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Using Sonos as PC Speakers

Using Sonos as PC Speakers

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Userlevel 6
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I Bluetooth my Roams to my laptop from time to time and there is a very slight lag but I don’t notice it too much when watching YouTube on the PC

Userlevel 7
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Hi @SarahN 

It can be difficult to perceive as our brains have evolved to cope with sight and sound being slightly out of sync due to distance and the difference in the speed of light versus that of sound - as with most things that might “weird us out”, the brain just edits it out (like the fact that our eyes wobble when we move them). Interestingly, this only works one way - we are not at all used to hearing before seeing, so if the picture were to be behind the audio, it would be much easier to notice.

Thanks for sharing your experience, though!

Userlevel 6
Badge +14

No probs @Corry P 

To be honest, I find worse sync issues (only very occasionally) when watching certain things on my telly with my Beam HT set up. Mostly BluRay disks which I correct with the setting in the app.

I Bluetooth my Roams to my laptop from time to time and there is a very slight lag but I don’t notice it too much when watching YouTube on the PC

 

I tried this with my TV and the lag was too much for me.  It could very well be that the TV isn’t very efficient at transmitting bluetooth as your PC. 

Or, as @Corry P explain it, my brain is not as evolved as yours. 🙄 

 

Anyway, I’ll be interested in trying out the TV to Era 300s via bluetooth  when the speakers arrived to see if my Neanderthal brain can handle it.  I’ve realized I pretty much never watch TV in that room, and when I do, stereo is just fine.  If BT works, I’ll be getting rid of the Beam G1 and play:1s.  If it doesn’t work, I’ll keep the Beam.

Userlevel 3
Badge +3

And the reason they can’t do what you describe using 5 GHz is because the low-latency 5 GHz connection cannot penetrate the walls/floors as well as the buffered 2.4 GHz signal, so once again, grouping is impossible.

So what it comes down to is you want dedicated computer speakers that cannot be grouped with the other Sonos speakers in your home.  There’s plenty of those around, go buy some.  

What I am describing is two different modes:

  1. PC Mode: no delay, line-in mode where Left and Right speakers are connected over ad-hoc 5GHz (not grouped over walls/floors)
  2. Regular/Current Sonos Mode: 75ms+ delay, desktop pair can be grouped / ungrouped with the rest of Sonos ecosystem

I hope that makes sense

But you can send TV audio line-in to other rooms/zones (non-rear/sub) devices and not introduce latency, it stays in sync to whats on the TV.  If they handled all line-in like they do their HDMI input line in it wouldn’t be an issue, and it honestly has nothing to do with the wireless rears or sub (or wireless L/R pairing).  Granted Sonos may indeed be doing something with HDMI 2.0 eArc on capable models to ensure lipsync, as eArc supports a lipsync feature but the Ray and Beam 1 (or Sonos Amp) don’t support it.  I use the HDMI optical adapter with the HDMI input on the Amp for a second line-in for a CD player (turntable is on the RCA line-in) and it doesn’t have the same delay as the turntable line in, and can be grouped to other areas just as well...

But you can send TV audio line-in to other rooms/zones (non-rear/sub) devices and not introduce latency, it stays in sync to whats on the TV.  If they handled all line-in like they do their HDMI input line in it wouldn’t be an issue, and it honestly has nothing to do with the wireless rears or sub (or wireless L/R pairing).  Granted Sonos may indeed be doing something with HDMI 2.0 eArc on capable models to ensure lipsync, as eArc supports a lipsync feature but the Ray and Beam 1 (or Sonos Amp) don’t support it.  I use the HDMI optical adapter with the HDMI input on the Amp for a second line-in for a CD player (turntable is on the RCA line-in) and it doesn’t have the same delay as the turntable line in, and can be grouped to other areas just as well...

 

You either didn't read what was posted, or you didn't understand it.  Either way, I'm not going to argue with you.  Go ahead and keep thinking there is somehow Sonos is able to overcome the laws of physics but doesn't do it because it has some hatred of people who want to use their products are computer speakers.  

