Enjoying my new Sonos 5.1 setup playing music remastered with Spatial (7.1) mix. The Atmos overhead channels are missing but what surround goodness that's decoded is interesting. The sound stage is either a 70's 'Quadrophonic' thing with lots of swirling motion and panning. Or with classical, it drops you inside the orchestra (as a member) with the violin section behind you and low brass in front. Very different from 'I'm sitting in the audience' staging.
I like the depth and effect for movies so why not music? Well, it still is kinda weird to me. Almost distracting hearing the stuff they remastered into a mix that never was mixed for 7.1. Like remixing makes what was intended more better by blowing it out in some sorta spatial dimension. I confess some new stuff mastered first as 7.1 and yeah, Pink Floyd tunes sound pretty cool. Will there be a transition for most music out there to be remastered? I dunno, but Dolly and Johnny should be left in two-dimensional space! :)
Is 'Spatial' audio a good thing or just a passing fad?
Considering how far back (1960s or a bit earlier) multi-channel sound goes, and how many people were willing to pay for it, I’d say not passing. The problem back then was complexity, competing systems, and bang for the buck, the last was the worst issue.
In the late 60s I had a four-channel reel to reel deck and four channels of amplification and speakers, a cobbled together mess of stereo components but when tweaked properly is taw awesome. Almost nothing available and the tapes didn’t last long. After they became available I had several of the early vinyl based Quad systems, CD-4, SQ and QS. While more material was available it was a tiny fraction of the current releases. So many formats and so few universal decoders that folks couldn’t see what to buy and didn’t. Jumped on SACDs and bought every one I found listenable. Again, only a tiny fraction of what was being released was in the format.
The 5.1 revolution is the first one to gain a solid footing and have enough material in the format to sell to a wider audience. Spatial, particularly Atmos is expanding on that and provides an experience that is good enough to get folks to pay the small premium to upgrade to it.
+9Talking about music I think the difference is big, and I love listening music in Dolby Atmos. You feel instruments coming from different directions in different heights and I think it improves a lot the experience.
About films, I don’t think the difference is so wide, because a 5.1 is already quite good, but perhaps I have not I listen enough films. Watching “Last of us” I switched 5.1 and Atmos and I couldn’t find a big difference.
Hard to tell. It might be like 3D video…
Considering that every movie theater has Dolby Atmos sound as well as premium movie streaming services I’d say Spatial Audio is here to stay. As far as music is concerned it really depends on two things:
- Quality of the recording as with stereo there are good and not so good
- Do you prefer traditional 2-channel audio (stereo) coming from the front or enjoy instruments seemly positioned front, rear, left, right and overhead.
As far as Sonos is concerned they still offer tradiotnal stereo speakers like the Five and Era 100 or you can opt for Era 300’s which produce Spatial Audio as well as tradiotnal stereo.
For movies Sonos offers the Arc Ultra and Beam2 for Dolby Atmos (Spatial Audio) as well as Stereo reproduction. Although I’d never purchase the aforementioned for traditional stereo listening because IMO they add additional color that wasn’t in the original stereo recording. JMO.
- Quality of the recording as with stereo there are good and not so good
- Do you prefer traditional 2-channel audio (stereo) coming from the front or enjoy instruments seemly positioned front, rear, left, right and overhead.
Thinking how the competitive music market may be driven to add spatial content as a more premium product. Looked over Amazon and Apple’s libraries of current 3D content. Not many albums or playlists are to be had today. But they both tout and advertise more 3D goodness is coming. I think having the capability of 3D will be the seller. They encode 7.1 as the standard offering options to listen on the user end.
Purists or 2-channel fans will retain stereo when downmixed. The spatial crowd can unleash the ‘dome of sound’ doing nothing on their theater system. 7.1, 5.1, 2.0 all available on ‘the wire’. That may be cool but it’s kinda tricky when all content is slapped, dashed, and remastered to become spacy. Good point that with any mass remixing, we hope they go for tasty quality not spacy fakery.
