I’d like the option to disable all stream quality above CD too. Do it for all services that support varying stream quality if possible.

I can’t hear it and all it causes is frustration when it drops out.

Please add possibility to disable Apple Lossless in Sonos App. Since you introduced lossless Sonos system is unstable and barely usable. 

 Can’t that be done in the IOS device, Settings-Music?  Maybe that would only apply to AirPlay.

Yes but will only affect Apple Music app and not the Sonos App. So you will be forced to use Airplay. In addition, the Apple Music app works perfectly with lossless and would like to continue listening to that with airpods and other non Sonos devices. 

Hi @GuitarSuperstar 

Thank you - I've marked this thread as a feature request and it will be seen by the relevant teams for consideration. Keep the ideas coming!

Thank you Corry. Please consider that this is more a regression issue than a new feature request. Since Apple Lossless support has been introduced with no possibility to disable it, Sonos system has become very unstable. Please make us happy customers again. Thanks. 

Don’t forget Sonos added Lossless pretty much at the same time that the new app was launched, so I would not be blaming Lossless’ data requirements as the issue - the far more likely cause is the app change that has impacted so many these last three months. I bet that with fixes in the coming weeks, Lossless will start streaming fine again and the request to turn it off will no longer be required. 

Hi @Rhonny 

I agree, but it depends upon what is actually unstable - if the speakers are unstable in their playback, that will likely be due to the increased bandwidth, in which case I would recommend that @antonio_r call our technical support team to see what steps will likely improve matters - even lossless audio is very little data as compared to a video stream, and modern WiFi solutions should definitely be capable. Very likely, identifying a source of interference and removing it will be the answer. The feature request stands, however - it’s a fair ask, in my opinion.

If, however, it is the app that appears unstable (missing speakers, can’t connect, or anything that works in the Desktop app but doesn’t in the main app) then you are probably right - things will improve with further updates.

Have already with case ******** and have been advised to use AirPlay as temporary workaround. 

Hi @antonio_r 

Thanks - an issue I was not aware of (I’ve been off work) has been tagged against your case. It seems not related to bandwidth after all, though an option to disable lossless would help in this situation, it seems.

The good news is that this should be addressed in a future update with no further work or troubleshooting required.

Bottom line here is that Sonos should never have introduced this feature (auto Lossless) this way. Forcing Lossless on users based on Sonos’ own bandwidth assessment of your network is crazy. This is so clearly a user-controlled feature - a simple toggle to turn on/off Lossless streaming. For all the reasons above, it makes one of my 3 Sonos locations completely unusable - because it thinks I have the bandwidth for it yet it fails miserably across 2 zones, much less the ideal 8 zones I’d like to stream to, because it keeps trying to push Lossless.

I would strongly suggest Sonos simply disable the auto-Lossless feature altogether right now, while fixing the myriad of other issues, and bring it back as user-selectable feature when it’s good and ready. 

The bandwidth for Lossless vs non-Lossless is negligible. Your wifi should handle that surely?

Theoretically yes. But in practice, not even close. The minute I go to Apple Playlists and it forces lossless format for all the songs the zone group folds fairly quickly. I flip back to streaming other sources - Pandora, Spotify, or specific songs from Apple Music that don’t have a lossless version play without issue. I could group 12 Sonos amps with no issue, and now I can barely group 2 when Lossless kicks in. But the bigger point stands - this needs to be a user controlled setting. 
 

So much irony: all this for getting more data than is needed for audible sound quality, and then all the hassle because all it causes is unnecessary grief.

And I am not the one saying that this is excess data; when Apple launched lossless, the head of Apple Music said that neither he nor his engineers could make out the difference between the prevailing AAC 256 kbps codec and Apple Lossless. It is Apple saying this! In June 2022 I think.

All Apple has done to make it sound better is have it play at slightly higher sound levels than the equivalent AAC streams.All that it takes for AAC to sound just as good is a nudge to volume slider to the right!

My mistake; it was June 2021:

https://musictech.com/news/industry/apple-music-head-cant-differentiate-lossless-and-compressed-audio-says-format-is-a-marketing-play/#

PS: this is also why people need to see the lossless indicator in the app to know that they are listening to lossless - the benefit is conveyed via the eyes not the ears 

A couple of things to try, whilst Sonos addresses issue in future update:

What Sonos products do you have, stereo pairs? If you have an older product that does not support Apple Lossless streaming, and its part of the group, it wont be a lossless stream, so you shouldnt see any drop outs.

Try AirPlay, as previously mentioned.

What WiFi do you have, multiple APs? It could be the Sonos devices are roaming unnecessarily, possibly causing issue with stream. If you can maybe make the static (non portable) devices in your household ‘sticky’ to the closest access point.

My own experience is Apple Lossless works well, I do see a short 1 second pause when I add an older product to group, now I understand that I can work around it. I did a test the other day with multiple lossless streams to different rooms, not a typical use case, but I didn’t experience any dropping of audio.

