End of Software Support - Clarifications

End of Software Support - Clarifications
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Smilja

New devices, i.e. those that do not exist now won’t be able to be added to legacy systems. The ‘legacy’ software wouldn’t be able to  ‘recognize’ the new device. 

 

Not sure about that. It has been stated, that we will be able to add newly purchased devices to a legacy system. I presume that during the set up the legacy firmware build will be downloaded and installed onto the new device shifting it artificially into legacy mode.

»And the world is like an apple whirling silently in space, Like the circles that you find in the windmills of your mind.« (›Windmills Of Your Mind‹ [1967]. Music by Michel Legrand ; English lyrics written by Alan & Marilyn Bergman)
Airgetlam

I would expect current ‘modern’ equipment would be able to be added to ‘legacy’ systems, but not future items, because their definitions would not exist in the software. If Sonos was to add the ‘new’ devices to the ‘legacy’ software, there would be no reason to do all this. 

Guess we will see in May, or thereafter, though. 

Bruce
W
Userlevel 2

Why not just leave the ‘legacy’ devices exactly as they are now, which is what Sonos has suggested? After the May change, they’ll continue to work in exactly the same way as they do today, including having “whole house connectivity”. No need to deal with the line in, unless you’re already using it. If your system works today, it will continue to do so. You just won’t get new features, if you have a legacy device. Or am I misunderstanding your post?


If you have a mix of legacy devices and newer devices, the newer devices cannot be updated or you will lose the whole house connectivity.

I think that is the choice we have to make, you either remain on “Legacy” or you upgrade and run with the “new/current”.

Running with 2 systems “Legacy” and “new/current” systems does not make sense and does not bode well for the future. What would happen, say in 5 years as an example, when the next products are identified to become “Legacy” like possibly the Playbar and Play 1 (just using as an example), what happens then?

Will we have 3 software operating systems?

“Legacy 1” software system for the products expiring this year, “Legacy 2” software system for those expiring in 5 years and “new/current”. It’s going to be a mess.

We have all been taken for a ride and I expect a lot of people have recently bought non-legacy Sonos products and are blissfully unaware of what awaits them in a few years.

If you have older products, are not rich and haven’t money to throw away, the best way to go is stay legacy and re-think what you actually need. Check out Kumar’s other thread being a good starting point as a source for thinking - “The Sonos Brexit and pragmatic ways past it”.

My first step will be to go back to wired equipment for the surround sound, whilst remaining on legacy for the other Sonos products I have. Why would anyone put any more money into Sonos equipment after this?

D
Userlevel 7
Badge +5

We don’t know that yet. At the worst, you may end up with two Sonos systems, one with legacy devices, one with modern devices. We’ll need to wait for further information from Sonos as to whether they’ll be able to communicate with each other, but neither would lose the ability to connect with the other devices within its own network. 


And here is the problem in a nutshell.

Sonos has been super vague about this, to the point where it’s anyone’s guess what is going to happen.

I can only see one reason that they have been so vague, and that is that it IS going to be the worst case scenario for costumers and they don’t want to tell people flat out that it IS this solution, because they know the costumers will be furious.

Everything i have read, points to a solution where you can be on legacy with all products, and when for example spotify changes anything, you will loose spotify on ALL your products OR you can split them up, and have 2 different networks and 2 different apps and NO posibility to do multi room across modern and legacy products...Even for services that is still working seperately on modern and legacy products.

 

Oh yeah and then there is the option to brick your hardware and pay sonos for new equipment and throw the old one away even though it is working perfectly fine.

D
Userlevel 7
Badge +5

Hopefully @Ryan S can clarify if both legacy and new devices will work together for streaming in group mode or are we waiting on further clarification on this? Or as I saw in a reply from Sonos on Twitter, it won’t be possible post May update?


If they would i can guarantee you Sonos would not be so super vague about this.

Often it is not what is said that gives you the most information, but what is NOT said, that does.

Companies will always highlight the good things and not tell you about the bad.

If, in the end legacy and modern devices will be able to do multi room across the legacy and modern devices for example for MP3 streaming and streaming from streaming services that still work on legacy, it’s because they changed their mind, there is NO doubt that right now they dont intend you to keep modern and legacy products in any kind of network, where they will be able to talk to eachother.


They even said this…..That they could not, as every speaker needs to be on the same firmware level to be able to operate together. This is the reason you need to keep modern products on legacy firmware if you want them to work together.

D
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Badge +5

 

Not sure about that. It has been stated, that we will be able to add newly purchased devices to a legacy system. I presume that during the set up the legacy firmware build will be downloaded and installed onto the new device shifting it artificially into legacy mode.

That would mean that devices developed and released after May would also have to have 2 different firmwares.