Spatial headphones evolved from 7.1 gaming world. Definitely groovy for Atmos movies, but think of remastered music becoming popular due to these tech toys. They will get cheaper and cheaper. Pretty sure 3D headphones and EarPods are the trigger that will make it happen. Youth influencers, marketing, and demand will drive the bus here.
Did a couple Spatial demos for my Wife and a few friends. They were impressed mentioning it’s similar to movie soundtracks they’re used to in a 5.1 setup. They don’t really miss the ‘stage’ effect from 2.0. They actually preferred the more open room thing. I’m now in agreement that depending on the music, mix, and compression, yeah, Atmos music is here to stay.
Disclaimer: I am an unqualified (read ninny) poster so please don’t invest in a vast 3D collection from said predictions. :)
Really interesting take! Spatial audio definitely has that “wow” factor, but I agree — it can feel a bit strange when older tracks are retro-fitted into 7.1 mixes that were never designed for that kind of space. Sometimes the remix adds a new dimension, and sometimes it pulls you out of the music because you start hearing placement rather than the performance.
Movies benefit from immersive sound because they’re built for environments and movement, but music is so much more intimate and intentional. When it’s originally mixed for spatial formats, it can be incredible — like you mentioned with newer releases and Pink Floyd. But when it’s forced onto classics, it can feel more like a novelty than a true upgrade.
I’m curious too whether we’ll see a big shift in the industry, or if spatial audio will stay as an optional “fun mode.” Either way, it’s cool to hear how different setups like your Sonos 5.1 bring out these nuances.
Totally agree that some classic tracks just weren’t meant to be stretched into a 7.1 universe. It can be cool, but also kinda distracting when you start noticing the “effect” more than the song.
But when a track is actually mastered for spatial from the start? Whole different story. Pink Floyd in 7.1 absolutely checks out! Dolly and Johnny though… yeah, some legends belong in good old 2D stereo.
"If however you are listening to music makes you happy, you are listening to it perfectly."
A quote from the below, worth a listen to:
+9"If however you are listening to music makes you happy, you are listening to it perfectly."
A quote from the below, worth a listen to:
Thanks for sharing! It’s really interesting, even if it makes you regret investing so much money 😅
Many of the things he says are absolutely true; in the end, you have to keep adding devices (Your TV or Arc alone are not able to deliver), increasing your budget, changing service providers (Spotify is no longer enough), or upgrading your subscription to “Premium” because Atmos isn't included in your plan… and, after doing all that things, the helicopter is still not exactly over your head 🤣
On the other hand, I do enjoy some songs remastered in Atmos, some of them because they sound better to me (Englishman in New York, i.e.) or because it’s fun to hear voices singing behind you and instruments close to the ceiling (No diggity) or because I think it fits with the song (Donna Summers’ Hot Stuff). I’m not a music expert, that’s for sure, but I’m happy, and the difference, liked or not, is noticeable.
About films, I think it isn’t. The difference with a good 5.1 is hard to find. At least for me till now.
Haha yeah, Dolly in surround would be chaos 😂
Totally get it—remastered stereo blown into Atmos can feel gimmicky. When it’s native (Pink Floyd, new stuff), it’s awesome. When it’s forced? Sometimes cool, sometimes “put the violin back in front please.”
Sonos does solid with what it gets, but missing heights limits the magic.
Eventually good mixes will win, classics stay stereo. Johnny Cash stays sacred.
What tracks blew your mind vs made you hit “stereo only”? 🎧
"If however you are listening to music makes you happy, you are listening to it perfectly."
A quote from the below, worth a listen to:
Great video and on topic. I like his soundbar comment: ‘a forcefield of ghost speakers’. Ha!
One of the YouTube comments had a point. ‘Dolby licensing patents on their prior tech is going to expire soon”. Are they pushing Atmos to regain a product?
What tracks blew your mind vs made you hit “stereo only”? 🎧
Amazon ‘Unlimited’ has 15 or so Spatial albums and playlists. They have a few Pink Floyd tunes in the 60 song ‘Rock in Spatial Audio’ playlist and Pinks are worthy the remix. Others are hit and miss most being the latter.
