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Speaker setup, compatibility, arrangement, etc…

  • 1 January 2024
  • 25 replies
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D

I want to buy a Sonos Arc for my TV and a sub (maybe rear speakers, undecided) to create a home theater situation… also want to put a record player in the same room, would like to share that sub with it somehow and play through Sonos speakers in stereo. Originally I was thinking about getting 2 Fives to hook to the record player (in stereo) but if i link to the arc system to use the sub I’m afraid there might be issues like delay? Furthermore, I would like to install Fives in my garage and be able to play music from either the turn table or TV setup through them. How do I go about all this?

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Best answer by nik9669a 1 January 2024, 01:26

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25 replies

N
Userlevel 7
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A Sub can only be bonded to one speaker/speaker pair at a time so I you have it bonded to the Arc it’s a tedious process of unbonding from the Arc and bonding to the paired Fives, and then the same in reverse to use it again in the home theatre setup. But with two Subs you’re set…

 
The Fives have a line-in so a turntable with preamp can easily be connected to your system. 
 

The only “delay” you might experience is if you group a tv input to your Arc with other rooms. Those other rooms will have a 70msec delay, but if you can’t see the tv from those rooms you won’t know of the delay. 

Sonos speakers have a capability called grouping. Any rooms can be grouped to play a source in sync across all of those rooms (unless it’s audio from the tv, as described above).

D

I don’t have space for a bunch of repetitive parts.

 

Can I preset a 70msec delay somehow and “group” the tv setup (arc, sub combo) with the record player (2 fives) for when I want to play music to take advance of the sub? Call them 2 different rooms even though it’s the same and link them together.

 

If I make “groups” like this is it difficult to unpair them then repair repetitively? Like if I want to play a movie and not be linked to a record player with the fives?

 

If this isn’t possible I guess I could hook the record player to a “Sonos port” and play directly though the TV setup? But that wouldn’t be in stereo mode or would it? Also, I think playing through an Arc system requires having the 100s or 300s included in the combo?

 

And do I need anything special to connect to more Fives in my garage or just plug them to an outlet for power?

 

Airgetlam

As was stated, when playing the turntable input, and not the TV input, there is no 70ms delay.

Groups are easy to make and break. What’s more challenging and time consuming is making and breaking ‘rooms’.

As long as your WiFi signal reaches your garage, you’ll be fine .

Bruce
D

As was stated, when playing the turntable input, and not the TV input, there is no 70ms delay.

Groups are easy to make and break. What’s more challenging and time consuming is making and breaking ‘rooms’.

As long as your WiFi signal reaches your garage, you’ll be fine .


when you say “As was stated, when playing the turntable input, and not the TV input, there is no 70ms delay.” You mean I can “group” the turntable speakers (room a) with the tv speakers (room b) with no delay because one of the fives is plugged directly into the record player? But if I tried playing TV sounds in reverse, through the Record player speakers, there would be a delay?
 

it will all be in the same area. If I did it like my original thoughts I’d play both “rooms” at the same time (it’s just one room though).

 

Yes the garage has WiFi.

Airgetlam

The original statement, from @nik9669a, was: The only “delay” you might experience is if you group a tv input to your Arc with other rooms. [Bolded for emphasis]

Since you’re not using the input from the TV, but the line in from the turntable, there will be no delay, across any and all grouped rooms. 

Perhaps not important to you, but all Sonos analog line ins have this delay, so that Sonos can buffer the input for replay across any connected ‘rooms’. So there is a slight delay between the cartridge on the turntable and what plays on all rooms, but you’d only be aware if you were to stick your ears within an inch of the cartilage, and be able to hear it. 

Bruce
D

another option I read is “use two Fives as rear surrounds for your home theater” then I guess I could use the “Sonos port” with the record player to link to the tv’s system? Would that be best? then both systems would have more pieces in the same “room”?

Airgetlam

Yes, if you use the Sonos Fives as surrounds, the line in on them is disabled. I’m of the opinion that using Fives is overkill for surrounds, I’d use a pair of Sonos Era 100s or Sonos Era 300s, and utilize (as I do) the Five for music.

All Sonos analog line ins, including those on the Port, can be directed to play in a particular ‘room’, which doesn’t have to be the ‘room’ of the speaker they are in. If you were to use the line in on a Sonos Five, you could have that not play on the Five, but on your Arc, if you chose. The same with the line in on the Port, you chose which room it plays in. 