One for legacy support and one for modern support…

If sonos can not be bothered to keep the firmware for legacy products up to date, why would you expect them to have to “double“ their programming effort to make an obsolete firmware for the legacy mode.

I even think Ryan, earlier in this thread said that new devices that will be introduced after may will not be legacy mode supported.

D
Userlevel 7
Badge +5

I think that is the choice we have to make, you either remain on “Legacy” or you upgrade and run with the “new/current”.

Running with 2 systems “Legacy” and “new/current” systems does not make sense and does not bode well for the future. What would happen, say in 5 years as an example, when the next products are identified to become “Legacy” like possibly the Playbar and Play 1 (just using as an example), what happens then?

Will we have 3 software operating systems?

“Legacy 1” software system for the products expiring this year, “Legacy 2” software system for those expiring in 5 years and “new/current”. It’s going to be a mess.

We have all been taken for a ride and I expect a lot of people have recently bought non-legacy Sonos products and are blissfully unaware of what awaits them in a few years.

If you have older products, are not rich and haven’t money to throw away, the best way to go is stay legacy and re-think what you actually need. Check out Kumar’s other thread being a good starting point as a source for thinking - “The Sonos Brexit and pragmatic ways past it”.

My first step will be to go back to wired equipment for the surround sound, whilst remaining on legacy for the other Sonos products I have. Why would anyone put any more money into Sonos equipment after this?

Yeah and if i then have Play 5 on “legacy 1” and the rest on modern...What will i be able to do in, say 2 years when my play 1’s are being “legacied”.

Will i be able to revert the Play 1’s to “legacy 1” to be able to group them with the play 5 or is firmware downgrading to “legacy 1” at all possible if i have gone beyond that level.

In that case i risk having a play 5 that is in “legacy 1”, some Play 1’s that are “legacy 2” and the rest is modern. and they will have to be in 3 different networks, with 3 different apps and unable to do multiroom across them.

The best bet is for everyone that has legacy products to go legacy only in May.

If, say 50%+ of sonos costumers decide to stay at the platform, when the firmware train moves forward, it will send a strong signal to sonos, that forgetting and neglecting those left behind is a dangerous endeavour.

Ken_Griffiths

Yeah and if i then have Play 5 on “legacy 1” and the rest on modern...What will i be able to do in, say 2 years when my play 1’s are being “legacied”.

Will i be able to revert the Play 1’s to “legacy 1” to be able to group them with the play 5 or is firmware downgrading to “legacy 1” at all possible if i have gone beyond that level.

In that case i risk having a play 5 that is in “legacy 1”, some Play 1’s that are “legacy 2” and the rest is modern. and they will have to be in 3 different networks, with 3 different apps and unable to do multiroom across them.

The best bet is for everyone that has legacy products to go legacy only in May.

If, say 50%+ of sonos costumers decide to stay at the platform, when the firmware train moves forward, it will send a strong signal to sonos, that forgetting and neglecting those left behind is a dangerous endeavour.

I disagree with this viewpoint entirely as it’s an attempt to ‘cling onto the past’ and not move forward with technology. This would be like hanging onto VHS Video recorders instead of streaming digital movies or watching black & white TV rather than colour 4K uhd TV ...and in both such examples, I would much prefer the latter. Who wants to standstill these days? … if Sonos did standstill, their devices would soon become outdated and rival companies would quickly overtake and grasp the helm.

So in my view, it’s the correct decision to set aside the ‘now aged’ devices and put them into care, whilst the younger 'spritely' products take over and lead us all onto the next generation of innovate products.

Standstill and rest here if you want to, but let the rest of us get on with a far more exciting road ahead.

I’m looking forward to improved WiFi, faster audio processing, HD audio, 7.1 surround systems, Dolby Atmos Music and Movie audio (audio objects in a 3D space), improved grouping and streaming, better smart-home control and integration with lighting and other devices, web-based and new hardware controllers, innovative designs for indoor, outdoor speakers and headphones… and that’s just a few of the things that ‘might’ just be on the Sonos Roadmap ahead, perhaps?

chickentender

Yeah and if i then have Play 5 on “legacy 1” and the rest on modern...What will i be able to do in, say 2 years when my play 1’s are being “legacied”.

Will i be able to revert the Play 1’s to “legacy 1” to be able to group them with the play 5 or is firmware downgrading to “legacy 1” at all possible if i have gone beyond that level.

In that case i risk having a play 5 that is in “legacy 1”, some Play 1’s that are “legacy 2” and the rest is modern. and they will have to be in 3 different networks, with 3 different apps and unable to do multiroom across them.

The best bet is for everyone that has legacy products to go legacy only in May.