Something I didn’t consider was the nature, forest, outdoor soundtracks. That may be an interesting used correctly. Or, one could simply go outside? Tough stuff here!
I really enjoyed the video submitted by
Music
IMO Dolby Atmos music is smoke and mirrors or as was said in the video a bunch of phycological brain manipulation. When I attend a concert which is mainly smooth jazz the artists are up front not overhead, left/right or behind me. The only time I might imagine an instrument displacement is when the concert is contained by walls which may reflect sound to a degree. In an open-air environment, there’s no such displacement of instruments. The music is presented how the artist intends...up front in your face.😄
Movies
IMO movies are where Dolby Atmos can truly be realized for an immersive effect. However, that comes with certain conditions being met.
If your area where you intend to enjoy the full immersive effect of Dolby Atmos sound is a large open space with 12–14-foot ceilings then you will most likely be disappointed. The ideal room IMO using the Arc Ultra, dual Subs and Era 300’s is approximately 17-18-feet wide x 25-30 feet long with 8–10-foot ceiling.
My room for size mimics those dimensions. It allows for the refection's and bubble creation that Dolby Atmos in movies needs to provide full immersion. I get the sound of a helicopter flying overhead.
Does everyone need a room of the dimensions I mentioned? Of course not. However, if your space is such that there are very few reflective surfaces nearby or overhead for containment; then no Dolby Atmos sound system will be adequate.
I’m reminded of the early “ping pong” stereo records where a heavy drape was separating left and right orchestras. This easily proved it was a stereo recording, but it was hardly realistic.
Way back we had the same thing with quadrophonic, some mixes were excellent, some not.
And then there were the folks that went all out, I'm thinking the song American Woman by the Guess Who, but my brain is old and it was long ago. It was being used as a demo track in almost every audio store in Tokyo back then.
https://quadraphonicquad.com/threads/guess-who-the-american-woman-cd-4-q8.6808/
Way back we had the same thing with quadrophonic, some mixes were excellent, some not.
And then there were the folks that went all out, I'm thinking the song American Woman by the Guess Who, but my brain is old and it was long ago. It was being used as a demo track in almost every audio store in Tokyo back then.
https://quadraphonicquad.com/threads/guess-who-the-american-woman-cd-4-q8.6808/
I didn’t have quadraphonic in home but a few of my friends did. I’m talking 1971. The draw back was that the speakers had to be positioned so that the seating was dead center. Nearly impossible. I mean who placed their sofa in the middle of the room? Maybe if you had one of those 360 degree sofa’s on plush white shag carpet 😂.
Seriously, the home quad systems came and went very quickly.
Fast forward to 1976-77 quadraphonic sound made a comeback however, not in the home. It was in cars with 8-track players.
I had a quad system in my 1977 T-Bird. Ironically, cars made the perfect environment. The cabins were small and enclosed with four (4) speakers_two front and two rear. Adjustments allowed for a pusedo-elimination of vocals and/or instruments. I must say the sound was great.
However, the bulky 8-track tape enclosures gave way to small stereo cassettes tapes which also sounded the death-nell for quad systems. After cassettes came car CD systems and for a while cars had both CD and cassette players installed. I at one time had Mini-Disc in home and in my car.
Of course the rest is history. Streaming services like SiriusXM are now available in cars. CD players in cars IMO are akin to the human appendix. Still there but seldom used.
Oh...while we're waxing nostalgic and this device has nothing to do with music...let’s not forget CB radios that for a while were factory installed in cars. So at one time a car might have a CD player, cassette player and a CB radio! 😂
Ahh...the good old days...but; it's time to get back to enjoying my Sonos that has been playing smooth jazz in the background; courtesy of Spotify Lossless.
I had a quad system in my 1977 T-Bird. Ironically, cars made the perfect environment. The cabins were small and enclosed with four (4) speakers, two front and two rear. Adjustments allowed for a pseudo-elimination of vocals and/or instruments. I must say the sound was great.
Had a 60’s Pontiac Grand Prix with a spring reverb tank under the rear shelf. The thing had a chrome knob labeled Space or something you could crank the rear 6X9 into the depths of Hades. My high-school friends were seriously jealous.
