What a customer hostile way to approach this. The only significant features the new speakers offer are voice control via Amazon or Google (no way I want open mics to those two in my house), and AirPlay 2. Sonos main strength was it brought all music services into one interface and allowed us to play music from a shared console rather than exclusively from one device (key for families). Without that, there’s no benefit over AirPlay 2 or Chromecast. Their speakers sound great too, but that’s not a differentiator.
There’s no reason Sonos can’t release an optional dedicated device to offload the compute from the legacy devices and eliminate this problem. It’s honestly surprising that they haven’t done this already. Decouple the compute required for modern services from the speakers themselves. This dedicated device would store your account info, wifi connection, music services, music library, etc, and provide the processing power for modern services. It’d only be required if you have legacy devices in your Sonos system.
How long before Bose and other competitors get a stiff of this and start offering cheap trade in deals? I certainly would be looking at it if I was their marketing manager.
This is my first post & last post - I never even realised there was a forum until I became so irate today at today’s disregard for customers that I found this thread!!
I was about to buy a new Beam for the TV but now won’t as clearly SONOS are putting in place a system which requires regular & costly renewal.
I bought a Play 5 five years ago and now SONOS want me to upgrade it - total joke.
I pity those who have invested so heavily into SONOS and who are simply having support withdrawn.
I will attempt to seek a refund from the shop I purchased my Play 5 from (Richer Sounds) under Sale of Goods Act - I imagine the response but this will at least make them aware. I assume they are already. As so many others I was informed this was a system that did not require renewal.
Off to look at Bluetooth systems - BOSE first on the list.
Very sad.
OK, here is my prediction. One of two things will happen here -
either Sonos will see the potential liability and get smart on the software side
or
there is going to be a class action lawsuit here. There have to be over a million users with an average of $500 invested? Some law firm will take that one forward and once it gets traction they will see that software development is not nearly as expensive as legal fees.
This really SUCKS. Let’s hope a new thread starts with a class action lawsuit against SONOS.
I'm $3000 in for Sonos "legacy" products. If there's no course correction for all of us who supported and promoted your company, I hope you go bankrupt.
In short, I’m fine with a frozen system. I just don’t want a bricked system.
And when, for example Spotify (replace with online music system you use) change their system that requires SONOS to update their software to keep things working….you’re stuffed.
I just purchased a pair of play 1 speakers from Costco as a kit in dec 2019. Now I see that my play 5 gen 1’s are being dropped from the system. How long before these play 1 speakers are dropped? Are these new play 1’s more advanced than the play 1’s that I bought 8 years ago? And what about my play 3’s, how long will those be supported? And lastly, my whole system is initiated through a bridge connected to a router far away from my other components. Once the bridge and plays 5’s are removed, how do I connect my newer and still functioned speakers to my router?
I think this is outrageous.
I am an early adopter of your product and company - have seen it grow from a few home grown distributors to being in John Lewis/Dixons etc. I spent a lot of money on products and systems, have harped on for years to anyone who would listen to how good Sonos is and they duly purchased. Now, you are peanalising those who supported you in the early years. Thats truly disgraceful. There was no mention of you not supporting products when we purchased them. Shame on you Sonos.
Totally agree... Just because my car hasn't got all of today's advanced technology means i have to dump it..
Is Sonos willing to tell me when they are going to obsolete my Play 3’s and Play 1’s? This is B.S. I championed this company to everyone who would listen but those days are over. I’m beyond pissed. After reading some of the posts, I have no confidence that Sonos will leave our legacy system alone if that’s what we choose to stay with. I’m sure eventually it won’t work at all and then what?
This is from an article today: “Sonos told CNBC in May it will launch a way for customers to segment the older products into a separate speaker group, which won’t receive updates, while another group of newer products will continue to get new software.”
If this is true, it will soften the blow for someone like me who owns just one gen 1Play:5, but it’s still disappointing. What will happen when my Play:3’s and 1’s eventually reach their end of life (from a software upgrade point of view—my Play:5 sounds just as good today as it did the day I inboxed it)? Anyway, hoping Sonos can find a way to breathe more life into older hardware.
I think a major problem is that SONOS needs to better explain the specifics of the impact, the reasons for the impact on legacy systems, and the options going forward from here.
(1) What I am hearing is that they need to update the SONOS control app on the smart phone. And that changes to the app will require some matching changes to the software on the SONOS devices. And that they won’t make those needed matching changes to the legacy devices. (the functional impact is discussed later)
Is that a correct summary?
(a) It is not clear if the changes are not technically possible (lack of memory?) or if SONOS just don’t want to make that investment. It would be good to hear an answer to that.
(b) why is it not possible for the app to be programmed with a compatibility mode to work with legacy devices just as it does prior to the May 2020 cutoff?
