@sjw 

Is the above post the one you read? I don’t know to correct my error any better than what is written. That said where are you still confused? I’d like to further clear up any confusion for you if I may.

No, it’s the original one I questioned - that both I and @melvimbe have re-quoted that still says “ The Era 300’s do not perform as well with stereo because the front facing driver only activates when it senses Dolby Atmos content.”  In the one above you say you corrected it in the original post yet I still see the original post saying the same thing I’ve just quoted.

We’re just going around in circles with you saying you’ve corrected the original post yet I still see it saying the wrong thing.  I don’t know what more I can do other than quote it as it’s still there - which original post are you referring to that you have corrected?

What you quoted above says that you corrected your original post.  What are you calling your original post?  Post 11 (I think) in this thread starts off with an inaccurate statement and directly contradicts what you stated above. 

I don’t care whether you go back and edit Post 11 or not, but if you’re wondering where the confusion is coming from, I believe that’s where it is.

@sjw @melvimbe 

I see your points. I have now corrected the post I believe is the one that caused the confusion. It would have been a lot simpler if the front drivers on the Era 300’s activated in all configurations regardless of content sent to them.

This is a tough point, even if a silent or subdued front speaker is more appropriate for spatial sound delivery. New users want to make sure that they got their money’s worth and a muted front speaker is flagged. New to surround users of any product voice a similar complaint on day one if they are not smacked in the back of their heads by the surround speakers. The user is not satisfied until the surround level is jacked up, way out of proportion. The original Top Gun is a good choice for their first play.

Agreed.  I see it as a catch-22 situation as well.  You could argue that Sonos should have made a spatial audio speaker just for rear surround duty.  No front driver, no bluetooth, no line in, etc...since these things are not used for surround duty.  The expectation is that this would reduce the price.  But that would also mean that it can’t be used as separate pair, so no one would buy it for that reason.  Likewise, many would not buy even if the intend to use for rear surrounds simply for the loss of flexibility.  Essentially, Sonos choice to make a speaker with a wide number of uses and features, even though few would use them all, so that it has a wider market and thus can be a single design and mass produced for cheaper.  If history is a judge, it also could mean the 300 can be viable in the market for longer before needing a replacement.

Here is the sound field options from a Denon, page 145 in the book.

https://www.denon.com/on/demandware.static/-/Library-Sites-denon_northamerica_shared/default/dw51c079d5/downloads/avr-a1h-owners-manual-en.pdf

Yamaha has a wider selection as well as an AI driven mode that sounds very interesting.

Effects: https://manual.yamaha.com/av/20/rxa8a/en-US/313777547.html

AI Mode: https://manual.yamaha.com/av/20/rxa8a/en-US/5459441035.html

If the 300 is a speaker that uses all its internals when played as a front music player singly or in stereo mode, then things are as expected, and any difference between it and other speakers playing stereo audio, including the 5, is down to design/price points. And given the spatial audio capability, it will do better than the 5 with spatial audio music. 

And any suppression of any driver in any mode can be a part of Trueplay tuning; results that can be toggled off if found unsuitable. If worthwhile, I am sure Sonos can modify Era to behave this way in surround mode.

By the way; am I not correct in thinking that in some modes of even stereo music play, some driver/s on the 5 are muted? No one seems to mind that?

This stuff has been around for decades now, as part of even cheap graphic equalisers. I don’t know how many people find any use for it in practice even with perhaps better tech supporting it now, such that they toggle between the options frequently to keep customising the sound. Most times, an option is selected after some playing around when the kit is new, one gets used to what it does and how it sounds, and then the availability of the other options is forgotten. Which is probably a good thing for music enjoyment!

I don’t think there is any doubt that Sonos could turn on the front driver.   I wouldn’t think it’s a matter of trueplay tuning so much as it’s a s matter of personal taste.  The right solution might be a matter of turning up the relative volume , the same way it’s already done for sub, height channels, and rear channels.  However, this isn't a pure matter of volume either since the ‘missing audio’ from the front driver is actually played through side/height channels, so turn on the front driver would likely require also removing audio from the other drivers.

If drivers are muted on the Five in certain modes, I can’t put my ear up to the Five to accurately discern that.  I haven’t done it myself, but no doubt that you can tell the front speakers are off with a simple test, as many have done.

Yes, when vertical some tweeters are disabled as otherwise they would fire downwards.

For the PLAY:5 and FIVE the center facing horizontal tweeter levels are reduced. “Audiophiles” who demand razor sharp imaging will prefer the vertical orientation. Don’t be afraid to use the orientation that sounds “best” (to you).