PS - In your example above, the CD player output is delayed ~70 ms when sent to other rooms.  The line in is delayed 70 ms to all rooms.  So there is a difference.  Why you don't sense it is another question, but it's there.

Userlevel 3
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I can guarantee there is not a 70ms (I think you mean 75ms) delay in grouped tv audio sent to other zones…

I just tested this, watching a lip sync vid on youtube via ATV4K…  played out Arc (that is paired with L/R rears and a sub for a fulll 5.1 setup) and then grouped via the Sonos app to a Move I sat next to the TV to test this.  They were in sync… and definitely not 70ms delayed from the video… which is what I would expect if Sonos adds 75ms to it because its grouped with another zone.  I could group and ungroup and it stayed in sync.

No argument that Sonos adds 75ms (minimum) to RCA line-in, but they do not do so to their hdmi line-in source.  Maybe because its all digital and can be fed wirelessly right away without building a buffer i don’t know…

 

 

 

 

 

I can guarantee there is not a 70ms (I think you mean 75ms) delay in grouped tv audio sent to other zones…

I just tested this, watching a lip sync vid on youtube via ATV4K…  played out Arc (that is paired with L/R rears and a sub for a fulll 5.1 setup) and then grouped via the Sonos app to a Move I sat next to the TV to test this.  

 

 

Is this actual TV audio, where the source is coming in through the Arc HDMI port (HDMI-ARC) are were you getting audio from the ATV4K via airplay?  Airplay would limit you to stereo only and would not have any latency, as you are claiming to see.  An HDMI connection would have show a latency in group rooms.

 

They were in sync… and definitely not 70ms delayed from the video… which is what I would expect if Sonos adds 75ms to it because its grouped with another zone.  I could group and ungroup and it stayed in sync.

No argument that Sonos adds 75ms (minimum) to RCA line-in, but they do not do so to their hdmi line-in source.  Maybe because its all digital and can be fed wirelessly right away without building a buffer i don’t know…

Sorry, but this is just wrong.  I’m not trying to claim you aren’t hearing what your hearing, but Sonos official statements, my personal experience, and others,  contradict yours.  If you aren’t using airplay, then perhaps you’re brain isn’t recognizing a difference and blending it together.  That’s certainly been the case for other people who don’t even notice a lag with line audio.  Others absolutely do.

Regardless, any body attempting to group TV audio across multiple rooms should know that the rooms will not play in perfect sync.  Whether that bothers them personally or if they even notice it is a different matter, but a significant, perhaps majority, of people do notice and find in doesn’t work for their needs. 

I can guarantee there is not a 70ms (I think you mean 75ms) delay in grouped tv audio sent to other zones…

I just tested this, watching a lip sync vid on youtube via ATV4K…  played out Arc (that is paired with L/R rears and a sub for a fulll 5.1 setup) and then grouped via the Sonos app to a Move I sat next to the TV to test this.  They were in sync… and definitely not 70ms delayed from the video… which is what I would expect if Sonos adds 75ms to it because its grouped with another zone.  I could group and ungroup and it stayed in sync.

No argument that Sonos adds 75ms (minimum) to RCA line-in, but they do not do so to their hdmi line-in source.  Maybe because its all digital and can be fed wirelessly right away without building a buffer i don’t know…

 

 

There is a delay to any room grouped with a TV source, that room will have a discernable lag behind the home theater room.  This is indisputable, and confirmed by dozens of threads here.  The reason for this has been discussed many times in this thread, and is the very reason Sonos cannot make a lag free analog line in (and has nothing to do with any ADC/DAC going on).  Read the thread before speaking definitively on this subject again.

Userlevel 1
Badge +2

Hi everybody,

 

For my part,  I have been using for a while 2 Era 100 in stereo pair, connected to my computer with a single adapter.

The latency of 75ms does not bother me, I only listen to music. I even tried with a video and the lag is barely perceptible.

On the other hand, as the adapter is only connected to one of the two Era 100s, is the sound reproduced is realy in stereo on the pair? (I can't quite hear the difference).

because I can't find the information if the jack input of the adapter is stereo?

