**Big WOW Factor** The Gold Standard with a Few Handcuffs

I’ve stayed out of this conversation since my first response. However, like others I don’t understand how Sonos is responsible for one having to pay for upgrades in codecs by the likes of Amazon, Apple or Spotify. Sonos at least not at the moment doesn’t seem interested in being a curator of music in the same category as those services I just mentioned. Sonos does make it so that one can choose to subscribe to a service if they desire and integrate with the App.

Setting up a share on Sonos does require a bit of tech savvy. However one needs to know how to do the same on a computer.

As far as your drive failing…how is that a fault of Sonos?

In this community people are always asking for more than what the current offerings or capabilities that Sonos can provide. Some have been implemented and some I suspect are being considered and others will never see the light of day. The bottom-line is no company can be all things to satisfy everyone.

BTW… the Sonos Five is not an advanced unit versus the Era Series. The Sub 4 is just another logical upgrade to the Sub series. The Sub Mini was the last new/advanced introduction in the sub lineup.

I understand that integration has costs, but my point is that the two tier approach often feels more like a pay to play barrier. For instance, you cannot simply play YouTube audio through Sonos unless you have a premium subscription, even though it is a standard function on almost any other wireless speaker. For users who prefer alternative apps to avoid aggressive advertising, Sonos does not even recognize them. This is why I have largely given up on playing music from my phone and have reverted to using my Nvidia Shield Pro for video and music files. It is simply more reliable.

Regarding the music library, the process is far from user friendly for those of us with modern, multi device setups. My music is not on one single machine. I have a work laptop, a business machine, and various drives. The fact that my 3TB drive ended up crashing during the fiddling required to link it to Plex just highlights the lack of simplicity. It shouldn't feel like a challenge to simply link a drive to a premium audio system.

I love the sound of this hardware, and with my Arc Ultra, dual Era 300s, and Sub Gen 3, I am finally enjoying music and movies at a level I never thought possible. But that doesn’t mean I have to ignore the culture of greed that prioritises corporate partnerships over human freedom and welfare. It is precisely because the hardware is so good that the software shouldn't be holding it back.

I have a question for those of you who have made the leap to a dual sub setup. I am currently running a single Sub Gen 3 with my Arc Ultra and Era 300s. I am curious if the Sub 4 actually offers a noticeably better sound experience compared to the Gen 3?

If you have combined a Gen 3 with a Sub 4, or moved from a single to a dual setup, could you please elaborate on the difference it made? I am particularly interested in whether it truly improves the low end detail for music or if it is mainly about the physical impact during movies. Since I only have the one sub at the moment, I would value your real world feedback on whether the investment is actually transformative for a 9.1.4 system.

I think you are missing my point about the difference between a codec and a forced subscription. For example, YouTube Music and its sister apps use the same basic audio codecs for both free and premium tiers. However, Sonos has designed the integration so that it only functions if you have a YouTube Premium account. This isn't a limitation of the audio technology itself, it is a choice to gate the hardware behind a specific third party subscription. Unless I am doing something terribly wrong, Sonos does not allow the use of alternative apps that would provide a similar experience without the "culture of greed" that accompanies these premium alliances.

Regarding the tech savvy requirements, my frustration is that it shouldn't be a challenge for the end user. I use a variety of devices including a work laptop and a business machine, so my music library isn't always accessible from one place. My 3TB drive was working perfectly with my TV before I started fiddling with the network settings and Plex to satisfy the Sonos requirements. I am not blaming Sonos for the hardware failure, but the complexity of the setup certainly didn't help.

That being said, I am still very impressed by the hardware. I am even tempted to try a Sonos Five for my bedroom, as I live in a detached property and don't have to worry about the neighbors. I am curious if it would integrate easily with my Samsung tablet or if I should look for an alternative for that room. Given how much I am enjoying the Arc Ultra set for movies and music, I suspect the Five might offer an amazing experience for a dedicated music space, despite my grievances with the software.

The use of single or dual subs depends on several factors. Some of which are:

• Room Size
• Placement in the open or behind or under a sofa
• Primary use such as movies or music
• EQ adjustment
• Your ear

I use dual subs primarily for movies the extra low end for music for me is not needed. Therefore I have a stereo pair of Fives with a single sub for music in the same room as my HT.

Difference between Sub 3 and 4 IMO does not warrant an upgrade. Although some will claim there is a difference. Here again it depends upon your ear and if the china cups rattle more 😂

I have a Sub gen 2 and a Sub 4, different rooms and different associated speakers but they sound the same to me.

My main HT Room could use dual Subs but placement for the second would be an aggravation and the single one isn't really inadequate, just a bit less impressive than the non-Sonos one it replaced.

I previously had two subs and now I have moved to the Arc Ultra and Era 300s with a single Sub Gen 3. Since I am a movie enthusiast, I do wonder if a piece of the puzzle is missing for that true Dolby Atmos spherical experience. I have heard claims on other forums that adding a second sub might cause the Arc to suppress its output, but in my view, it should actually free up the soundbar to deliver better clarity in the higher frequencies.