If, say 50%+ of sonos costumers decide to stay at the platform, when the firmware train moves forward, it will send a strong signal to sonos, that forgetting and neglecting those left behind is a dangerous endeavour.

I disagree with this viewpoint entirely as it’s an attempt to ‘cling onto the past’ and not move forward with technology. This would be like hanging onto VHS Video recorders instead of streaming digital movies or watching black & white TV rather than colour 4K uhd TV ...and in both such examples, I would much prefer the latter. Who wants to standstill these days? … if Sonos did standstill, their devices would soon become outdated and rival companies would quickly overtake and grasp the helm.

So in my view, it’s the correct decision to set aside the ‘now aged’ devices and put them into care, whilst the younger 'spritely' products take over and lead us all onto the next generation of innovate products.

Standstill and rest here if you want to, but let the rest of us get on with a far more exciting road ahead.

I’m looking forward to improved WiFi, faster audio processing, HD audio, 7.1 surround systems, Dolby Atmos Music and Movie audio (audio objects in a 3D space), improved grouping and streaming, better smart-home control and integration with lighting and other devices, web-based and new hardware controllers, innovative designs for indoor, outdoor speakers and headphones… and that’s just a few of the things that ‘might’ just be on the Sonos Roadmap ahead, perhaps?

Staying legacy give me funds to explore other useful non-Sonos options… it has already.

The thing is, all of this (the above improvements) is possible now outside of the Sonos ecosystem, and leaving a Sonos system in “standstill” doesn’t preclude moving forward in other ways, more modular ways, less walled-garden ways. Taking your eggs out of the single basket isn’t a bad thing. It’s also not a bad thing to leave them in if you like, with eyes open…. But that’s a long list of Christmas audio-wishes you’ve collected in a short paragraph there, none of them guaranteed. 

It’s entirely possible I might jettison my older legacy pieces at some point and rejoin the flock down the road if there is compelling reason to do so, and hopefully some substantial portion of that reason will be made known in May…

Personally I’m not standing still, I’m just leaving my Sonos standing still, not with any animosity or to send a ‘message’ to Sonos - they can do whatever they like... They got my attention once years ago, maybe they’ll do it again. For now, I know the speakers have an expiration date in certain respects and I also know there’s a whole audio world out there I’ve largely been ignoring for the better part of decade, and it’s been doing some cool stuff while I wasn’t looking. :)

A
Userlevel 4
Badge +2

Yeah and if i then have Play 5 on “legacy 1” and the rest on modern...What will i be able to do in, say 2 years when my play 1’s are being “legacied”.

Will i be able to revert the Play 1’s to “legacy 1” to be able to group them with the play 5 or is firmware downgrading to “legacy 1” at all possible if i have gone beyond that level.

In that case i risk having a play 5 that is in “legacy 1”, some Play 1’s that are “legacy 2” and the rest is modern. and they will have to be in 3 different networks, with 3 different apps and unable to do multiroom across them.

The best bet is for everyone that has legacy products to go legacy only in May.

If, say 50%+ of sonos costumers decide to stay at the platform, when the firmware train moves forward, it will send a strong signal to sonos, that forgetting and neglecting those left behind is a dangerous endeavour.

I disagree with this viewpoint entirely as it’s an attempt to ‘cling onto the past’ and not move forward with technology. This would be like hanging onto VHS Video recorders instead of streaming digital movies or watching black & white TV rather than colour 4K uhd TV ...and in both such examples, I would much prefer the latter. Who wants to standstill these days? … if Sonos did standstill, their devices would soon become outdated and rival companies would quickly overtake and grasp the helm.

So in my view, it’s the correct decision to set aside the ‘now aged’ devices and put them into care, whilst the younger 'spritely' products take over and lead us all onto the next generation of innovate products.

Standstill and rest here if you want to, but let the rest of us get on with a far more exciting road ahead.

I’m looking forward to improved WiFi, faster audio processing, HD audio, 7.1 surround systems, Dolby Atmos Music and Movie audio (audio objects in a 3D space), improved grouping and streaming, better smart-home control and integration with lighting and other devices, web-based and new hardware controllers, innovative designs for indoor, outdoor speakers and headphones… and that’s just a few of the things that ‘might’ just be on the Sonos Roadmap ahead, perhaps?

Staying legacy give me funds to explore other useful non-Sonos options… it has already.

The thing is, all of this (the above improvements) is possible now outside of the Sonos ecosystem, and leaving a Sonos system in “standstill” doesn’t preclude moving forward in other ways, more modular ways, less walled-garden ways. Taking your eggs out of the single basket isn’t a bad thing. It’s also not a bad thing to leave them in if you like, with eyes open…. But that’s a long list of Christmas audio-wishes you’ve collected in a short paragraph there, none of them guaranteed. 