“Pontiac Grand Prix offered a unique Delco Reverb (or Echo) radio option, especially popular in the mid-to-late 1960s ('65-'69), creating a spacious sound with a separate reverb box”.
Got my Wife a 2005 T-Bird convertible roadster with a Jag engine. Read: Swoop Coupe. That thing has a Bose system that I thought meh, early Bose stuff. But… there’s DSP settings in the menu. One is labeled ‘Top Down’. When selected, the L/R separation and presence is focused at ear level, maybe slightly above your head. It’s crazy and very noticeable. I demoed this for my Wife and she was blown away. The speakers are in the doors but it sims their placement in ‘Space’. Wow! Who knew?
If your area where you intend to enjoy the full immersive effect of Dolby Atmos sound is a large open space with 12–14-foot ceilings then you will most likely be disappointed. The ideal room IMO using the Arc Ultra, dual Subs and Era 300’s is approximately 17-18-feet wide x 25-30 feet long with 8–10-foot ceiling.
Nice system, okay, monster system no doubt. But gotta counter defending lesser output setups in a similar space. That being my system proved a player not a return-fest.
Reading the ‘ideal’ room size suggested made me gulp. I was close to those dimensions when shopping the brand. I have a 15’W X 19L X 8H room. Thinking reviews were all over the place so I started with a baseline product demo, I snagged a Ray, 2X 100’s and a Sub Mini. (Known as the ‘Unwashed’ bundle). :)
Figured if this thing is meh, room specs saying it was at the Max, back it goes. I used the term ‘demo’ as ordered from Amazon thinking return and upgrade might be the plan. But ended up keeping the humble ($800 sale) setup as ordered.
It can hit 79-85dB (at the ears) showing ¾ Vol on the app slider. No clipping, no distortion, no box buzzing, Basically, a nice subby kick without blooming and well balanced mids/highs. I found longer sessions are not ear fatiguing. I was indeed surprised for the room being considered ‘large’. RTL graphing reveals how well TruePlay EQing works where after optimized, this little pup has plenty of girth
I agree for Atmos pay-off, ceilings over 10’ are a problem for reflected drivers bouncing off the thing. Sonos may roll in some time delay to lessen the affect, but can only do so much to correct it. Just saying size matters but their specs are iffy. If their entry system can ‘fill’ a reasonable size room, an ARC, 300’s, and dual subs would kill it. Awesome for high level gain, maybe benchmark sound going on there. Didn’t say overkill. I’m in here for what a minimal system can do in a ‘big’ room. Definitely not comparable systems, but should a Ray setup be more than adequate in a reasonable sized space, that thing should power a stadium!
I had a quad system in my 1977 T-Bird. Ironically, cars made the perfect environment. The cabins were small and enclosed with four (4) speakers, two front and two rear. Adjustments allowed for a pseudo-elimination of vocals and/or instruments. I must say the sound was great.
Had a 60’s Pontiac Grand Prix with a spring reverb tank under the rear shelf. The thing had a chrome knob labeled Space or something you could crank the rear 6X9 into the depths of Hades. My high-school friends were seriously jealous.
“Pontiac Grand Prix offered a unique Delco Reverb (or Echo) radio option, especially popular in the mid-to-late 1960s ('65-'69), creating a spacious sound with a separate reverb box”.
Got my Wife a 2005 T-Bird convertible roadster with a Jag engine. Read: Swoop Coupe. That thing has a Bose system that I thought meh, early Bose stuff. But… there’s DSP settings in the menu. One is labeled ‘Top Down’. When selected, the L/R separation and presence is focused at ear level, maybe slightly above your head. It’s crazy and very noticeable. I demoed this for my Wife and she was blown away. The speakers are in the doors but it sims their placement in ‘Space’. Wow! Who knew?
Geeze...I thought I was old 😂.
To be clear my FATHER owned a 1964 Pontiac Grand Prix (bought new)! If you owned that GP new or used through 1969; you are definitely a charter member of the old Gezzers club in this community 😂
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