Bruce
buzz

When used as surrounds, the FIVE’s will be absorbed into the surround “Room”, will not be visible separately in the controller, and their Line-In will be disabled.

PORT is a great solution. All Rooms Grouped with PORT’s Line-In will be time aligned.

D

The original statement, from @nik9669a, was: The only “delay” you might experience is if you group a tv input to your Arc with other rooms. [Bolded for emphasis]

Since you’re not using the input from the TV, but the line in from the turntable, there will be no delay, across any and all grouped rooms. 

Perhaps not important to you, but all Sonos analog line ins have this delay, so that Sonos can buffer the input for replay across any connected ‘rooms’. So there is a slight delay between the cartridge on the turntable and what plays on all rooms, but you’d only be aware if you were to stick your ears within an inch of the cartilage, and be able to hear it. 

Thanks for clarifying. Basically the sound compared to tv picture would be delayed because all “analog line in’s” have this delay is the message I think.

D

When used as surrounds, the FIVE’s will be absorbed into the surround “Room”, will not be visible separately in the controller, and their Line-In will be disabled.

PORT is a great solution. All Rooms Grouped with PORT’s Line-In will be time aligned.

So you wouldn’t use the Fives in the surround system? “Absorbed” sounds negative.

 

However, you would use the Sonos Port with the record player? Then just connect the Fives through WiFi?

 

And my “grouping” the “rooms” with the port, the fives wouldn’t be absorbed?

buzz

SONOS uses the 75ms Line-In latency to allow some time to work around minor network stalls without interrupting the music. Unfortunately, 75ms is too long for TV audio because voice sync would be annoyingly poor for most viewers. For surround speakers, since they are in the same area as the TV and soundbar and are connected via a private wireless link, the latency is reduced to 30ms. This presents a dilemma when Grouping additional Rooms with the TV audio.

Airgetlam

I’ve already stated my recommendation for surrounds, and use of the Fives. 

The analog line in is the same on the Sonos Five and the Port, except for form factor. If my turntable wasn’t right next to where the Fives are, I’d use a Port. If they are right next to each other, I’d use the Five’s line in. 

Bruce
buzz

Personally, if I have the space, I prefer FIVE’s or ERA 300’s for surround because of their more robust bass response, but this is less noticeable if there is a SUB in the surround system.

D

Gotcha so the port is really only a location thing…

 

Sort of stick with my original ideas…

Room TV - ARC, and Sub (maybe add Era 100s or Sonos Era 300s)

 

Room Record Player - 2 Fives

 

Group together to get use of everything for music even though in same room… but cannot do while watching TV because of delay?

(all in same room)
 

Room Garage - more Fives

Can group that in through WiFi too for any purpose.

buzz

When used as surrounds, the FIVE’s will be absorbed into the surround “Room”, will not be visible separately in the controller, and their Line-In will be disabled.

PORT is a great solution. All Rooms Grouped with PORT’s Line-In will be time aligned.

So you wouldn’t use the Fives in the surround system? “Absorbed” sounds negative.

 

However, you would use the Sonos Port with the record player? Then just connect the Fives through WiFi?

 

And my “grouping” the “rooms” with the port, the fives wouldn’t be absorbed?

 

I guess this was a bad choice of words. I didn’t intend anything negative. I meant that the FIVE’s would no longer be visible in the controller as a separate Room because they have become components in the surround Room.

D

When used as surrounds, the FIVE’s will be absorbed into the surround “Room”, will not be visible separately in the controller, and their Line-In will be disabled.

PORT is a great solution. All Rooms Grouped with PORT’s Line-In will be time aligned.

So you wouldn’t use the Fives in the surround system? “Absorbed” sounds negative.

 

However, you would use the Sonos Port with the record player? Then just connect the Fives through WiFi?

 

And my “grouping” the “rooms” with the port, the fives wouldn’t be absorbed?

 

I guess this was a bad choice of words. I didn’t intend anything negative. I meant that the FIVE’s would no longer be visible in the controller as a separate Room because they have become components in the surround Room.