(2) If I update a control app after May2020, what exactly is the impact on that app working with the legacy devices? Is there some guide as to what functionality might be lost? For example, perhaps only certain new streaming services may not be available, though streaming from my NAS based music collection would be OK.
Or it may be that even basic communication between unmatched app and devices would be lost (turning the legacy devices into expensive bricks)?
(3) If we do not update our SONOS smartphone/tablet control app after the May2020 cutoff, then the app will continue to work with our devices indefinitely after that point, though any newly discovered bugs will not be fixed. This can be accomplished by turning off the “Update Automatically” setting and not manually approving any app updates.
Is that a correct summary?
(4) The catch is that without new software updates, our frozen control app would no longer be able to support the newer devices, even with old functionality? SONOS statements imply that there is likely more lost than just new functionality (which many of us do not care about), but could impact current functionality.
Is that correct?
Would the frozen legacy control app be able to work with the newer “modern” SONOS devices, limited to old functionality? Would it matter whether the “modern” devices have newer software updates? It would be good to have a clear answer on that.
(5) Further, there is a possibility that SONOS will provide for download of the pre-May2020 control application for use on any new smart device, should I change smart phone or tablet in the future.(or need to delete/reload in a recovery situation).
Is that correct, and when would we see that as an available download?
(6) Is it possible to use two different smart devices, one with the frozen legacy app and one with the current supported app. In that case, I should be able to control and update “modern” SONOS devices from one while using the legacy app to control, at least, the legacy devices and perhaps even all my SONOS devices (with old function scope)?
(7) SONOS is saying all of this is driven by the major music streaming servers changing their interfaces. It is not clear if they are talking about control interfaces or about streaming protocols.
If the impact of the streaming servers changes is a control interface used only by the SONOS control app, than SONOS should be able to isolate that impact to the control app and still maintain backwards compatibility with the SONOS devices. Correct? Or does the SONOS device need to work with that same changed streaming service control interface?
If the impact is directly to the software in the SONOS network which is doing the streaming, then only that streaming device needs to be modern. The streaming SONOS device should be able to forward that music content to the other SONOS players/speakers using the old protocols. All of my devices have te ability to stream from the server, but I gather for any particular music stream, only one handles that streaming and passes the content to the rest (in a synchronized fashion).
This is an important point since, if true, you would only need to ensure that there is one “modern” SONOS device, in the network, for each different streaming source, in order to handle any streaming interface issues. I only use one source at a time, so I would only need one “modern” device. (I am making some educated guesses about the overall design of the SONOS network).
Is there validity to what I am saying?
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The customers just need to better understanding of the situation and what alternate paths we have going forward.
Doing so can be a big win for both SONOS and their customers
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@Michael Arones, thanks for taking the time to write up such detailed questions. Several of these are questions that will be answered later this year when we have more to share. For people who keep their legacy devices and have a fully legacy system, or maybe mixed with modern, we don’t expect any immediate impact from ending the software updates. These systems will continue to work as they do today, or in May, but will not receive future updates. As mentioned before, changes that are made to technology in the future, particularly by music service and voice partners, can cause access to those services or features to be disrupted. This would be mostly in connection protocol on the back end, not just visual changes in their apps.
Sonos used to be known for its software expertise, and this problem could be solved by developing software that could identify each specific piece of Sonos equipment in a home system and then apply a “function profile” to each unit based on the unit’s hardware and memory capacity. As new services or features are developed by Sonos, each user could specify how “modern” they want their system to run. New features could be limited to the hardware that is capable of handling them while the entire system could continue to run at a “basic” level as it does currently. (This would be much like running in “compatibility mode” for word processing software that must work across several computer systems.)
Although development of this type of software might be challenging, I am certain it would be less costly to the company than the loss of current and future customers that will follow if Sonos’ current plans are implemented.
Sonos is able to tell me which Sonos equipment in my system will not be updated after May, so it should be possible to select the equipment that needs to run different software if the user wants to run the system in compatibility mode. The solution to this problem is not in sales/marketing, it’s in software development. So it’s time for Sonos to get to work on a real solution that keeps its customer base happy and keeps the company alive.
With the prices you charge nobody expects the product to be obsolete after five years. With cheap junk, yes, but you charge Mercedes Benz prices. Nobody expects to have to junk their Mercedes after five years. It may not be brand new after five years, but still a solid workhorse. This is outrageous.
As a long time supporter and advocate of Sonos, I'm extremely frustrated, angry, and overall disappointed.
With the recent announcement I understand that changes to my system won’t be immediate, but to continue usage of my multiple devices in multiple zones I'll be requires to spend upwards of $500+ dollars to just use the products I spent a shit load of money on the first go around? Come on!
