Enthusiast I

Sonos support for Apple Music's Lossless Audio

Forum|Forum|5 years ago
May 17, 2021
153 replies
92048 views

Announcement: https://www.apple.com/ca/newsroom/2021/05/apple-music-announces-spatial-audio-and-lossless-audio/

Now that Apple Music has joined the “lossless club”, can we please hear from Sonos as to whether this will be supported, and, if it will be, approximately when that may occur?

Thanks.

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A

Alex_34

Contributor I

Nothing is ever Sonos’s responsibility. Not SMB 1, not the bugs in Alexa control, not the Roam battery life debacle.

So of course we need to “ask Apple.”

M

Marc_51

Enthusiast II

I can definitely hear the difference between playing lossless via the Apple Music app on my MacBook connected to my DAC via USB compared to playing the same song on the Port. This is my workaround at the moment and it works pretty well. From a convenience point of view I would prefer Sonos to implement lossless Apple Music via the app so I can use it on the Port instead. Let’s hope they can get this sorted soon.

C

cmwardnyc

I can definitely hear the difference between playing lossless via the Apple Music app on my MacBook connected to my DAC via USB compared to playing the same song on the Port. This is my workaround at the moment and it works pretty well. From a convenience point of view I would prefer Sonos to implement lossless Apple Music via the app so I can use it on the Port instead. Let’s hope they can get this sorted soon.

As long as you remember to set the bit output in the midi app then you should be in better shape this way. But, I don't know if Sonos outputs lossless (cd quality) as standard when using Apple Music. Apple may get round to making AM better to implement after iOS15 and Music Kit roll out.

C

cmwardnyc

Nothing is ever Sonos’s responsibility. Not SMB 1, not the bugs in Alexa control, not the Roam battery life debacle.

So of course we need to “ask Apple.”

You could be right. But, my understanding is all the audio manufacturers have their hands tied and must wait for Apple.

C

cmwardnyc

I can’t hear the difference between ALAC lossless and AAC lossy files on Sonos equipment let alone Hi-Res so suspect it is just marketing whcih is still relevant given tthe move of the main music streamer services to hi-res. Personally it needs some hign end equipment before I can hear the difference between lossy and lossless.24 bit files do sound better on hifi but suspect they are just better original recordings and i can’t hear the difference with hi res sample rates on hifi. So personally don’t see any benefit between lossy and lossless on Sonos let alone hi res but dramatic improvement in listening pleasure on hifi. My conclusion is it just isn’t relevant on Sonos from a listening poin tof view because it isn’t hifi but that is absolutely no criticism of Sonos because it doesn’t claim to be hifi. . .

Equipment is nice and all that, but the mastering of the file and your listening setup (room, how you are listening e.g. doing housework and its on in in the background) is a lot more important. Crappy mastering makes hi-res sound meh, great mastering can make cd quality awesome (I used to be a member to B&W Society of Sound and the mastering on those albums was just fantastic so cd quality sounded fab). Great speakers sound poor in a room with lots of surfaces that reflect sound etc. or big floor standers with no room to breathe etc. sound bad too. I do agree hi-res is a bit of a gimmick, there is so little true hi-res content, i.e. content mastered in the studio in that file format. Lossless (i.e. CD quality) is a much bigger deal here, Apple offering that at no cost is a great deal for consumers, like if you care go nuts and play that, if not then be happy and stick with AAC.

K

Kumar

I do agree hi-res is a bit of a gimmick, there is so little true hi-res content, i.e. content mastered in the studio in that file format. Lossless (i.e. CD quality) is a much bigger deal here, Apple offering that at no cost is a great deal for consumers, like if you care go nuts and play that, if not then be happy and stick with AAC.

I agree with the hi res view; note though that the head of the Apple division that is putting out lossless is on record as saying that it sounds no better than AAC from the same master in a blind test. Which is perhaps why they are not charging extra for lossless…?

On the other hand, I hear that the lossless streams play louder than AAC, all other thing being the same. So why Apple also needs to resort to this louder sounds better chestnut of a trick is a bit of a mystery.

D

djrobsd

Avid Contributor I

I’m not sure what all the fuss is here. Unless you’re an audiophile that spends $1000s on high end headphones and equipment your ears will never hear the difference. I plugged my $350 Bose headphones directly into my iPhone 12 Pro Max and turned the HD on in Apple Music and compared all my favorite songs to the same on Spotify and could not notice a difference. The other thing at play here is that unless the streaming service gets the studio master direct from the recording company this is all a moot point here.

Also, let’s not forget that the bandwidth HD audio takes up. Most cable and cell providers don’t give you truly unlimited data except on their highest end plans and playing audio in HD in addition to the 4K streaming you already do will eat it up so much faster.

C

cmwardnyc

I’m not sure what all the fuss is here. Unless you’re an audiophile that spends $1000s on high end headphones and equipment your ears will never hear the difference. I plugged my $350 Bose headphones directly into my iPhone 12 Pro Max and turned the HD on in Apple Music and compared all my favorite songs to the same on Spotify and could not notice a difference. The other thing at play here is that unless the streaming service gets the studio master direct from the recording company this is all a moot point here.

Also, let’s not forget that the bandwidth HD audio takes up. Most cable and cell providers don’t give you truly unlimited data except on their highest end plans and playing audio in HD in addition to the 4K streaming you already do will eat it up so much faster.

You don’t need to spend thousands to enjoy the sound difference, but to your point you do need to make some investment to appreciate the details. Case in point the DAC in most smart phones is tbh crap as it’s not a priority for manufacturers, so not surprised you may not hear a difference. You are bang on with the actual master of the file though, some hi-res is poorly mastered by technicians and therefore sound bad.

also totally right with bandwidth, lossless is a luxury for this with unlimited plans and home WiFi to use it. If you want lossless then best to download if you can.

C

cmwardnyc

I do agree hi-res is a bit of a gimmick, there is so little true hi-res content, i.e. content mastered in the studio in that file format. Lossless (i.e. CD quality) is a much bigger deal here, Apple offering that at no cost is a great deal for consumers, like if you care go nuts and play that, if not then be happy and stick with AAC.

I agree with the hi res view; note though that the head of the Apple division that is putting out lossless is on record as saying that it sounds no better than AAC from the same master in a blind test. Which is perhaps why they are not charging extra for lossless…?

On the other hand, I hear that the lossless streams play louder than AAC, all other thing being the same. So why Apple also needs to resort to this louder sounds better chestnut of a trick is a bit of a mystery.

One of the alleged reasons that Apple can likely offer this at no price difference is that apparently Apple requires content that is to be included in Apple Music and also required content in iTunes to come in a “hi-res” master format. So, they already have all the content.

I don’t agree that they just play louder than AAC streams, one part of having music through a wired connection is that bass etc is just more pronounced delivered that way when using a decent DAC (ie not the one in the iPhone and most other phones).

K

Kumar

I don’t agree that they just play louder than AAC streams, one part of having music through a wired connection is that bass etc is just more pronounced delivered that way when using a decent DAC (ie not the one in the iPhone and most other phones).

Why would Apple, who offer both streams, themselves say that lossless sounds no different from AAC? In blind tests?

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