Prominent Collaborator I

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Interested in class action against sonos?

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Insofar as ways to move forward, might we be able to get a little team of lawyers together to pressure the board to respond to our concerns?

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jgatie

So company's regularly get hit with a cease and desist order for doing nothing wrong, gotcha

What is it with you and digging up posts from the past? Are you following me around like a little puppy? Do I need to smack your nose with a newspaper?

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sigh

Prodigy II

Well not sure why you are in this community chat wether to educate or just bust balls but obviously you are well educated on the matter so I do have a technical question for you because I don’t know anything about this subject but why does apple let a music service Spotify use Home Screen but not Sonos ?

Because the Spotify app is a media player that plays the music through the app. Sonos’ app is a controller, which sends commands to the Sonos hardware, which then fetches and plays the stream. You can see the difference by playing a track on each and then turning off the phone. Sonos keeps playing, Spotify will not.

Apple only allows the side buttons and lock screen to control media playing from/through the phone. Sonos got around this with a hack that played a silent track in the background, fooling iOS into thinking the app was a media player, allowing the use of the buttons and lock screen, which Sonos then hijacked to send commands to the Sonos devices. Apple found the hack and gave them a cease and desist order or they were going to pull the Sonos app from the app store.

So company's regularly get hit with a cease and desist order for doing nothing wrong, gotcha

Erm no… Sonos, Bluesound and others got hit with a notification that their applications were in violation of an Apple requirement for certifying and if they continued to be in violation the apps would be rejected and the companies therefore unable to distribute their Applications in the Apple App Store.

As far as I know it was a similar timeframe, so it looked like Apple were having a sweep through some types of apps for their own reasons.

Part of the many requirements from Apple for app approval is that standard hardware controls, such as the volume controls, don’t have their functionality changed or disabled. The volume controls are expected to change the volume of audio playing on the device, not for use as a remote control for a separate piece of hardware. When connected to another device via airplay, Bluetooth or a usb cable the volume controls are allowed because the app on the phone/tablet is still decoding the music before sending the audio stream to speakers somewhere else.

Sonos, Bluesound and others wanted to use the hardware volume controls as remote controls only so chose to implement methods to work around the requirements and change the functionality of the hardware buttons and use them purely for remote control buttons. When Apple noticed they were all told to change their apps or face rejection and removal from the App Store for being in violation of the requirements.

Having worked at numerous companies both with Apple on joint projects and as clients submitting to the App Store, Apple have poor consistency with enforcement and even interpretation at times. With so many apps being submitted and the variable amount of examination performed by Apple it is relatively easy for Apps to fly under the radar without getting caught.
Once Apple have noticed and identified a violation you can be sure they keep an eye on it though. It’s their App Store so their rules.

Spotify, and presumably Tidal, seem to have managed to walk a tightrope with their apps having both on device playback and connect remote control built into the same app, so have a legitimate use of the hardware volume controls in the app for local playback, but also manage to reuse them with Connect playback. Having said that, Spotify seems to regularly have issues with the hardware volume controls not working when using with Spotify Connect so it’s not all smooth sailing there either.

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edmountain

Prodigy I

I can't provide legal advice, but I can offer some general information. If you're interested in participating in or starting a class action lawsuit against Sonos, it's advisable to consult with a qualified attorney who specializes in class action suits. They can evaluate your situation, discuss the feasibility of a class action, and guide you through the legal process. It's important to gather as much information and evidence as possible to support your case.

Thanks AI chatbot.

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Starmont

Trending Lyricist II

So what exactly are the damages you seek compensation for in this class action suit? And are they enough to pay for the legal expenses of the lawyer(s) who take the case? Because unless you can answer those questions to the affirmative, all the melodramatic threats of lawsuits are just silly posturing.

Back here in reality, you and I have 2 choices:

Wait and see if Sonos makes right on their screwup by fixing the problems.
Sell our Sonos devices and buy something else.

So choose one.

Wrong. If a lawyer thinks it has a good chance of being profitable, it can happen. It’s the lawyers that make all the money.

No problem if the lawyers make the money and bankrupt Sonos…at least Sonos won’t be able to keep selling their garbage!

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Rhonny

Prodigy III

So what exactly are the damages you seek compensation for in this class action suit? And are they enough to pay for the legal expenses of the lawyer(s) who take the case? Because unless you can answer those questions to the affirmative, all the melodramatic threats of lawsuits are just silly posturing.