Your products are not cheap by any means, and asking us to replace perfectly fine devices with new ones at virtually the same amount is a slap in the face to your loyal customer. 30% off saves us virtually nothing and Sonos generates new revenue while the customer is held holding the responsibility? Not to mention the sheer amount of waste all of these old products are going to create when everyone dumps these into their trash cans vs. a legit recycling program where Sonos does something with the hardware that’s going to become obsolete.
What this say is more of my products wont work at some mysterious time and I’ll be left holding the bag again.
A responsible company would have thought through this before blasting their customers who from your
forums seems to be fiercely loyal.
Like the rest of you, I received the EOL and upgrade notification. I have a Play5 that is impacted, and was told I could trade it in for 30% off of a Move? WTF? Not even a 1-to-1 swap from a component perspective.
So what system is everyone changing to? I think I'm done with Sonos.
Like the rest of you, I received the EOL and upgrade notification. I have a Play5 that is impacted, and was told I could trade it in for 30% off of a Move? WTF? Not even a 1-to-1 swap from a component perspective.
So what system is everyone changing to? I think I'm done with Sonos.
@Barry McCockinner, the 30% trade up credit can be used on any Sonos player and even some bundles. So you can use it on the Play:5 gen2 if you’d like.
If Sonos do not work out a solution to allow my various “legacy” Sonos products to work in harmony with my non-legacy products I will sell all my products and never buy another Sonos product again.
I feel totally betrayed. I am happy with the way they work currently and have no desire for additional features or support of streaming services as I have my entire CD collection on a NAS.
I have to say I am disappointed as well. I have 9 (8+1 spare) connect amps that are all legacy (oldest about 3 years). Now I have to buy 9 new amps at about ($649x0.7) for $4088? There are a lot of other options now. I cannot see anything but bad publicity for Sonos and another lesson on why one needs to avoid vendor lock when making purchases.
If they leased their music players I’m sure they would have found a wast to keep them working vice recycling perfectly good speakers and amps and wireless receivers
i thought Sonos had its own network to stream the music. Since you can pair one speaker with another isn’t only the source speaker actually doing any processing. Seams like a better approach would be to sell a new processor that would pair with the older component and tackle the memory/cpu shortfalls.
If Sonos do not work out a solution to allow my various “legacy” Sonos products to work in harmony with my non-legacy products I will sell all my products and never buy another Sonos product again.
How will you sell them ? Who would buy “legacy” Sonos products now ?
Resale value has just cratered..
Ok so knowing this is how Sonos is gonna roll, I’m selling all my Sonos equipment even though it’s all modern hardware. This will happen to my stuff one day not to far off and it will make it all worthless in one swoop.
I want nothing to do with any company that works like this. Especially as we also know Sonos have developed a software Kill switch that will permanently disable any older products when you trade in. What’s to stop them making this widespread?
This is from an article today: “Sonos told CNBC in May it will launch a way for customers to segment the older products into a separate speaker group, which won’t receive updates, while another group of newer products will continue to get new software.”
If this is true, it will soften the blow for someone like me who owns just one gen 1Play:5, but it’s still disappointing. What will happen when my Play:3’s and 1’s eventually reach their end of life (from a software upgrade point of view—my Play:5 sounds just as good today as it did the day I inboxed it)? Anyway, hoping Sonos can find a way to breathe more life into older hardware.
@V1965, this is true. Though speaker group may be a little vague. That means having a Sonos Legacy system and a Sonos Modern system, separate systems but both running, and capable of being controlled by the devices in your home.
Adding more features and not being able to use them is one thing.
However, let’s hope no current features are removed, especially streaming services.
Don’t want to hear come May “We are changing the way we integrate Tidal/Soundcloud/Qobuz and you will only be able to use this with the latest software version. This means if you have legacy products you will have to upgrade to new kit.”
If Tidal/Soundcloud/Qobuz changes their interface codec/security/etc. and your Sonos firmware is frozen at the old version, it means Tidal/Soundcloud/Qobuz will cease working. Nothing can be done about that.
If this is truly the case then sonos need to stop supporting those streaming services...
Curiously enough, the same day as this announcement from Sonos arrived in my inbox, I got the following email from Toyota.
END OF CAR SUPPORT
Dear Customer
In May 2020, Toyota will cease supporting your 2015 Toyota Corolla. While you will continue to be able to drive your car, we regret that your car may start to slow down and will not be able to be driven on new or upgraded roads and may not accept modern fuels. Even if you have more up to date cars in your family, as your cars all sit on the same driveway, these cars also will be unable to be driven on newer roads.
Yours
Toyota Support
That’s how ridiculous this is.