It’s entirely possible I might jettison my older legacy pieces at some point and rejoin the flock down the road if there is compelling reason to do so, and hopefully some substantial portion of that reason will be made known in May…

Personally I’m not standing still, I’m just leaving my Sonos standing still, not with any animosity or to send a ‘message’ to Sonos - they can do whatever they like... They got my attention once years ago, maybe they’ll do it again. For now, I know the speakers have an expiration date in certain respects and I also know there’s a whole audio world out there I’ve largely been ignoring for the better part of decade, and it’s been doing some cool stuff while I wasn’t looking. :)

 

 

An excellent post, particularly the sections in bold. 

Whatever Sonos have planned in their ‘exciting developments’ in May which no one knows about besides the insiders within Sonos, if I was in the market for Sonos equipment now I’d avoid anything in the lower Manhattan category in the graph below despite the assertion of what Sonos term as ‘modern products’ in this link.

https://support.sonos.com/s/article/4798?language=en_US

 

 

Whilst no tech is entirely future proofed, particularly with the announcement of the ‘5-Year support/built-in obsolescence’ (delete as appropriate) from the looks of the graph the One/Beam/Amp/One (Gen2) & Move stand a better chance of lasting better than the units further down the pecking order.

A shame Sonos didn’t communicate the hardware details to it’s ‘loyal customers’ so they could make an informed choice prior to purchasing multiple premium products :neutral_face:

M
Userlevel 5
Badge +8

Why not just leave the ‘legacy’ devices exactly as they are now, which is what Sonos has suggested? After the May change, they’ll continue to work in exactly the same way as they do today, including having “whole house connectivity”. No need to deal with the line in, unless you’re already using it. If your system works today, it will continue to do so. You just won’t get new features, if you have a legacy device. Or am I misunderstanding your post?


If you have a mix of legacy devices and newer devices, the newer devices cannot be updated or you will lose the whole house connectivity.

I think that is the choice we have to make, you either remain on “Legacy” or you upgrade and run with the “new/current”.

Running with 2 systems “Legacy” and “new/current” systems does not make sense and does not bode well for the future. What would happen, say in 5 years as an example, when the next products are identified to become “Legacy” like possibly the Playbar and Play 1 (just using as an example), what happens then?

Will we have 3 software operating systems?

“Legacy 1” software system for the products expiring this year, “Legacy 2” software system for those expiring in 5 years and “new/current”. It’s going to be a mess.

We have all been taken for a ride and I expect a lot of people have recently bought non-legacy Sonos products and are blissfully unaware of what awaits them in a few years.

If you have older products, are not rich and haven’t money to throw away, the best way to go is stay legacy and re-think what you actually need. Check out Kumar’s other thread being a good starting point as a source for thinking - “The Sonos Brexit and pragmatic ways past it”.

My first step will be to go back to wired equipment for the surround sound, whilst remaining on legacy for the other Sonos products I have. Why would anyone put any more money into Sonos equipment after this?

That’s why Sonos should seriously consider a box in the Sonos system that can act as an integrator between the multiple systems. It would have lots of memory, disk space and handle/change the streaming between the two/three systems. I would buy that if it it would ensure my legacy gear would continue to work. If they don’t provide this type of solution, then I won’t invest further with Sonos and find a viable long term alternative. It makes NO sense to replace fully working hardware speakers with products that are newer but with newer software and a few tweaks here and there. Especially in this environmentally conscious world. 

Act in haste, repent at leisure.
Ken_Griffiths

Staying legacy give me funds to explore other useful non-Sonos options… it has already.

The thing is, all of this (the above improvements) is possible now outside of the Sonos ecosystem, and leaving a Sonos system in “standstill” doesn’t preclude moving forward in other ways, more modular ways, less walled-garden ways. Taking your eggs out of the single basket isn’t a bad thing. It’s also not a bad thing to leave them in if you like, with eyes open…. But that’s a long list of Christmas audio-wishes you’ve collected in a short paragraph there, none of them guaranteed. 

It’s entirely possible I might jettison my older legacy pieces at some point and rejoin the flock down the road if there is compelling reason to do so, and hopefully some substantial portion of that reason will be made known in May…

Personally I’m not standing still, I’m just leaving my Sonos standing still, not with any animosity or to send a ‘message’ to Sonos - they can do whatever they like... They got my attention once years ago, maybe they’ll do it again. For now, I know the speakers have an expiration date in certain respects and I also know there’s a whole audio world out there I’ve largely been ignoring for the better part of decade, and it’s been doing some cool stuff while I wasn’t looking. :)

I see this as perhaps even more reasons for Sonos to put their old stuff out to graze, as it’s undoubtedly true that the innovations of other products out there, plus the fact that Sonos have been trying to keep their old stuff running with the new, for so long, has held back their progress. I don’t doubt that is the case.