Sounds like it might be best to put everything in the “TV Room” and join the “Group” with the record player using the “Port” so then the “TV room” has surround speakers without having to buy extra.. just how I’m interpreting that then

buzz

Voice sync is a mess. TV’s, TV stations, and TV networks are very sloppy with their voice sync. Voice sync can change from channel to channel and program to program. The movie industry had this all worked out by the early 1940’s. I find that voice sync is better on movie channels than most other channels.

In some cases, once you’ve worked through sync issues inherent in the TV, the 75ms Line-In latency becomes insignificant.

D

You loose nothing using the “Sonos Port” vs using an analog line in right? That’s how I understand it. Function is the same.

buzz

When you want to listen to the turntable, you select its Line-In as the Room’s source (regardless of where the turntable is attached to the system). If you want to listen to the turntable in multiple Rooms, then Group the Rooms. Line-In and Line-Out are simply resources on the network. There is no implied connection between PORT’s Line-In and Line-Out. You could play the turntable in Grouped Rooms while sending a music service to a 3rd party amplifier through PORT’s Line-Out.

buzz

“Line-In” is essentially the same, on all boxes.

D

It seems you can’t use the stereo function with any “rooms” with an ARC? And if I can’t play in stereo then the record player needs it own designated speakers that can’t be shared with the tv while watching tv because of lag… Maybe i could still group the “tv room” with the “record player room” to take advantage of the sub in the “tv room” when playing music but I would loose the surround speakers in the “tv room”… Having difficulty sorting out how to do exactly what I’m after without having to sacrifice something… 
 

I like the Sonos because I can play music in mainly 2 areas using their system (garage and living room) while tying the tv stuff and everything together… But if I have to build 3 different rooms (even though it’s really only 2) to be able to do that, I’m not sure it’s as convenient as I originally thought anymore…

Airgetlam

Huh? Where did you come up with this idea about not being able to use stereo? I play on my Arc in stereo fairly often. Tagging along are the surrounds, which I’ve set to ‘full’ for when I’m streaming music. I can the use the relative adjustment between the two sets of speakers to emphasize, or de-emphasize one set or the other. 

 

Bruce
D

Huh? Where did you come up with this idea about not being able to use stereo? I play on my Arc in stereo fairly often. Tagging along are the surrounds, which I’ve set to ‘full’ for when I’m streaming music. I can the use the relative adjustment between the two sets of speakers to emphasize, or de-emphasize one set or the other. 

 

Read that the Arc does all stereo functions and any surrounds would just be there basically… Ideally, i would want the Fives to handle the stereo. Maybe i misread though?

N
Userlevel 7
Badge +18

The room name is just a label to identify a speaker or a set of speakers. An Arc on its own could be called Lounge, it could be labelled Home Theatre, or even Fred. A stereo-paired set of two Fives could be labelled Living Room, or Music, or Ginger. The Arc and the Fives  can physically reside in the same room of your home; it’s just a label to identify them. A guest on your wifi may want to play music in the Lounge and it’s (probably) obvious which room that is. Playing music on Ginger is less obvious, though it’s a cute idea to have Fred and Ginger playing together, in sync, as a group! 
 

The Arc has a left, centre and right speaker in the single enclosure to fulfill its function as a soundbar in a home theatre setup. So, it will play stereo because it has those left and right channels. Technically a Five is also stereo, but the channel separation is nowhere near what you get if you stereo-pair and designate one of them as left channel and the other as right channel. 
 

If you have surrounds bonded to the Arc, you can have a stereo music source play from both Arc (in stereo) and from the surrounds (egg ether a pair of Fives, Ones or Eras) also playing as a stereo pair. The Sonos app lets you adjust the relative volume between the fronts and rears, and the volume control for the room sets the overall volume. The music is, of course, in sync. Additional rooms can then also be grouped to play the same music elsewhere, also in sync. 

N
Userlevel 7
Badge +18

Since your original post started, “I want to buy a Sonos Arc…”, maybe it’s time to proceed. Buy it from Sonos and you’ll get a home trial period (in most regions - your profile doesn’t say where you are). Set it up, add the surrounds and try them out as surrounds. Unbond them from the Arc and set them up as a stereo pair in another room and try out the grouping. The flexibility and reconfiguration capability with them is great, and that may help steer you to what will suit you best - and if it’s all no good, return them within the trial period for a refund. But all will become clearer to you once you start using it. 

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