Back here in reality, you and I have 2 choices:

Wait and see if Sonos makes right on their screwup by fixing the problems.
Sell our Sonos devices and buy something else.

So choose one.

Wrong. If a lawyer thinks it has a good chance of being profitable, it can happen. It’s the lawyers that make all the money.

No problem if the lawyers make the money and bankrupt Sonos…at least Sonos won’t be able to keep selling their garbage!

Yeah, bankrupting Sonos. That’s much better than having them working on ensuring the app functions so we can all enjoy our systems in the coming years.

Moderator Note: Modified in accordance with the Community Code of Conduct.

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Starmont

Trending Lyricist II

So what exactly are the damages you seek compensation for in this class action suit? And are they enough to pay for the legal expenses of the lawyer(s) who take the case? Because unless you can answer those questions to the affirmative, all the melodramatic threats of lawsuits are just silly posturing.

Back here in reality, you and I have 2 choices:

Wait and see if Sonos makes right on their screwup by fixing the problems.
Sell our Sonos devices and buy something else.

So choose one.

Wrong. If a lawyer thinks it has a good chance of being profitable, it can happen. It’s the lawyers that make all the money.

No problem if the lawyers make the money and bankrupt Sonos…at least Sonos won’t be able to keep selling their garbage!

Yeah, bankrupting Sonos. That’s much better than having them working on ensuring the app functions so we can all enjoy our systems in the coming years.

They won’t fix it …

Moderator Note: Modified in accordance with the Community Code of Conduct.

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ACafiero

Lyricist I

I am gathering a list of individuals whose Sonos hardware has been renderened inoperable by the recent app update. If you have experienced any of these bugs which prevent devices from being registered or used on your system, please contact me directly:

"Owner must be logged in" loop bug
"Managed Networks" page empty bug
"System network unavailable" bug
"Unable to register your Sonos product" bug

Note that this class action lawsuit is not regarding missing app features removed in the recent update, but rather hardware-breaking bugs in the new software.

Yes, I am experiencing the same issues with 3 speakers.

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AjTrek1

@uprightbc @ACafiero

You do realize that the “bugs” mentioned (to foster a class-action) can ALL be traced back to network issues. The App refresh (which is now more robust) just exposed network issues that were already present; but were able to move along with the old version seemly undetected.

As an analogy I offer this….In the world of mechanics and machinery its been suggested that placing NEW parts in a mechanical device can sometimes hasten the breakdown of the remaining OLDER parts due to their inability to handle the renewed stress caused by the stronger replacement(s).

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Together Everyone Achieves More = T.E.A.M.

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Starmont

Trending Lyricist II

@uprightbc @ACafiero

You do realize that the “bugs” mentioned (to foster a class-action) can ALL be traced back to network issues. The App refresh (which is now more robust) just exposed network issues that were already present; but were able to move along with the old version seemly undetected.

As an analogy I offer this….In the world of mechanics and machinery its been suggested that placing NEW parts in a mechanical device can sometimes hasten the breakdown of the remaining OLDER parts due to their inability to handle the renewed stress caused by the stronger replacement(s).

I am kind of sick of people stating this is all network issues when Sonos SHOULD be taking responsibility for what they build. The fact is there were no network issues for many prior to the Sonos release of new apps and software updates then there are! The other FACT is Sonos sells there products to the mass market and it is not expected that every client has in-depth knowledge of networking. In fact I would bet most clients have very limited knowledge of networking. So is it now a requirement for all Sonos customers to 1. Take a networking course 2. Have network IT personnel on speed dial (because Sonos support won’t assist) 3. Be prepared to replace and update all modems, routers and other network devices (as well as reset/reconfigure all there other network devices that miraculously DON’T have any issues..ever) because Sonos does not build and beta test their releases adequately. If Sonos only wants to sell to a small market of clients that have a level of network knowledge then that is where they are headed! There are literally thousands of existing Sonos clients that are dumping and giving up on the platform! Hope the IT community can buy enough product to support the company because this attitude and lack of support/product simplicity will destroy the mass market. Only tech based mass market product I have seen that is this brutal….and YES I own an IT based SAAS company that requires network connectivity and management!!

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AjTrek1

@Starmont

Oh well…have it your way! Stay healthy 😊!

BTW…are you joining the class action 🤔😂

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Together Everyone Achieves More = T.E.A.M.

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