It’s time now though for Sonos to move forward and not be held back by trying to please all the people, all the time. So I don’t disagree at all with some of the things you have said here. Let Sonos get on with moving forward and bringing new products and features to their system.

Smilja

@MIBUK, it would take years to develop and test such a “box”. It’s not coming.

»And the world is like an apple whirling silently in space, Like the circles that you find in the windmills of your mind.« (›Windmills Of Your Mind‹ [1967]. Music by Michel Legrand ; English lyrics written by Alan & Marilyn Bergman)
M
Userlevel 5
Badge +8

Yeah and if i then have Play 5 on “legacy 1” and the rest on modern...What will i be able to do in, say 2 years when my play 1’s are being “legacied”.

Will i be able to revert the Play 1’s to “legacy 1” to be able to group them with the play 5 or is firmware downgrading to “legacy 1” at all possible if i have gone beyond that level.

In that case i risk having a play 5 that is in “legacy 1”, some Play 1’s that are “legacy 2” and the rest is modern. and they will have to be in 3 different networks, with 3 different apps and unable to do multiroom across them.

The best bet is for everyone that has legacy products to go legacy only in May.

If, say 50%+ of sonos costumers decide to stay at the platform, when the firmware train moves forward, it will send a strong signal to sonos, that forgetting and neglecting those left behind is a dangerous endeavour.

I disagree with this viewpoint entirely as it’s an attempt to ‘cling onto the past’ and not move forward with technology. This would be like hanging onto VHS Video recorders instead of streaming digital movies or watching black & white TV rather than colour 4K uhd TV ...and in both such examples, I would much prefer the latter. Who wants to standstill these days? … if Sonos did standstill, their devices would soon become outdated and rival companies would quickly overtake and grasp the helm.

So in my view, it’s the correct decision to set aside the ‘now aged’ devices and put them into care, whilst the younger 'spritely' products take over and lead us all onto the next generation of innovate products.

Standstill and rest here if you want to, but let the rest of us get on with a far more exciting road ahead.

I’m looking forward to improved WiFi, faster audio processing, HD audio, 7.1 surround systems, Dolby Atmos Music and Movie audio (audio objects in a 3D space), improved grouping and streaming, better smart-home control and integration with lighting and other devices, web-based and new hardware controllers, innovative designs for indoor, outdoor speakers and headphones… and that’s just a few of the things that ‘might’ just be on the Sonos Roadmap ahead, perhaps?


Naturally, we must go forward, but it has to be done in the right way. Sonos has created all of this confusion by not having a plan to announce to its customers. Now we have to wait weeks or months for clarity. That’s not good business practice as it stops most from buying more Sonos. Even on social media when Sonos release a tweet or instagram post, the negative response is not going to help them replace the pause in purchases by its current customer base.

Sonos have the data and my guess most are streaming music, listening to radio and NAS media servers. So just provide a box to allow these services to continue. A box that can be updated with the latest firmware etc. Many would buy it imho. 
 

As someone mentioned earlier, have a discount to upgrade based on how many units and years you have been a customer. The longer you’ve been a customer, the higher the discount. 
 

The issue isn’t technology progressing. It’s the haphazard way Sonos has communicated this with no plan and seemingly not thinking about their very loyal customers who have been their best brand ambassadors. It’s not rocket science. 

Act in haste, repent at leisure.
Ken_Griffiths

That’s why Sonos should seriously consider a box in the Sonos system that can act as an integrator between the multiple systems. It would have lots of memory, disk space and handle/change the streaming between the two/three systems. I would buy that if it it would ensure my legacy gear would continue to work. If they don’t provide this type of solution, then I won’t invest further with Sonos and find a viable long term alternative. It makes NO sense to replace fully working hardware speakers with products that are newer but with newer software and a few tweaks here and there. Especially in this environmentally conscious world. 

I guess that would be a full system re-write, virtually from 'scratch' and it may also have an impact on various Sonos patents etc. Which are probably Sonos’ most important assets, but 15 to 20 years down the line, I guess every software engineer/developer wishes they had done things a little differently, knowing what they know now. Hindsight is a wonderful thing, or so they say.

However I like the idea mentioned here, but not sure if the old legacy speaker operating systems, processors and wifi hardware will still be able to keep up with today’s modern Sonos products. Neither do they have BLE for near field communications or microphones for auto-trueplay tuning etc. It’s just best to let the old stuff get set aside, I think, and let’s mive forward faster, rather than delaying things further with a costly software re-write.

D
Userlevel 7
Badge +5

Yeah and if i then have Play 5 on “legacy 1” and the rest on modern...What will i be able to do in, say 2 years when my play 1’s are being “legacied”.