First of all, many thanks to the originator of the post Aj Trek 1.  Your initial post was/is fascinating and informative.  I’m 64 and disabled and my hearing somewhat impaired.  I’ve spent far too much money since a teenager on whatever has been latest tech in the ensuing years.  I love music and have eclectic tastes but particularly fond of Prog Rock. Long story short, I keep an open mind and am always fascinated to see new products and techniques.

Im new to Sonos and just a few weeks back decided I’d party company with some excellent KEF LS50W2 active speakers and move to something different.  So I have an Arc soundbar which is my first ever experience with a soundbar.  Sub Mini and two Era 300s.  My lounge is small really and just under 4x4 metres square.  Limited options re speakers placement too. 
Anyway, I bought this set up to pursue Atmos.  Very impressed by the Arc and this now is used as standalone for tv.  300s and Sub are linked together now having been part of a surround set up before.  Music is more important to me that movie surround and after experimenting I prefer the 300s as a pair for stereo and Atmos with the Sub too.  I have no experience of the 5s but can appreciate they’d doubtless have the edge with stereo.

It’s early days yet and I may change configuration again and speaker placements?  Happy though with my purchase.  Re Atmos, so far my favourite music experience is the Kraftwerk 3D album to showcase this. My sources are Apple and Amazon and I think I prefer Amazon but will likely keep both.

Very much enjoying this forum.

@Joffy 

Glad you enjoyed my post and the comments of others.

If I read your post correctly you have an Arc as a standalone speaker connected to your TV. You also have Era 300 x 2 as a stereo pair bonded to a Sub-Mini. If that’s correct may I suggest the following:

The Era 300’s present a good low-end by themselves. The Sub-mini may be better utilized with the Arc. Relieving the Arc of having to process the low-end typically results in better vocal audio while providing a better balance of all frequencies. 

You might try experimenting with with the Arc and Sub-mini bonded together.

Originally I just had the Arc and Sub Mini.  I added the 300s shortly after for all round surround.  Experimented with various configurations and latterly surprised as to how good/ sufficient the Arc is alone.  Of course ideally I could toggle the Sub Mini between Arc and 300s, or even toggle between pairing 300s and having as surrounds, but that’s another matter discussed elsewhere in the forum. I don’t want two Subs.  I might get some One SLs as rears to the Arc?  As I say though, the Arc functions well enough alone, for me and of course is best with Atmos material.

Yes, it has been available for years.

The cheaper and older versions are very limited and the sound questionable. Not so the higher end and newer designs. The move to AI powered adjustments is going to be even more interesting.

I found the room emulation setup a nice improvement over plain Stereo mode for a lot of my listening. Compared to just driving all 5 channels with the stereo signal, to get some use from the other speakers, I thought it added quite a bit.

I had several modes I liked quite well for general listening, a couple others that were great for solo piano or organ and one that had a lot of delay/echo was fun to feed chants and the like. My Denon and Yamaha AVRs did sound distinctly different even when trying to pick similar enhanced modes. Stereo and the all speakers stereo modes sounded very close, hard to pin it down more than that due to speaker and room issues.

The latest high end YAMAHA models will map the speaker locations in three dimensions.

A feature from decades past: After measuring the characteristics of respected halls, the room modes emulate a hall’s reverb characteristics.

Probably based on three things - the genre of music I like and listen to, and the way it is recorded in the studio, both of which lead to the third thing, of a preference for listening to it close to the speakers such that room response is minimised, I see no point in adding back reverb characteristics of a hall, which would sound unnatural for such music. Now if I listened to a lot of church organs, things would be different, but I believe that most music catalogues contain performances recorded to give best results in the near field and close to it. Except electronic dance/trance music, I grant, where a different outcome is aimed at.  

Where I would welcome progress is in expanding the size of sweet spot for stereo audio.

Movies are a completely different beast of course, where there is much to be gained by submerging the viewer in the sound field. Except perhaps for movies like Casablanca, where it does not matter.

I think the biggest problem for atmos music is that you need special equipment to listen to it. Most people have “only” stereo or even mono speakers. See on facebook when discussing atmos music, it is only the era 300 people think can play it like it was meant to be. Of course there are alot of misinformation on how this works, and therfor people think you need even more equipment than you actually need to listen to atmos music. I am afraid that this equipment needed is also what will causes the death of atmos music.

I lived through the Quadrophonic years, and more recently the 3D television years. Time, and the marketplace will tell. I’m not against Atmos per se, but most of what I listen to isn’t encoded in it, either.