My speakers/app doesnt want to play music from my phone anymore

Being a bit clearer - Using the 3rd party app for is to enable playback from your phone. Once that is going you can use the Sonos App to do most of its normal functions, add (group) additional speakers, change volume, etc.

Having just had quick play with HI-Fi Cast you need to use the 3rd party app to jump forward and back through the playlist. This makes sense as the sonos device does not know what is in the queue.

Some routers support a USB drive that could host your music library. There are no wires associated with this.

Thank you to everyone who has offered their suggestions and perspective. I am using Hi-Fi Cast and it seems to be working perfectly. What a relief. I am not thrilled at all of course that Sonos made this decision; however, I am at heart a pragmatic person and if the problem is solved, well it is solved.

Thank you again everyone, especially whomever suggested Hi-Fi Cast. Much appreciated. Cheers. 

For the umpteenth time in this forum, Sonos made no decision, their hand was forced by Google’s changes to the Android OS.

Actually, from what I can tell that is not true. Sonos made a business decision that they did not wish to allocate the resources to continue to offer the functionality. There is absolutely nowhere that I have ever heard where Google said that Sonos could not access local files. It does seem that Google made a decision that would result in more work for Sonos and Sonos then made the business decision to not allocate development resources. So no, Google did not force anything, Sonos made the decision that they made.

I am not saying that things did not change for Sonos due to Google making changes, nevertheless, other companies are still able to access local files on Android so clearly it is still possible. I think you need to be accurate here, but I do take your point that Sonos did not do this without some rationale. Just not a compelling rationale in my mind.

I don’t see this distinction as really that relevant to be honest.  Sonos didn’t make a change to their system breaking the feature, Google did.  Whether it was technically impossible or technically possible with some unknown level of effort, doesn’t really matter.  You’re concluding that Sonos isn’t making a rational decision here based on assumptions that happen to favor the conclusion you had before you knew anything about the situation.  How much development resources are required to code and test the change?  What is the likely hood that Google will change how this works again in the near future?  How many customers are using the feature, and unlikely to use the other solutions Sonos offers to play your own audio tracks?  Will new customers care about this feature at all since4 current Sonos speakers offer bluetooth functionality, making this feature practically obsolete?  

Even if Sonos shared all this information with the public, which they would never do, many will still blame Sonos, saying this should restore the feature at any cost, even if puts the company out of business just because the feature existed when they bought it.

We will have to agree to disagree. You essentially are soft calling me out for being concerned about something that had the potential to significantly affect me. I might point out that in a related parallel, you probably have little empathy for my position because the decision made by Sonos probably doesn’t affect you. 

Sonos absolutely did make a change to their system. They could easily have left the functionality as it already existed. Sonos could have left it until it was broken, assuming that it was going to break, which we do not know when that would happen. It might have been quite some time, maybe never for all we know. Correct me if I am wrong, but I did not read anything that suggested the problem was guaranteed to happen. In any case, I don’t think you or I know exactly how things would have panned out. Clearly the developer of Hi Fi Cast is able to access local files stored on an Android phone and send the stream to the Sonos rendering engine. It doesn’t seem like a stretch to suggest if that single developer could pull it off, chances are Sonos with their development team could have kept up. 

Plain and simple, it is very likely that this is simply Sonos firing back as best they can at Google for being bullies, and I get the urge. I am not apologizing for, or minimizing the corporate behaviour of Google. However, Sonos owes more to their customers who paid for the feature in good faith. It is not relevant if only 3% of the Sonos user base cares about the feature, I don’t give a rats ass about voice assistants and you don’t hear me complaining that I paid to have that feature imbedded in my products. 

This is about respect for the customer, you only make a move such as this when you have to. Until Sonos publicly tells us that it was too large a financial burden for them to support this feature, I remain skeptical and would prefer some evidence. That is my opinion as a paying customer and I am entitled to it. I spent a significant amount of money on my Sonos system, and I was likely to continue being a customer of theirs for years to come, I still might be, but I absolutely am allowed to not agree with their decision. You do, no problem, that is also your right. We can agree to disagree. Fair enough.

