with sonos to the same extent, I'm not being held to ransom again. happy to right off £500 every five years as opposed to £4000 every five years.


I agree, fool me once…

Oh and this has got to sting, but ties into what the future might bring:

https://www.zdnet.com/article/so-long-sonos-meet-the-open-source-audio-system-that-will-never-die/

I should have never invested in powered speakers, just amps with passive speakers so at least those would have a life even after some profiteering executive pulls the plug prematurely on my beautifully deigned and still-working premium audio system. 

Expensive lessons learned.

B

The issue is that like a great number of users, my system is a mix of legacy and ‘modern’ products.  Many rooms are ‘modern’ speakers and woofers that are paired in rooms with what you are now calling ‘legacy’ amps.  So, this comment, “We are working on a way to split your system so that modern products work together and get the latest features, while legacy products work together and remain in their current state.”  is ESSENTIAL.  The concept of ‘SPLITTING’ is a poor choice of words.  They must CO-EXIST and be commonly manageable from the same user experience and control  They are essentially one system, so if you SPLIT them, then you are essentially breaking the whole system.  

Honestly, this may just trigger me to scrap Sonos and go buy Denon products or similar that are of superior sound quality, at a lesser price.  The experience would be the same as what you are doing with the end-of-life offer.  I will simply replace my Sonos over time. 

The way this has been handled, still has already made me STOP recommending your products and advising my friends to seek and choose a different product set. 

I was days away from adding on 3 more components.  Well that has stopped and I am actively reconsidering the entire strategy.  As a software product person, I do understand that this can be complex. However, scrapping and replacing parts of the system that work together with a bill for literally over $1500 in my case is completely unacceptable. 

Additionally, asking users to simply ‘scrap’ perfectly good gear.  Well that’s another non-starter and total environmental waste.  I highly recommend you create a better upgrade offer.  30% is simply lame.  Also, you need to allow users to continue using the old gear at the very least.  No-one is going to feel good about junking a perfectly functional piece of equipment.  I have 3 amps covering 3 parts of the house paired with other ‘modern’ speakers and woofers.  Wow what a disaster this could be if I have a SPLIT user experiences.  May as well be splitting rooms in half.  This seems to be very poorly though through by your product management and leadership.  

NEXT - This comment really caught my attention, “While we have a lot of great products and features in the pipeline, we want our customers to upgrade to our latest and greatest products when they’re excited by what the new products offer, not because they feel forced to do so. That’s the intent of the trade up program we launched for our loyal customers.”  

 

THERE IS NOTHING THAT has been presented or that WE CAN SEE THAT IS NEW OR EXCITING.  Nothing is exciting about an Amp, and until you can show me a compelling reason that the new one is so amazing that I really want to upgrade you have A LOT OF WORK LEFT TO DO to sell that concept.  I have been waiting to see if you were even considering a multiple room amp.  I have three lined-up together.  How about at the very least a two zone, three or ideally four zone amp.  hmm who has that already, oh ya.  Denon. . . again there is completion so get it together.

S
Userlevel 5
Badge +3

I am a bit curious - Sonos had other crises in the past, for instance the one around requiring registration, as illustrated by the following cut-out from Amazon.de:

How did Sonos manage to stear through this crisis - and the previous round of retiring products? What arguments or acts ended up calming down their customers again?

As for the registration, I myself got annoyed but then just registered; as I remember it with a kind if reasoning for myself that I was registered with so many other vendors (and also already with this one), so it wouldn’t make much of a difference for me. But others were unhappy - did they leave, did they end up accepting the new terms, or what happened?

No replies to this?

I had a feeling, and this could perhaps confirm it, that nothing happened - Sonos didn’t need to do anything to repair the damage. Instead, the customers just moved on after the first few days of complaining as if nothing had happened. And now the change is part of everyone’s life with their Sonos products.

So, now I wonder if the CEO, seemingly an intelligent person, is calculating with this behavior? Maybe he simply expected a couple of days of uproar, followed by business as usual - apart from the change introduced. Afterall, it is the easiest way forward for everybody involved - customers will just start replacing old equipment and soon be ready for the next attack that will also quickly be forgotten.

This is probably not far from the truth. I’ve got 5 amps going legacy. I’ve got more amps not going legacy as well as a beam. I looked around. The competitor systems make no promises on support or longevity of the system or components. So quite likely this will just happen again if I jump ship. Jumping ship can only really be done all or nothing. Staying put and slowing upgrading can be done as and when I can afford to on a component by component basis. So most likely I’ll be staying on Sonos. Sure I’ll be a bit disgruntled but most likely after May my system will work as it does now for months or even years

I’m currently looking at the bowers & Wilkins formation stuff specifically the wedge to replace my gen 1 play 5, mainly because it also ties in with Roon if needed which seems to be more widely supported across many brands £120 a year or lifetime for £500. I had the very first Zeppelin which when the iPod I used on it died became pretty useless I contacted B&W asking if I could pay to have it converted to a lightening port, they replied unfortunately it wasn’t possible but here’s 75% off a new version which I took up, now that’s customer service no fault of theirs but they took care of me.
I’m not doing anything hasty yet and will see how things pan out, the soundbar I purchased yesterday wasn’t the originally intended beam, sub and ones surround system after this weeks debacle I went with a Yamaha for now which is working lovely for tv and movies. If things go the way I think all my Sonos will be eventually replaced with B&W stuff I think, I had a quick listen to some of it yesterday and it is superb, quite pricey but hopefully along with Roon pretty future proof and past experience of B&W support has been excellent in fact if Sonos had come out and explained things better and offered a 75% discount right off the bat I reckon many would have still griped but accepted it rather than the approach they took.  

A
Userlevel 3

Wow what an absolute drop of the ball. From the opening email, to Ryan's bumbling technical replies.........then the cherry on the top Paddys heart felt letter!!! This cleared everything up IMO, I suggest everyone reads it properly..

 

Patrick Spence, you are dense!

You've killed Sonos!

dirty bast@#d

M
Userlevel 4
Badge +1

Just a short while ago I mentioned in a post that I occasionally deliver presentations to small groups of people and take one of my Play 5s to the venue where I connect it to my iPad using line-in from where I can play the appropriate music. The line-in facility on the Play 5s can be used to hook them up to any device with a headphone socket, TVs , MP3 players, Tablets etc. I’m assuming that this function will still work but would welcome clarification. This is what I meant when I said they won’t become totally obsolete as there will be a use to which they can be put - they’re not going to be totally useless.

When I moved house last year, I had a two week wait for broadband to be installed. I couldn’t even set up the Sonos without a working Internet connection. Setup in the early years was an entirely off-line process. They’ve moved a lot of local functionality into the cloud and now they’re reluctant to support it.

Very surprised to hear this! I always assumed with a LAN and a local file share of mp3s we would be golden. New router/WiFi access point? Or did you bring the old one with you?

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