Why the account setup?

There is a real problem with the way sonos consider his customers. You buy some hardware serveral thousand of dollars and they consider you as a data source as if you were using a free service.

I don't want to use alexa or all this spying crap. I just want to listen to my music without being forced to upgrade (during the past year upgarde never gave me an interesting new function. NEVER). The real problem is that they render the older controller version unusable as newer version come in. For exemple the 8.5.1 controller is no more able to manager local libraries. The menu item are just greyed out !! and if you upgrade your are required to link your device to a nomnative account. It's not somethning caused by a technical problem (same hardware, same NAS ....) just a policy to force you to upgrade and spy on you.

The opt-out of data collection is not even availlable in the android app.

I just want to be able to completly opt out of ALL data collection (why the heck do they need data on my wifi network or the room names for ???). And as of support reply if they delete all personnal information my device will stop working. I want my money back !!

I think they are taking the pee. Quite frankly sonos should let us decide if we want to setup an account or not.
Pretty related – You must have an account now to add a device to your system:
Below is the conversation I had with support / customer services – You could not make it up.

Thousands of pounds.
"The register" might find this shambles of interest – I may mail them the link to the thread and see what they do with it.

Start reading from from the top.

--------------- Original Message ---------------
From: Me
Sent: 5/20/2018 4:04 AM
To: support@sonos.com
Subject: Setting up a new deviceAccount is now required!?

Dear Sonos,

I was very surprised to notice that it is now a requirement to sign in to be able to add a Sonos device. This was never the case and certainly not part of the deal when I purchased all my sonos equipment.
I would expect Sonos to work and be usable without having to sign in.

I have, over the years invested heavily in a system that I expect to work without an internet connection, in a self-contained manner and that used to include registration of new devices. This is now not the case.

If you want me to explain why the path you are following is a very dangerous one, for both, your customers and the future of Sonos, I am happy to explain, but me having to do so would be a shame.

Remove this hindrance at once, and allow those that have supported Sonos, to carry on enjoying the experience they should expect, without having to rely on your environment being up and running, and this indefinitely.

Thanks.

Your trusting customer but now very unhappy

----- Original message -----
From: Sonos Support
To: Me
Subject: RE: Setting up a new device - Account is now required!?
Date: Sun, 20 May 2018 14:29:12 +0000 (GMT)

Hello,

Thank you for contacting Sonos Customer Care. Registration of new units is a requirement in order to receive updates, and updates are needed to ensure your system remains operational.

We need to make regular updates to our software and firmware periodically in order to resolve issues, maintain compatibility with the ever-changing music services we partner with, to deploy new features, and overall make your listening experience better.

As many music services now interface directly with our API, and an account is needed in order for the API to function, all of this is a functional requirement for the streaming music system to work.

If you prefer to have your system work entirely offline, you can do so, but you will not be able to add new speakers, receive updates or support, and you will only be able to utilize locally stored music.

Please note as well that if the device you are using to control Sonos has a newer version of the Sonos app, devices on older versions will not be able to work with it. As a result, you will also need to leave your controller permanently offline to avoid receiving updates.

If you choose to use the system in this way, please note that this is unsupported, and as with any unsupported setup, we cannot make any guarantee as to the functionality of the product in this configuration.

If you have any other questions, please let me know.

Best Regards,

Sean M.



----- Original message -----
From: Sonos Customer
To: Sonos Support
Subject: Re: Setting up a new device - Account is now required!?
Date: Sun, 20 May 2018 16:08:33 +0100

Hi,

My comments below each quote

"...Registration of new units is a requirement in order to receive updates, and updates are needed to ensure your system" remains operational.
This never used to be a requirement.

"...We need to make regular updates to our software and firmware periodically in order to resolve issues"
Get it right first time - no issues to resolve then :)

"...maintain compatibility with the ever-changing music services we partner with:"
I may not always care about music services - I may be happy listening to the music I have to deploy new features
I don't need new features and overall make your listening experience better.
Experience is worse now (this also include the mobile controller interface, but that's a different matter).