Will i be able to revert the Play 1’s to “legacy 1” to be able to group them with the play 5 or is firmware downgrading to “legacy 1” at all possible if i have gone beyond that level.

In that case i risk having a play 5 that is in “legacy 1”, some Play 1’s that are “legacy 2” and the rest is modern. and they will have to be in 3 different networks, with 3 different apps and unable to do multiroom across them.

The best bet is for everyone that has legacy products to go legacy only in May.

If, say 50%+ of sonos costumers decide to stay at the platform, when the firmware train moves forward, it will send a strong signal to sonos, that forgetting and neglecting those left behind is a dangerous endeavour.

I disagree with this viewpoint entirely as it’s an attempt to ‘cling onto the past’ and not move forward with technology. This would be like hanging onto VHS Video recorders instead of streaming digital movies or watching black & white TV rather than colour 4K uhd TV ...and in both such examples, I would much prefer the latter. Who wants to standstill these days? … if Sonos did standstill, their devices would soon become outdated and rival companies would quickly overtake and grasp the helm.

So in my view, it’s the correct decision to set aside the ‘now aged’ devices and put them into care, whilst the younger 'spritely' products take over and lead us all onto the next generation of innovate products.

Standstill and rest here if you want to, but let the rest of us get on with a far more exciting road ahead.

I’m looking forward to improved WiFi, faster audio processing, HD audio, 7.1 surround systems, Dolby Atmos Music and Movie audio (audio objects in a 3D space), improved grouping and streaming, better smart-home control and integration with lighting and other devices, web-based and new hardware controllers, innovative designs for indoor, outdoor speakers and headphones… and that’s just a few of the things that ‘might’ just be on the Sonos Roadmap ahead, perhaps?


I dont think anyone is complaining, that sonos want to phase out the older models, the problem is that it is not possible to have the older and newer models in the same network, doing the things they can RIGHT NOW.

 

Why is it not possible to stop development on the firmware in the play 5, but make sure that the new version can still “talk” to the Play 5 to do the stuff it can do today.

 

I fully understand and accept that if for example spotify changes something, that this would possibly mean that i could not stream spotify across modern and legacy products, but why am i not able to stream MP3’s on multiroom across modern and legacy.

As long as my NAS has a shared drive and the Play 5 and the modern products can read this (And this will probably not change for a long time) i should be able to play my MP3’s across modern and legacy products, even though spotify might stop working on the legacy stuff, because they change their streams.

 

THIS is the crux of the matter.

 

Would you be content with watching Netflix in SD format, just because you have a VCR that can only do SD format and your TV defaults to the lowest variant even though you have a blueray player, netflix and whatnot that can easily do 4K and a TV that does 4K ?

D
Userlevel 7
Badge +5

It’s time now though for Sonos to move forward and not be held back by trying to please all the people, all the time. So I don’t disagree at all with some of the things you have said here. Let Sonos get on with moving forward and bringing new products and features to their system.

Sonos problem is that their stuff is rather expensive, so people need an incentive to buy it.

This has, until recently been achieved by 2 main means.

  1. People that has sonos, expanding their setup
  2. People seeing sonos at friends and being wow’ed. Essentially making the current users, free advertisers for the new crowd.

So by “not pleasing” the current users they loose a lot of people, that will now not spend a dime more on sonos, and people that will not recommend sonos to their friends.

 

Basically, pissing off the loyal sonos “believers” makes them lose both their “followers” that, as more than one has said...Has never even thought about options besides sonos, and they lose their “free publicity”.

 

So they actually screwed over their loyal fanbase and the chance of getting a sale by word of mouth among friends.

 

I for one has stopped buying sonos...I was in the process of getting a sub for my playbar/play 1 sorround sound, a play one for my wife’s hobby room that we just finished fixing up and after this i even saw that sonos now does celing mounted speakers that would have been ideal for out upcoming bathroom restauration.

I also tell everyone that i talk to, where the conversation turns to sonos, that i would not recommend them to buy any products as they have a very limited lifespan (Very limited, compared to the price….Please remember that those who bought a play 5 in 2015, paid the same for it, as those that bought it in 2009, so unless you buy a completely newly released product, you must always calculate with a 5 year lifespan before it becomes obsolete).

J

The world divides into two groups. 

1. Those who accept that Sonos is s tightly integrated system, not just a collection of devices, and that therefore certain core requirements are needed in every device if the system is to do more and more things. The fact that the legacy devices have the smallest memory is consistent with this.

2. Those who believe that Sonos is making that up and are a bunch of profiteering, disloyal, lying cheats who are only doing this to sell new products.

Never the twain shall meet. Let's just stick to our own tribes.

