sonos era 100 and move keep dropping out of everything group

@harry smith 

So if you are not using SonosNet with a lan cabled speaker and everything is done by your home network wifi and also nothing else changed besides the router, I would indeed recommend a test of switching the router to wifi 5. 

Is there just the router or also other network hardware of a mesh system or something like that? Maybe that hardware isn‘t compatible with wifi 6 and and causes problems with the wifi 6 ready Sonos products.

The rest of your speakers isn’t wifi 6 ready, so there propably are no problems.  

@harry smith,
It may help to know the make/model of router here and what WiFi channels/channel-widths are in use for the 2.4Ghz and 5Ghz bands.

The 6Ghz band is not in use by Sonos, but it would be helpful to know if the mobile controller device is perhaps using that band. 

Also what controller device is it - make/model/OS?

You mention that the Sonos device connections are excellent - is that from their SNR levels within the Sonos App, as outlined HERE? If so, what are the levels for the devices that go missing?

When the speakers do go missing, are they just missing from the App, or have they dropped off the network - can you still ping their IP addresses, or see them with addresses assigned by your routers DHCP server? Have you thought of perhaps fixing the Sonos device IP addresses in your new routers DHCP reservation table?

Are there any other wireless access points, extenders, power-line adapters, switches (managed, or unmanaged) on the new network too? 

Is the router using automatic band steering, or do you have the bands separated by different SSID’s. Is there any QoS, or Airtime Fairness operating on the network in your router setup?

Have you removed the old routers WiFi SSID from your Sonos devices (that’s assuming you are now using a different set of WiFi network credentials?)

Are any Sonos devices in close proximity to your router, or other wireless devices (closer than say 1 metre?). The devices that go missing - have you yet tried them in a different location and nearer to the main router (even on a temporary basis) to see if that perhaps changes anything?

Hi   Ken_Griffiths, Schlumpf and Corry P

Sorry for not replying earlier. It takes me a long time to test setups.

My new router is a Vodafone Ultrahub with Wi-Fi 6E https://www.vodafone.com/news/products/introducing-ultra-hub-wifi-6e

There is one hub and one Super WiFi 6E Booster mesh extender. In the default setup there is one wi-fi network called Vodafone8F2127. When Sonos devices are connected to this the network the Sonos Era 100 and the Sonos Move indicate they are connected to the Vodafone8F2127 network and if you drill down it reports the connection strength etc.

Sonos Era 100 in default setup pictured above. Sonos Move is similar.

Meanwhile, the two Sonos Amps, two Sonos Fives and Sonos Port do not indicate the wi-fi network or connection strength etc.

Sonos  Amp in default setup pictured above. Sonos Five and Sonos Port are similar.

There is an option in the Router settings to switch to 'compatibility mode for older devices’. If I turn on compatibility mode the I see two wi-fi networks: Vodafone8F2127 and Vodafone8F2127_premium. The 6GHz band only exists on Vodafone8F2127_premium. All my devises connect to Vodafone8F2127. In this mode all Sonos devices report connection to Vodafone8F2127 and indicate a signal strength

Sonos Era 100 in compatibility mode pictured above. Sonos Move is similar.
 

Sonos  Amp in compatibility mode pictured above. Network connectivity is now shown. Sonos Five and Sonos Port are similar.

In compatibility mode the signal strengths reported are

Amp Bathroom = Excellent connection
Amp Garden = Good connection
Five Kitchen = Good connection
Five Main bedroom = Excellent connection
Move = Excellent connection
Port = Excellent connection

Using default connection or compatibility mode seems to make no noticeable difference to the performance of Sonos audio. I tried turning off the wi-fi extender unit for a few days. This also made no noticeable difference to the performance of Sonos. Whichever network setup I use, and regardless of the presence of the wi-fi extender, the Sonos Era 100 and Sonos Move always get dropped from the Everywhere Group after music has stopped playing for a while.