No, actually it is true.  In the original statement from Sonos, they state quite clearly - “this feature will no longer be compatible with newer versions of the Android operating system.”  No “business decision”, no refusal to “allocate resources”, simply the fact that future versions of Android are incompatible with this feature, and last time I checked, a certain alphabet company is in charge of Android.

And again, unless you are comparing “other companies” who need to access files from outside the OS, you are comparing apples to oranges.  Sonos devices do not stream from a phone or tablet.  The app is a controller, not a media streamer, and therefore is subject to security rules that a local streamer is not. 

I will admit that I do not possess any significant knowledge about the distinction between Sonos as a controller software device versus a media server, such as Hi Fi Cast. I have no grounds on which I could push back against your assertion that there is a difference. Hopefully in time I may learn more about the distinction and how it may have played into this decision.

I will; however, still push back respectfully against your other assertions though. For one, I think you may be interpreting the statement made by Sonos as more complete than I believe it to be. Saying the feature will no longer be compatible with future versions of Android is vague. How far in the future? As well, that statement does not say whether or not Sonos could still author their software to support the feature, that remains a vague area in my opinion.

You also stated that Sonos was not making a financial decision about the viability of maintaining this functionality. I remember reading that Sonos did allude to the financial aspect of future support for this feature as being a factor in their decision. 

I do want to make it clear, that my purpose here in so publicly protesting and questioning Sonos over this decision is not meant to make a judgment about the company in any quasi moral sense, rather I am hoping that if Sonos can indeed provide this feature, that they seriously consider the optics of removing an excellent feature of their product. Or at least, make a very clear and public statement that they have absolute evidence that the feature would have broken for sure, and that there was no viable, and reasonable way that Sonos could have prevented that outcome via their development skills. For me, it feels like Sonos provided just enough information for customers to conclude that this was all Google’s fault and that Sonos could not prevent the impact to their customers. Perhaps those things are true, I have no knowledge that they aren’t. I am simply asking for more clarity from Sonos.

I am also not at all aligning with Google. Again, I do not have enough knowledge to hold an opinion of which corporate entity holds the business moral high ground, if that even exists in this situation. I could absolutely believe that Google is engaging in behaviour that could be viewed as bullying. I am not an apologist for any such behaviour. I deeply enjoy my Sonos products and I want nothing more than for Sonos to continue to develop such amazing, feature rich, quality audio lifestyle products. I am thankful for the quality and customer service that Sonos has demonstrated, despite my protest about this particular feature removal. No disrespect is intended towards Sonos, in fact, quite the opposite. I respect Sonos so much that I feel the company would welcome and support such robust scrutiny from their customers.

In all the years I’ve been here, no statement by Sonos has ever been “clear and public” enough to satisfy the users upset over losing a feature or something to be supported in the future.  Even when Sonos came right out and stated very clearly and publicly that they were not going to support a Windows Phone app, the announcement only served to give ammunition to those who complained. 

In addition, regardless of the shaky relationship, Google is still a partner, both as an app host and via the YouTube music service, and Sonos will never come right out and shove a partner under the bus.  The statement made is as blunt as they come (and if one is not clinging to the hope the decision may be reversed, it is quite easy to read between the lines).  In short, it ain’t coming back, just as it wasn’t coming back when Sonos and other companies lost the ability to stream from a library on iOS devices (and the Sonos announcement for that was almost word for word the same as for Android).

As to the “distinction between Sonos as a controller software device versus a media server”, it’s easy.  A media server actually streams the media.  The Sonos app does not.  Try this simple test - Stream from the media server, then turn the media server off.  What happens to the music?  Now stream using the Sonos app, then turn the Sonos app off.  What happens to the music? 

MG1214 wrote:

Actually, from what I can tell that is not true. Sonos made a business decision that they did not wish to allocate the resources to continue to offer the functionality. There is absolutely nowhere that I have ever heard where Google said that Sonos could not access local files. It does seem that Google made a decision that would result in more work for Sonos and Sonos then made the business decision to not allocate development resources. So no, Google did not force anything, Sonos made the decision that they made.

I am not saying that things did not change for Sonos due to Google making changes, nevertheless, other companies are still able to access local files on Android so clearly it is still possible. I think you need to be accurate here, but I do take your point that Sonos did not do this without some rationale. Just not a compelling rationale in my mind.

There is a fundamental difference here.

