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tonsure
Avid Contributor I
November 8, 2021

Apple Music lossless via S2?

  • November 8, 2021
  • 66 replies
  • 17996 views

I know this question has been asked (but apparently not answered) previously, but I thought I’d try again.

When listening to music directly through Apple Music on my Sonos speakers (via Airplay), I definitely notice improved quality with the new “lossless” quality offered by Apple. My ears, however, seem to think that the quality isn’t as high-fidelity when I listen to the same music via the S2 app (which, of course, is pulling the same music from my Apple Music subscription). However, I’m willing to admit that this perceived difference in quality may be psycho-somatic (since I’m still confused as to whether the S2 app is capable of accessing lossless files when it queries the Apple Music database).

Any chance either Apple or Sonos have provided an authoritative answer to this question? I.e. when S2 streams a file from Apple Music, is Apple giving them access to the lossless files? Or is Apple reserving those files for customers who are using the Apple Music interface? (For what it’s worth, I’ve noticed that music that I’ve listened to recently via the S2 app is showing-up on my Apple Music widget as “recently played”; so there’s definitely some background dialogue happening between the two apps).

Ps: the reason this matters— I would much rather use the S2 app to control music, as Airplay has unfortunately proven very unstable on my Sonos system (especially across multiple speakers) since moving to a new apartment—whereas S2 (for the most part) has been stable/reliable.

 

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66 replies

ratty
January 3, 2022

Bizarre that Apple wouldn’t make lossless available on such a popular and premium brand like Sonos. Crazy in fact.

I have a different issue with Apple Music, it won’t let me use the native app - which I prefer to the one in the Sonos app - with either Sonos or Echo in such a way that the music stream switches to those devices once selected on the native app, bypassing the phone once that is done, for music play.

Apple Music doesn’t enable ‘casting off’ for direct play on Sonos in the way it evidently does with Apple’s own speakers. It’s left to the reader to surmise their motives. 

January 3, 2022

Apple Music doesn’t enable ‘casting off’ for direct play on Sonos in the way it evidently does with Apple’s own speakers. It’s left to the reader to surmise their motives. 

But on the other hand, most recent Sonos products do Airplay, so some mixed signals there about working with Sonos. I don’t myself like Airplay from my experience with it before I installed Sonos, and while stability may have improved, I don't want my phone to needed for allowing its use all the time that music is playing - but that is a different matter.

So: I use a Mac bought in 2014 for the still slick UI, Android phones because iPhone pricing is ridiculous, and Spotify for music service. Horses for courses.

ratty
January 3, 2022

Apple Music doesn’t enable ‘casting off’ for direct play on Sonos in the way it evidently does with Apple’s own speakers. It’s left to the reader to surmise their motives. 

But on the other hand, most recent Sonos products do Airplay, so some mixed signals there about working with Sonos.

Not really. Whilst the original incarnations of AirPlay were Apple-only (though some reverse-engineered the protocol) Apple has since licensed the AirPlay protocol stack to those wanting to build compatible products. The implementation is therefore in Sonos’ court.

On the other hand integration of a service, especially casting direct to Sonos players, would require work on the service’s side.

January 3, 2022

Apple has since licensed the AirPlay protocol stack to those wanting to build compatible products. The implementation is therefore in Sonos’ court.

On the other hand integration of a service, especially casting direct to Sonos players, would require work on the service’s side.

Yes, but Apple still has to take the step of giving Sonos the license and thereby green light the implementation. 

On the other hand, casting from Apple Music does not work with Echo either. So it isn't just a Sonos thing from Apple. 

Corporate motives related to cost/benefit are rarely easy to discern. Often, they don't have any motive other than inertia.

PS: Spotify, as a service, casts to both Echo and Sonos. Amazon, who also sells speaker hardware, casts to Echo, obviously, but also to Sonos! 

Trending Lyricist I
January 3, 2022

Can anyone explain then what’s being played when I select Apple Music as a source from within the Sonos app?

Ken_Griffiths
January 3, 2022

Can anyone explain then what’s being played when I select Apple Music as a source from within the Sonos app?

See this support article that relates to the current Apple Service in the Sonos App:

https://support.sonos.com/s/article/3282

January 3, 2022

Can anyone explain then what’s being played when I select Apple Music as a source from within the Sonos app?

Erm...ignorance is bliss?:relaxed: As is a glass of wine...to render all music the better.

And I am pretty sure that few, if any other, in the household you referred to, are fussed about this. As they justifiably would be if the UI changed and/or made it harder for them to access the music.

Trending Lyricist I
January 3, 2022

Can anyone explain then what’s being played when I select Apple Music as a source from within the Sonos app?

Erm...ignorance is bliss?:relaxed: As is a glass of wine...to render all music the better.

And I am pretty sure that few, if any other, in the household you referred to, are fussed about this. As they justifiably would be if the UI changed and/or made it harder for them to access the music.

But that’s irrelevant as nobody else uses Music as I do.

Trending Lyricist I
January 3, 2022

Can anyone explain then what’s being played when I select Apple Music as a source from within the Sonos app?

See this support article that relates to the current Apple Service in the Sonos App:

https://support.sonos.com/s/article/3282

256 AAC - and they’re not even embarrassed to say so lol.

January 4, 2022

256 AAC - and they’re not even embarrassed to say so lol.

Nothing to be embarrassed about - see the link where the head of Apple Music says that the difference between lossless and 256AAC can’t be heard in a blind test by him, and by other Apple engineers. And why they introduced it as an offering for no extra price.

https://djmag.com/news/apple-music-head-says-he-can-t-tell-difference-lossless-audio

As to those rare exceptional 1% to 2% golden ears he refers to, in the interview he also said that even these ears will need very very high quality stereo equipment to pick up the difference. But I can’t see even that happening in a typical domestic room, even a quiet one, because the ambient noise floor is too high to allow that very small difference to be heard. High quality headphones perhaps, where these room noises are completely missing.