At the moment the extender is turned off. The wi-fi status is

Main Wi-Fi 2.4 GHz
Channel 9
Bandwidth 130.0 Mbps
Max BW 573.5 Mbps
Minimum Sync Speed 130.0 Mbps

Main Wi-Fi 5 GHz
Channel 100
Bandwidth 130.0 Mbps
Max BW 4.8 Gbps
Minimum Sync Speed 130.0 Mbps

Main Wi-Fi 6 GHz
Channel 69
Bandwidth 4.8 Gbps
Max BW 4.8 Gbps
Minimum Sync Speed 4.8 Gbps

The controllers I use are Android version 13 and three IOS devices recently updated to 17.3 but the update did not change the behaviour of Sonos.

The network strength I got from the description in https://support.sonos.com/en-us/article/understanding-the-network-details-section-in-the-sonos-app and is pictured previously above. But the behaviour described by Sonos : Channel, BSSID, SNR is only seen in the Sonos Move and the Sonos Era 100 unless I select compatibility mode on the router. This is not described in the Sonos help.

The Sonos devices do not drop from the network, they just stop being part of the Everywhere group. I have to regroup for them to play. Each morning, and any time I leave the house for a couple of hours or otherwise have the system off for a couple of hours. I have been with a Sonos system since 2010 and nearly always use it in Everywhere group mode.

I have a power-line adapters which has been connected to the Sonos Port. I have used the power-line adapter for about 10 years. However, I tried using the Sonos Port on wi-fi only and it behaved like a Sonos Five or Sonos Amp.

I am not aware of and QoS, or Airtime Fairness operating on the network.

I have not knowingly removed old routers WiFi SSID from your Sonos devices. Do you mean do a Factory reset on all devices? I did factory reset a Sonos Sub but only to get it connected to a Sonos Amp on the new network. This whole process is taking a lot of effort for a system that should be easy to use.

The Sonos Era 100 is 1 metre from the router. I moved it to five metres away. Unfortunately, there was no change in performance. I went out for a couple of hours and when I got back the Sonos Era 100 and the Sonos Move had again disconnected from the Everywhere group.

To conclude, the Sonos Era 100 and the Sonos Move are the only devices that report network performance as described by Sonos in all the four configurations of Hub only, Hub + Boost, Hub only in compatibility mode, Hub + Boost in compatibility mode. They also report an excellent connection and in play mode have recently worked flawlessly. The other devices do not always report network performance as described by Sonos in all the four configurations or have excellent connection when reported. However, they have also recently worked flawlessly in play mode. The other devices always remain in the Everywhere Group and never get dropped. The Sonos Era 100 and the Sonos Move consistently and reliably drop out of the Everywhere Group after playback has stopped for a while.

Thanks for your help

It apoears your system is in part using SonosNet - which the Era and Move devices do not use (by design) you have a player wired to a powerline adapter too - which are not supported by the Sonos System Requirements. 

My first suggestion is to try this… run all on your WiFi mesh network by not wiring any devices to the network or powerline adapter - so remove your Ethernet connections to Sonos products. First try things with your Vodafone mesh extender Hub powered off and if that works, then later try things with the mesh extender ‘on’ and included in your network setup. 

Note when you disconnect any wired devices, give them 5 minutes to appear back in your Sonos App. If they do not appear then try power-cycling them. All should then all show a network connection in your App to Vodafone8F2127, but then wait a further 20-30 minutes and then test if the ‘Everywhere’ group then works for you.

Ken_Griffiths you are correct. Removing the ethernet cable from the Sonos Port, turning it on, and waiting a while resulted in the Everywhere group being stable like it used to be before the router upgrade. The Sonos Port is mostly kept powered off and I had it with the ‘Enable Wi-Fi’ option ticked on. Even if the Sonos Port is powered off the Sonos Era 100 and Sonos Move will be dropped from the Everywhere group. I can reproduce the behaviour consistently. Only when the ethernet cable was removed and after powering on the Sonos Port did the system become stable. So much for the advantages of wired over wifi. As I said, I never had this issue with the previous router. I have used the Port and before that the Sonos Connect for many years over ethernet through a powerline adapter. So I will have to blame the router and progress.