"...As many music services now interface directly with our API, and an account is needed in order for the API to function, all of this is a functional requirement for the streaming music system to work."
That's pooh talk, email login to add a new device was only added recently, API interaction with your system is donkey's old - In any case, I am interested in listening to MY music.

"...If you prefer to have your system work entirely offline, you can do so, but you will not be able to add new speakers, receive updates or support, and you will only be able to utilize locally stored music."
That never used to be the case - my agreement, when I purchased my many devices was that it would work without internet

"...Please note as well that if the device you are using to control Sonos has a newer version of the Sonos app, devices on older versions will not be able to work with it. As a result, you will also need to leave your controller permanently offline to avoid receiving updates."
Tell your dev team to consider "Backward compatibility" - It is not a new concept

"...If you choose to use the system in this way, please note that this is unsupported, and as with any unsupported setup, we cannot make any guarantee as to the functionality of the product in this configuration."
Shame on Sonos

If you have any other questions, please let me know....and below

1. I have a pioneer system, it is 35 years old, it works. If pioneer go out of business tomorrow my system will still work, and I can still sell it.... I hear you say, no spotify, no this, no that... But I don't care. I purchased my sonos to play my ripped CD's and listen to TV around the house. This was the idea at the time.

2. If you guys go out of business tomorrow. I am stuck with all this equipment worth nothing, can't add to it, can't sell it. Thousands of £'s down the drain.

3. Sonos decided that If I ever move where there is no internet connection, i am stuck with what I have.

4. I have always had good things to say about Sonos, and I know a lot of people who have invested in your product as a result. I am embarrassed now to have miss advised them. I will never have good things to say about SONOS again, not ever.

5. I will say one thing: slippery slope, very slippery


You must reconsider
Looking forward to your reply

Your very unhappy customer


--------------- Original Message ---------------
From: Me
Sent: 23/05/2018 06:19
To: support@sonos.com
Subject: Re: Setting up a new device - Account is now required!?

Dear Support,

I took my time detailing why my Sonos system is no longer fit for purpose (based on the agreement we had when I purchased every bit of equipment that I now own).
What I would like to know is when will Sonos reply? From a PR perspective, ignoring customers complaints is rarely a good idea!

Thanks.


----- Original message -----
From: Sonos Support
To: Me
Subject: RE: Setting up a new device - Account is now required!?
31 May (2 months ago)
Date: Thursday, 31 May 2018 15:21

Hi There,

My name is Sarah-Jane and I am part of the Management Team at Sonos.
First I would like to apologise with this delay and I can understand your concerns with relation to the sign in prompts.

The reason why we ask you to do this is to ensure that the players are registered only to you. This is important from a security point of view and comes into play in the event of theft if this were ever to occur.

Your account isn't just a list of the devices you own, it also allows us to confirm your country of residence. This allows you to have access to music streaming services and content which is restricted elsewhere in the world.

In the past we had installers who would set up whole households across the country using their one email address.
If they were to sign up to a Beta program with Sonos or if the owner wanted something changed, the installers would be the ones controlling this.
This was becoming concerning as technically the Sonos wasn't registered to the real owners and would end up factory resetting every piece of Sonos in order to set it to the correct email account.

I hope this clarifies more understanding as to why we have put this method in place.

Please do not hesitate to contact us if you have any questions.

Kind regards

Sarah-Jane
Sonos Technical Support

[...] I just want to be able to completly opt out of ALL data collection (why the heck do they need data on my wifi network or the room names for ???). And as of support reply if they delete all personnal information my device will stop working. I want my money back !!
Are you using voice control (aka Alexa)?

It looks like Sonos is claiming their hardware back. It's not your system anymore, it belongs to Sonos and you paid for the "privilege" of using it and Sonos is doing you a "favor" by implementing a mandatory log in system, next step perhaps is "real ID", where you will have to appear in front of a representative to prove your identity.