Ken_Griffiths


Naturally, we must go forward, but it has to be done in the right way. Sonos has created all of this confusion by not having a plan to announce to its customers. Now we have to wait weeks or months for clarity. That’s not good business practice as it stops most from buying more Sonos. Even on social media when Sonos release a tweet or instagram post, the negative response is not going to help them replace the pause in purchases by its current customer base.

Sonos have the data and my guess most are streaming music, listening to radio and NAS media servers. So just provide a box to allow these services to continue. A box that can be updated with the latest firmware etc. Many would buy it imho. 
 

As someone mentioned earlier, have a discount to upgrade based on how many units and years you have been a customer. The longer you’ve been a customer, the higher the discount. 
 

The issue isn’t technology progressing. It’s the haphazard way Sonos has communicated this with no plan and seemingly not thinking about their very loyal customers who have been their best brand ambassadors. It’s not rocket science. 

Again I agree with some of the viewpoints mentioned here, but just as an example, someone who trades-up say a single play 5 (gen1) against one of the more expensive Sonos ‘speaker-sets' can save ‘almost’ $500 discount off that purchase and that seems to be rather a good saving to help ‘float the boat’ a little. I personally like the fact all customers are treated equally, both new and old, however that’s just a personal thing.

As an aside, I also recently saw mentioned by some long-term 'regular' users here in the community, that it’s perhaps time for a new playbar and/or PlayBase (or HT Center Speaker) from Sonos too, later this year… so I might keep my fingers crossed for those type of devices to show up, as I’m (perhaps) in the market for that type of device. (with 30% off..?). 🤞

Anyhow, I think Sonos could have chosen to put out the message in this way in order to ‘listen’ and gauge customer reaction and to study what their users truly want ...and to see how it fits in with their proposed action, or if they can maybe alter/adjust a few things perhaps to maybe able to suit the majority.

Yes, of course, I think Sonos underestimated the reaction, once the message spread, which was not helped by so much misinformation and lots of untruths spreading quickly online (accidentally, or in some cases, maliciously, perhaps?), but it does mean they have to now ‘sort the wheat from the chaff’ to then produce their chosen planned course of action. I think waiting until May is fair enough.. I’m sure there is a lot of work to do between 'now’ and 'then’.

Sadly, some people appear to be extremely impatient at the May-delay and from some posts I’ve read within the numerous threads here, seem to get themselves rather worked up over such issues. I prefer to not stress over such things and having music on around the place helps. My glass still remains 'half full’ on these matters. I’m fairly confident our Sonos system will continue to play here at home for a good many years still to come. I do plan to trade-up some legacy products and give some to the family and move forward with Sonos, with what I still think is a great audio system. (...but It’s each to their own, I guess).

D
Userlevel 7
Badge +5


Sonos has created all of this confusion by not having a plan to announce to its customers. Now we have to wait weeks or months for clarity.

The worst part is that i bet Sonos already have a clear plan of what they are going to do.

 

They just won’t share it with us, because they know the backlash will be bad.

They released this fluffy “lets se what we will do” to keep people guessing, while they cool down, and then they hope, that come may, everyone will have forgotten about this.

 

Their problem is that what they are trying to “sell” is unsellable, so they try to be super vague about it in the hopes, that some people will be in doubt and thus not as angry as if they were told flat out.

C
Userlevel 1
Badge +1

The worst part is that i bet Sonos already have a clear plan of what they are going to 
They just won’t share it with us, because they know the backlash will be bad.They released this fluffy “lets se what we will do” to keep people guessing, while they cool down, and then they hope, that come may, everyone will have forgotten about this.


That’s a lot of heavy speculation on your part. It may be true but Occam’s Razor suggests that they probably don’t know for sure because they boned up with the initial announcement and probably had a roadmap dependent on that plan. Now they are scrambling to walk it back because they saw the fallout. Management has committed their developers to something and I expect they are now off trying to figure out how to implement it. That’s how it typically works in every company I’ve ever worked at. 

O
Userlevel 2
Badge +1


Naturally, we must go forward, but it has to be done in the right way. Sonos has created all of this confusion by not having a plan to announce to its customers. Now we have to wait weeks or months for clarity. That’s not good business practice as it stops most from buying more Sonos. Even on social media when Sonos release a tweet or instagram post, the negative response is not going to help them replace the pause in purchases by its current customer base.

Sonos have the data and my guess most are streaming music, listening to radio and NAS media servers. So just provide a box to allow these services to continue. A box that can be updated with the latest firmware etc. Many would buy it imho. 
 

As someone mentioned earlier, have a discount to upgrade based on how many units and years you have been a customer. The longer you’ve been a customer, the higher the discount. 
 