Yes agreed on Apple Lossless. Here again Apple Lossless is noticeable on my reference system in my listening room. Using super high quality DAC, and power and pre amps and speakers. Not at all necessary for most Sonos applications as the gear is not audiophile grade. Don’t get me wrong it’s an excellent multi room wireless solution I’ve had in multiple properties since 2005. Great for that application. But Lossless streaming out to typical in-ceiling speakers is very difficult to appreciate sonically. Which only adds to the reason to make this user selectable for Sonos customers. 

AirPlay across multiple zone groups is very cumbersome and AirPlay breaks up the amps in the groups regularly so it’s not perfect but it’s doable in a pinch. My setups are each across 12+ zones using all new Sonos amps. Eero mesh. No reason for this bad drop out behavior. Network is healthy and super fast for all other high bandwidth video and data activity. Can’t wait for the fix! I hope Sonos is paying attention. TGIF.

Hi Corry,

Has there been any update regarding this? I haven’t gone through most of the issues many others have thankfully with the app, but I have dealt with terrible dropouts, music skipping etc which is purely associated with apple music lossless. Sonos needs to have a way to disable it. Really doubt anyone could even hear the difference and yet it’s responsible for a tonne of issues.

Soon as that lossless icon appears in the app I know grouping speakers etc is going to be a nightmare and I’ve tried running an Asus XT8 Wifi 6 router and now a top of the line Eero Max 7 and the same issue happens. The speakers for some reason just struggle with the higher bandwith requirements and the whole thing just seems completely unnecessary.

Hi @billiejoe87 

No, and nor will there be - it will either appear as an option one day or it will not. I don’t think there would be any prior notice for either of us.

However, as compared to, say, playing a YouTube video, lossless playback does not take much bandwidth at all (though it does take more than lossy) - if you only experience issue when playing back lossless audio, then it seems likely that this could be addressed by minimising interference, as it sounds like your WiFi is only barely capable of delivering music at all when it should be capable of much more.

If our Reducing wireless interference help page does not provide you with all you need to find a source and eliminate it (pay attention to what is near the router especially), then I recommend you get in touch with our technical support team who have tools at their disposal that will allow them to give you advice specific to your Sonos system and what it reports. Any WiFi worth it’s salt should be able to deliver lossless audio to a handful of speakers.

There are some known issues with Asus XT8 routers and Sonos - please ensure that it’s firmware is up to date (if it is still in use).

I hope this helps.

I have changed over to Eero Max 7’s which are at the absolute top end of wifi connectivity, more than blanket my property in wifi and I still have issues only with sonos. I’ve got 60+ products on my wifi and only ever have an issue with your products. I have 6 x Apple TV 4K’s in my household for example streaming 4K video and they never skip a beat. This is a Sonos problem, not a wifi problem.

There is no need to gaslight me on these issues. I’ve invested $10,000 or so in your equipment and I’m an IT technician myself. These problems are very well known regarding apple music lossless and your equipment. I still note the classic issues you guys haven’t fixed for months with songs cutting off at the beginning or end and skipping which Sonos keeps stringing us along for a fix.

Just do it and stop the gaslighting.

It’s just unbelievable this issue is showing everywhere online and you are gaslighting me regarding a network issue even now I’ve upgraded to top of the line Eero Max 7 routers and the same issues are happening as on the XT8’s.

Airplay mostly works fine, however playing through your app is terrible. Soon as you start grouping 3-4 or more speakers with apple music lossless it all goes pear shaped. I have over 50 devices on the network and none behave like this.

It’s very clear that sonos has an issue with apple music lossless as we still have the issues with songs cutting off before they end, random bouts of no audio etc that don’t happen with airplay.

For someone who has now spent about $10K on all my sonos equipment it’s actually really offensive to me you would even begin to suggest a top range Asus Mesh and now the absolute top Eero mesh are the cause of these issues.

Hi @billiejoe87 

My apologies - this is all entirely my mistake and my intention was not at all to gaslight you!

I should have scrolled up slightly to see my earlier post, and when I made my earlier post, I should have tagged the relevant issue to this thread and that would have informed the more recent me that the issue you describe is indeed known and not a result of limited bandwidth - my apologies again.

This thread was originally tagged as a feature request, and I thought your query was in reference to that - that is why I said we would not hear anything about it prior to it becoming a feature. I misunderstood what you were referring to in that part of your post.

In addition, your comment was not deleted - it was pending approval. Some posts will not show immediately due to certain keywords or links contained within them - you’ll see your post is now visible.

It remains a fact, however, that neither of us will hear any updates regarding progress on this lossless playback issue until it is resolved.

Please accept this misunderstanding as just that, and not an attempt to gaslight you.

That was never my intent - more that speakers might be close to a source of interference, have too many objects on a straight line between themselves and the router/AP or are near metal or glass surfaces. This is irrelevant now, however, as the known issue does not depend on such.

I hope this all explains my - now understood to be largely nonsense - reply to you.

Thankyou Corry. I’m sorry for assuming the worst, but these issues are just really frustrating to deal with. I appreciate your explanation.

Now that a few of my posts were approved, it basically has me now posting the same thing above 3 times, so please feel free to delete the additional posts.