No matter if you want to use your own library of music, have a poor or move to a nonexisting internet connection place. It's THEIR hardware now. Wait until they start injecting audio ads into your music stream, it's a free service after all... BUT NOT!

Very disappointed.

It looks like Sonos is claiming their hardware back. It's not your system anymore, it belongs to Sonos and you paid for the "privilege" of using it and Sonos is doing you a "favor" by implementing a mandatory log in system, next step perhaps is "real ID", where you will have to appear in front of a representative to prove your identity.

No matter if you want to use your own library of music, have a poor or move to a nonexisting internet connection place. It's THEIR hardware now. Wait until they start injecting audio ads into your music stream, it's a free service after all... BUT NOT!

Very disappointed.

It is still your hardware. It never was your software. And you've always had a Sonos account.

Stop clicking through those license agreements, people!

No I don't want to use voice control at all. I understand that they might need some datas for some new functionalities to work. But it's not acceptable to enforce data collection on all customers. I've not signed for this when I bought the devices and I expect them to continue to deliver the same service

No I don't want to use voice control at all. I understand that they might need some datas for some new functionalities to work. But it's not acceptable to enforce data collection on all customers. I've not signed for this when I bought the devices and I expect them to continue to deliver the same service

They are not forcing data collection. You can opt out of the stuff not needed for functionality and/or diagnostics. This opt out data is called Additional Usage Data:

https://www.sonos.com/en-us/legal/privacy#controlling-personal-information

Additional Usage Data are the following:

Performance Information. This includes things like temperature of your Product, Wi-Fi information such as signal strength, what music services you have connected to your Sonos system (including, for some services, your login username – but not password – for such service), information about how often you use the Sonos app versus another control mechanism, flow of interactions within the Sonos app, how often you use the physical controls on the unit, and location data when the Sonos app is in use, and duration of Sonos Product use.

Activity Information. This includes duration of music service use, Product or room grouping information; command information such as play, pause, change volume, or skip tracks; information about track, playlist, or station container data; and Sonos playlist or Sonos favorites information; each correlated to individual Sonos Products.


Functional Data are the following:

Registration data. This data includes your email address, location, language preference, Product serial number, IP address, and Sonos account login information.

System data. This data includes things like Product type, controller device type, operating system of controller, software version information, content source (audio line in), signal input (for example, whether your TV outputs a specific audio signal such as Dolby to your Sonos system), information about wifi antennas, audio settings (such as equalization or stereo pair), Product orientation, room names you have assigned to your Sonos Product, whether your product has been tuned using Sonos Trueplay technology, and error information.


They also collect audio information such as Alexa commands or Trueplay tuning, but they are not stored, only processed.

Oh and by the way, you most certainly did sign up for this when you bought the device and registered it. You also signed up for a software license that allows Sonos to change policies at any time.

I can read and I have already read all this. You can't opt out from what they call "functional data collection" and you now need to link to a nominative account. All this is pure marketing crap to suck datas from us. Technicaly this kind of system might be able to work completly offline. They certainly do not need to collect "information about wifi antennas, audio settings..." and require it to be linked to a nominative account to just be able to play music from a local NAS.

I was a big fan of their product and even make some of my friends buy some. But as the time go, the mobile app get worse and worse, the privacy policy worse and worse and we reach a breaking point with the lastest version where you are forced to link a nominative account. What can be be acceptable for a free service is not when you spend serveral thousand of dollar.

If your system stops working and you want them to support it, they most certainly do need that information and everything else under "System Data". System Data is collected when you submit a diagnostic, which is entirely voluntary, but is part of the warranty and support process and thus listed as non-opt out.

And Sonos has always required an account.

This is complete nonsense. Can you confirm that sonos is NOT using any subscriber data (like listening profile) to sell it to advertisers ?