 

Thank you for your answers

 

Small update...
I posted too fast (and thought too slowly...) 😅
I just realized I could try with a stereo test on Youtube. And finally the sound is well sent in stereo in pair of Era 100 👍

Userlevel 6
Badge +11

I’m still a little confused by this thread.

If I connect my roam via bluetooth to my PC, I observe a delay, is this the 75ms ‘sonos’ delay?

Reason I ask is when I connect a UE Megaboom via bluetooth that is around 7-8 years old, and I don’t observe a lag.

I fully understand the 75ms line in delay, but does this 75ms also apply to a direct bluetooth connection to Roam, ie the bluetooth connection is treated in same way as a line in connection?

 

I’m still a little confused by this thread.

If I connect my roam via bluetooth to my PC, I observe a delay, is this the 75ms ‘sonos’ delay?

Reason I ask is when I connect a UE Megaboom via bluetooth that is around 7-8 years old, and I don’t observe a lag.

I fully understand the 75ms line in delay, but does this 75ms also apply to a direct bluetooth connection to Roam, ie the bluetooth connection is treated in same way as a line in connection?

 

Just a guess, but since the Roam can be used as a Bluetooth input when grouped with other Sonos speakers, then the same buffer is needed for the Bluetooth input as for the Line-In input.  

Userlevel 6
Badge +11

Just a guess, but since the Roam can be used as a Bluetooth input when grouped with other Sonos speakers, then the same buffer is needed for the Bluetooth input as for the Line-In input.  

Yes, I agree. I also blocked the Roam from my WiFi, restarted the Roam to simulate a ‘standalone’ bluetooth speaker, I still see the ~75ms, even when its unable to group the input with any other Sonos device.

 

 

Userlevel 6
Badge +11

I​​​​​​

A quick note on Play:5, Five, Connect:Amp, Port, Connect, Era 100 & Era 300

While it is possible to use these players with a PC by connecting to their line-in ports (Era models will need the USB-C adaptor), this isn’t a recommended solution if you’re planning on doing something that requires audio/video synchronization. There will be a minimum of a 75ms delay on the audio due to the signal processing performed on the line-in side. If synchronization isn’t an issue for you, you can simply connect the device to your PCs headphone or line out jack like you would a pair of regular headphones.

 

 

 

 

Maybe the above should be updated to include Bluetooth & Roam, as it appears bluetooth is treated same as line-in based on my tests.

 

Userlevel 2

I want to do the following connection: Mac mini --- Sonos AMP --- passive bookshelf Speakers. Will I get the dreaded delay? Thanks

 

P.S. The article by James L. says the delay is with the Connect:Amp. Also, lots of great content above.

Userlevel 7
Badge +23

I want to do the following connection: Mac mini --- Sonos AMP --- passive bookshelf Speakers. Will I get the dreaded delay? Thanks

Depends how they are connected.

You can’t connect the Mac Mini directly to the AMP via HDMI, you need to send the Mac Mini to a TV then use the HDMI-ARC output of your TV to the AMP.  No delay.

If your Mac Mini has optical output you can also use that with the optical adapter. No delay.

You can use the analog input of the AMP, but then you’ll get the delay.

If you Airplay from the Mac Mini I think you’ll get the delay, but I’m honestly not sure about that.

Userlevel 2

I want to do the following connection: Mac mini --- Sonos AMP --- passive bookshelf Speakers. Will I get the dreaded delay? Thanks

Depends how they are connected.

You can’t connect the Mac Mini directly to the AMP via HDMI, you need to send the Mac Mini to a TV then use the HDMI-ARC output of your TV to the AMP.  No delay.

If your Mac Mini has optical output you can also use that with the optical adapter. No delay.

You can use the analog input of the AMP, but then you’ll get the delay.

If you Airplay from the Mac Mini I think you’ll get the delay, but I’m honestly not sure about that.

 

Thanks controlav. Airplay should have a small but noticeable delay. Shame about the complicated HDMI and analog delay as my Mac mini (M1) does not have the optical out. Looks like I will have to get something that is not Sonos which works well for this.