•  A Sonos speaker, not the App, makes a call, using a specific network protocol,  through your local network to your phone requesting access to a file stored on the phone. This requires something running on the phone that a) can accept such an inbound call and process it and b) that the operating system also allows such access in the first place.
• An App like BubbleUPnP, HiFi Cast etc is software running on the phone that accesses the music file on your phone and then sends a stream to your Sonos speaker using, I think UPnP and maybe some DLNA commands.

Sonos is making a remote access request, BubbleUPnp a local access request - A big difference. Remember the Sonos app is basically a remote control and is not responsible for playing your music*

 My guess is that security on Android is being tightened up to prevent easy access to files stored on your  phone, Whether or not there will be a way in the future to make such remote calls I have no idea, but one thing is for sure is that it would require work on Sonos part, both on the phone app and the speaker code and if security is one of the reasons for change then this will not be easy.

*note I suspect that when you install the Sonos App it also includes some software that helps the communication between the Speaker and your phone and this is the software that Sonos states is “limiting Sonos Player and controller software advancement for quite a while now”

I would be very surprised to see a reason for playing audio from the android file system to be reversed.   For one thing, it looks as though Sonos is fully embracing bluetooth functionality with their speakers going forward.  While not exactly the same, it eliminates most of the need to access android files while providing the ability to play audio that isn’t in the file system.  The only really difference is the range of WiFi vs bluetooth.

Other than the initial command, I don’t really think so.  Can’t really verify that now, but an easy test would be to initiate playback, then shut down the Sonos app.  As @jgatie said, what happens to the music?

Ralpfocus wrote:

Ralpfocus wrote:

 

*note I suspect that when you install the Sonos App it also includes some software that helps the communication between the Speaker and your phone and this is the software that Sonos states is “limiting Sonos Player and controller software advancement for quite a while now”

 

Other than the initial command, I don’t really think so.  Can’t really verify that now, but an easy test would be to initiate playback, then shut down the Sonos app.  As @jgatie said, what happens to the music?

Agreed if you swipe off the Sonos Controller then the music doesn’t stop, sadly this does not prove that Sonos does not create a background (HTTP?) process. My rational for this thought is a) that Sonos apparently state that this feature is holding the Controller software back, b) i am sure that I have seen on these forums that the PC version of the controller spawns a background process for accessing files on a PC and c) why would android run by default a background HTTP server so that the outside world could connect to your phone without you knowing

Whatever I agree the decision is not going to be reversed. If I can keep my S1 system on its current version before I get an update to Android 14 i will see what happens then.

I assure you, after you initiate playback, you can turn the phone completely off, smash it with a hammer, throw it in a fish tank, run it over with a steamroller, and the music keeps playing.  There are no background processes going on, the Sonos devices stream from the source all by themselves, the app is merely a controller. 

Or, the phone could just be powered off, or leave the WiFi signal… ;)

@jgatie 

I assure you, after you initiate playback, you can turn the phone completely off, smash it with a hammer, throw it in a fish tank, run it over with a steamroller, and the music keeps playing.  There are no background processes going on, the Sonos devices stream from the source all by themselves, the app is merely a controller. 

I agree totally; in every case you can turn the controller off once the stream has started except in the very special situation where you are using the “On this mobile Device”. Which is the case under discussion here. I also agree that the “normal” controller has no part to play in the ongoing stream. 

I am simply speculating that the controller on Android has some additional code associated with playback of music stored on the phone itself, possible as a set of subroutines or a linked spawned process. This extra software might be some form of cut down HTTP server that the Sonos device communicates with. But even in this case it is still the Sonos device that is managing the process, whatever is running on the phone is only responding to the Sonos device.

 As said earlier

My rational for this thought is a) that Sonos apparently state that this feature is holding the Controller software back, b) i am sure that I have seen on these forums that the PC version of the controller spawns a background process for accessing files on a PC and c) why would android run by default a background HTTP server so that the outside world could connect to your phone without you knowing

Plus on Android you can swipe off the Sonos App and the music keeps going playing as you would expect - however if you then force stop the Sonos app then after approx 30 seconds the stream stops and if you are looking at a controller on another device you get a message along the lines of “Unable to play '4th Of July' - the connection to phone name was lost.”