The idea of placing a sub under the sofa is very intriguing. I currently have my single sub hidden in the front right corner under a table. The space where my second sub used to be is still vacant. I sit at the back of the room on the sofa, so placing a second sub underneath or directly behind me for that physical vibration sounds excellent. It is a shame that Sonos does not allow us to tune each sub with its own independent EQ. Being able to set one for floor shaking impact and the other for clean acoustic detail would be phenomenal.

I have two weeks off work coming up soon, so I might look for some Sub 4 deals on the forums to see if I can complete the setup. I am also still very tempted to test a pair of Fives for my bedroom. I want to see if they can offer that same high level experience I am getting from the Arc Ultra set, but in a dedicated music environment where I can take advantage of living in a detached property.

Thanks for sharing your experience, Stanley. Since I can already hear a significant improvement in the clarity of the Arc Ultra compared to the original Arc, it makes me wonder if adding a Sub 4 would provide that truly sublime experience in sound depth. The Sub Gen 3 is certainly more budget friendly, but the newer hardware in the Sub 4 is tempting for future proofing.

My logic is that by adding a second dedicated sub, the Arc Ultra can offload the heavy lifting of the low end entirely. Even though the Ultra has its own impressive internal woofer, letting two external subs handle the bass should allow the soundbar to focus all its energy on the higher frequencies and dialogue. This should add an extra layer of refinement to the Atmos experience.
 

I am also very tempted by the idea of placing one sub directly under the sofa. If I can find a good deal on a Sub 4 during my upcoming time off, I would love to see if that physical rumble combined with the Arc Ultra's clarity finally completes the puzzle for me.

“This isn't a limitation of the audio technology itself, it is a choice to gate the hardware behind a specific third party subscription. Unless I am doing something terribly wrong, Sonos does not allow the use of alternative apps that would provide a similar experience without the "culture of greed" that accompanies these premium alliances.“

Sonos opens up it's system to anyone who wants to have their music service play through the Sonos app. What the music service does with this access is totally up to them. If Youtube has decided only the premium tier works on Sonos, you are barking up the wrong tree.

Music services that do not work from the Sonos app could be Airplayed to Sonos. Sonos does not do casting from Google, but this is a widely publicised fact, to be considered before buying Sonos.

“I use a variety of devices including a work laptop and a business machine, so my music library isn't always accessible from one place."

Not sure I understand what you expect form Sonos. Sonos expects (and has done so since the beginning) that the music library finds a home on an always on device like a NAS. Could be a computer, but most people do not like having a computer on all the time. So access from different devices should not be a problem.

Would you want Sonos to recognise a library (or multiple libraries) that is (are) spread out over multiple devices? If so, it would not be Sonos making this hard, but you. As has been said above nowadays the music library is a niche feauture, I do not see Sonos adding a feauture like that would be a niche within a niche. All for people using a maximum of 65k songs. 

My understanding is that you can define multiple locations for music library files. 

You can have at least two, I have that now BUT I haven't put any music on the second share yet to test it.

Thanks for the various insights. It is helpful to know that multiple library locations can be defined, though that doesn't change the fact that the process is far from intuitive for the average user.

To @106rallye, I must say that I find your defense of corporate greed quite remarkable. Your argument essentially suggests that since a restrictive system exists, we should simply accept it and move on. I believe it is vital to remain vocal against the hostile control and monopolistic tendencies we see in tech today. When you buy a premium product, you should own the right to use it freely without being steered into specific third party subscriptions.

Regarding your point on YouTube, it is logically flawed. If the audio codec is compatible, Sonos should allow its users to cast that audio freely from any app they choose, rather than gating the hardware behind a YouTube Premium requirement. Using your logic, if a NAS provider decided to only allow access via a premium tier on Sonos, you would presumably tell the customer they were barking up the wrong tree there too.

I am a consumer who has invested in a high end set, and I am voicing my opinion because I believe in the freedom of the user over the greed of the corporation. This culture of forced subscriptions is a larger picture that often leads to catastrophic consequences for consumer choice. I accept that my mistake led to my 3TB drive crashing, but that mistake was only possible because of the unnecessary complexity required to make a simple music library function in this ecosystem.

Regardless of the software hurdles, I still love the hardware itself. I suspect the Five might offer an amazing experience for my bedroom given my detached property, and I intend to keep testing the limits of what this system can actually do for me.

I’m just curious…what tech that you own does everything thing you want it to do and has no limitations or sandbox restrictions either self-imposed or by 3rd parties.

From what you are presenting you have to be very upset with the brand of TV you own. It may have apps for programming but you surely have to pay to access commercial free content. So do you feel the TV manufacturer has created a restrictive product that doesn’t allow you the freedom to access what you want without paying. That’s only one example.

Personally, l can’t continue in this conversation as temping as it may be. 😊

“Far from intuitive”? It’s a while since I set mine up, but I can see the option by clicking on Settings, Music Library, Add Shared Folder and all that’s then needed is to then enter the details requested. How could it be simplified or made more intuitive?