 

Thanks again.

Userlevel 7
Badge +18

Hi @Str8rydder & @craigski 

I have updated the original post so Amp is included in the list of devices that will induce a delay - thanks for pointing it out!

Hello There, I got the Ray, i’m trying to connect it to my computer, but my computer does not have the optical port, it only has a audio type c. I bought an adapter USB AUDIO CONVERTER OPTICAL AND 3.5MM, I plug it into my type c and a usb port but there is no audio coming out, my computer does detect that there is a speaker plug it and even has the green audio lv going up, Any tips? I was going to return this but I really want to make it work. Much would be appreciated thank you.

I bought this one for $20 on Amazon and it works great on my MacBook

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09QFYNB7Y?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details

Make sure you get the “output” version and not the “input” as those are uni-directional.

Thanks for sharing this!  Sounds like there are some draw backs to this (i.e., cannot control volume).  Are there other alternatives? I must admit, audio has always been very confusing for me to fully grasp.  But I’m essentially in a similar situation as Johnson, bought the Ray as soundbar for my 49 inch ultra wide monitor setup.  But running into trouble because my Windows PC does not have optical out.  It only has 3.5MM jack and USB ports (1 C, and a ton of A’s).  Do I need to get a AUX to Optical converter? (like one of these https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07W5GNZX5)  If so, does anyone have recommendations (ideally ultra small footprint and from a credible brand, Amazon has a ton of cheapo Chinese ones, who knows what type of security it has).  Or do I need to get a dedicated sound card with optical out…?

Really don’t want to have to return this, the PC soundbar market is kinda meh for the most part.

Hi @skho01 .  The adapter looks like the right sort of thing.  It appears that you would need a 3.5mm jack to RCA (red/white) cable to connect the TV to the adapter. then a standard optical cable from adapter to Ray.  

I cannot see you getting anything better than stereo out of this, which may be adequate for your purposes. If not, then a sound card with optical out would give you multichannel output.

I think you may have to settle for an unrecognisable Chinese brand.

@John B thanks for the quick response!  I guess I’m not following the 3.5mm → RCA → Adaptor → Standard optical cable → Ray.

No way to skip the RCA bit? feel like I need another adaptor for 3.5mm to RCA.

What other draw backs are there with the adaptor?

  • Stereo only
  • volume control

I guess I’m just trying to understand which features I’m foregoing using an adaptor vs. sound card.  Any expert opinion here would be much appreciated.

 

I have this old sound card with a S/PDIF optical adaptor, do you think it would still be Stereo only?

@John B thanks for the quick response!  I guess I’m not following the 3.5mm → RCA → Adaptor → Standard optical cable → Ray.

No way to skip the RCA bit? feel like I need another adaptor for 3.5mm to RCA.

 

The adapter you linked  has an RCA input and your computer has a 3.5mm jack output.  So you need a cable with a 3.5mm jack at one end and an RCA connector at the other.  There is no adaptation or conversion involved here.  How else are you going to connect the two devices?

What other draw backs are there with the adaptor?

  • Stereo only
  • volume control

I guess I’m just trying to understand which features I’m foregoing using an adaptor vs. sound card.  Any expert opinion here would be much appreciated.

 

You aren’t foregoing anything by using the adapter.  You are losing multichannel sound because you are using an output connection that is only capable of handling stereo.

 

 

 

Ah makes sense.  I decided to get an optical soundcard, the ASUS Sonar SE.  Let’s hope this works.

 

I tried plugging in my old ASUS Sonar DX, it has a SPDIF out.  I used a 1 x S/PDIF Header and it doesn’t work :(

Hello!

In a setup with Bean Gen 2 + Sub + Amp with 2 in-ceiling connected with the optical cable to a Mac Studio, would we be able to get 5.1? Or would this just be stereo?

 

I’d like to be able to play games or watch movies with surrounds from the Mac Studio but I’m not sure if the optical adapter will be detected by MacOS as a multi-channel output or just 2 channel stereo.

 

Thanks!

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