The issue isn’t technology progressing. It’s the haphazard way Sonos has communicated this with no plan and seemingly not thinking about their very loyal customers who have been their best brand ambassadors. It’s not rocket science. 

Again I agree with some of the viewpoints mentioned here, but just as an example, someone who trades-up say a single play 5 (gen1) against one of the more expensive Sonos ‘speaker-sets' can save ‘almost’ $500 discount off that purchase and that seems to be rather a good saving to help ‘float the boat’ a little. I personally like the fact all customers are treated equally, both new and old, however that’s just a personal thing.

As an aside, I also recently saw mentioned by some long-term 'regular' users here in the community, that it’s perhaps time for a new playbar and/or PlayBase (or HT Center Speaker) from Sonos too, later this year… so I might keep my fingers crossed for those type of devices to show up, as I’m (perhaps) in the market for that type of device. (with 30% off..?). 🤞

Anyhow, I think Sonos could have chosen to put out the message in this way in order to ‘listen’ and gauge customer reaction and to study what their users truly want ...and to see how it fits in with their proposed action, or if they can maybe alter/adjust a few things perhaps to maybe able to suit the majority.

Yes, of course, I think Sonos underestimated the reaction, once the message spread, which was not helped by so much misinformation and lots of untruths spreading quickly online (accidentally, or in some cases, maliciously, perhaps?), but it does mean they have to now ‘sort the wheat from the chaff’ to then produce their chosen planned course of action. I think waiting until May is fair enough.. I’m sure there is a lot of work to do between 'now’ and 'then’.

Sadly, some people appear to be extremely impatient at the May-delay and from some posts I’ve read within the numerous threads here, seem to get themselves rather worked up over such issues. I prefer to not stress over such things and having music on around the place helps. My glass still remains 'half full’ on these matters. I’m fairly confident our Sonos system will continue to play here at home for a good many years still to come. I do plan to trade-up some legacy products and give some to the family and move forward with Sonos, with what I still think is a great audio system. (...but It’s each to their own, I guess).

It's a rather negative pov you have of your fellow customers. 

TBH the misinformation I keep seeing posted is the Sonos surrogates such as yourself who pretend it's all no big deal.

It's rather tedious to keep seeing massive walls of text with one posters opinion on how it's no big deal to wait till May, it's no big deal cause you can spend 1k to trade up to a bundle, it's big deal cause I trust SONOS.

Ken_Griffiths

It's a rather negative pov you have of your fellow customers. 

TBH the misinformation I keep seeing posted is the Sonos surrogates such as yourself who pretend it's all no big deal.

It's rather tedious to keep seeing massive walls of text with one posters opinion on how it's no big deal to wait till May, it's no big deal cause you can spend 1k to trade up to a bundle, it's big deal cause I trust SONOS.

I guess such things must work both ways then, as I’ve also seen the ‘trolling’ misinformation you have spread about the community here too.

You appear to have seen/read a great deal of things, since you suddenly became a forum member here on the 3rd February 2020, most of your chat, in your 19 posts so far, has been about the Sonos devices being ‘obsoleted’, which clearly reflects too in your chosen username.

No mention of anything being 'obsoleted' in any of the Sonos announcements, well not in the way that you claim will happen in May, in fact it’s mostly all about keeping the devices running for as long as it is practicable to do so. You’re not fooling any of the regular members around here.

O
Userlevel 2
Badge +1

It's a rather negative pov you have of your fellow customers. 

TBH the misinformation I keep seeing posted is the Sonos surrogates such as yourself who pretend it's all no big deal.

It's rather tedious to keep seeing massive walls of text with one posters opinion on how it's no big deal to wait till May, it's no big deal cause you can spend 1k to trade up to a bundle, it's big deal cause I trust SONOS.

I guess such things must work both ways then, as I’ve also seen the ‘trolling’ misinformation you have spread about the community here too.

You appear to have seen/read a great deal of things, since you suddenly became a forum member here on the 3rd February 2020, most of your chat, in your 19 posts so far, has been about the Sonos devices being ‘obsoleted’, which clearly reflects too in your chosen username.

No mention of anything being 'obsoleted' in any of the Sonos announcements, well not in the way that you claim will happen in May, in fact it’s mostly all about keeping the devices running for as long as it is practicable to do so. You’re not fooling any of the regular members around here. 

Hi Ken name calling and ghettoizing my length of time on the community is very small minded. I'm not going to take the bait.

Smilja

@Obsoleted, do you actually own any Sonos gear? In other words – are you actually a customer?

»And the world is like an apple whirling silently in space, Like the circles that you find in the windmills of your mind.« (›Windmills Of Your Mind‹ [1967]. Music by Michel Legrand ; English lyrics written by Alan & Marilyn Bergman)
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