Though I use Plex a lot for TV viewing, on my system it was never very reliable with Sonos. The new app helped. On my system it show “No content available” when choosing Plex in the Sonos app, though it does find music via the search option. Not sure this is a Sonos or a Plex fault. I notice Plex wants to steer users to their apps (which for music would be Plexamp) that I use to cast to my Sonos speakers.

As I’m not a big user of playlists I cannot help you on that point.

Thank you for your reply.  Yes, for me my playlists are critical.  Right now as I stated with the app version I’m on, Sonos sees all my playlists when I launch Plex via the Sonos app.  That obviously means my music plays through the various Sonos devices and zones.  Before I make the switch to the newest Sonos version (meaning it’s well over a year since my last Sonos update), I need to make sure with 100% certainty that the music plays off my NAS, the playlists are all there via the Plex option in Sonos and everything is operating well when navigating my playlists and/or music.  I don’t stream. I don’t give a crap about streaming and paying companies to play music I already own or don’t care about.  

If someone can confirm this I would greatly appreciate it.  Having some screenshots would certainly help ease my caution.

Hi ​@bubbascant 

Thanks for your post!

1. Yes
2. Yes
3. Yes - some have reported issues with this, but it is likely due to local conditions. I have no such issues.
4. Any drop outs are very likely to be due to local conditions. Your computer (where you are using PlexAmp?) may well be ethernet wired, while your speakers are not. I can only guess, but I recommend you get in touch with our technical support team who have tools at their disposal that will allow them to give you advice specific to your Sonos system and what it reports. If the drop outs are due to interference, for example, they will be able to confirm and suggest some possible sources and solutions.

In the interests of full disclosure, I do believe there is currently an issue with searching Plex for tracks and with them playing - in the search results screen, the tracks are greyed out. Search results for artists and albums appear and play as normal. This has been reported to Plex.

I cannot show you screenshots of Plex working as I cannot use it due to my ISP using CGNAT (which Plex state they do not support), but here are some of my music library with playlists:

I hope this helps.

Thank you so much for the replies.  On your screen shots, the first one shows “Albums” so I’m assuming you brought up a list of albums off your local music library?  Not seeing an example in Plex is a bit of a concern for me still as that’s how I use my Sonos. 

Did you add your playlists to Sonos using their desktop app as shown below?

I don’t use that because of the song limitations because of the nearly 1,000 playlists I have. When I tried to add my playlists to Sonos Playlists as above, it only got about to the “B’s” and it was at its maximum. No more playlists could load because of the maximum song limitation. As you likely know, if a song appears in 40 playlists (which isn’t inaccurate as an example), then it counts 40 times to the song count. With 15,000+ songs and nearly 1,000 playlists, Sonos says “sorry, you’ve maxed out” (or whatever the message was).   Plex doesn’t have that problem.  

From the Sonos desktop app, here is a sampling of the playlists in my Plex. As I mentioned, nearly 1,000 playlists gives me complete control over my music which is why I have no need to stream.  On top of which, my music is in lossless and hi-res.

As for Plex having problems searching for tracks and playing them, that’s not good. You report them showing grayed out but Albums and Artists are fine. I’m assuming playlists aren’t grayed out? Or is it just the tracks within a given playlist?

As mentioned, there are a few key things that have prevented me from updating to the app since May of last year. I never updated to that app thank goodness though hopefully things are okay now.  

For me:

1. Access to my local music library residing on my Synology NAS.

2. Plex needs to be the key component as part of that which is where I select playlists or other choices (Genre, Artist, and so forth).

3. All Playlists need to show and be accessible and playback properly.

From there, I hope the playback from a zone(s) works better than it does now.  Frankly, it’s been a frustrating experience. I know technology. I build my own computers. Set up my two NAS units. The internet speed is very fast. I have many Sonos products (Arc, Move, Roam, amps...) and playback just shouldn’t be this problematic.  The network of equipment used was done with specific focus on Sonos performance. That is all working great - it’s just the Sonos deficiency in delivering playback consistently.  

When I use PlexAmp and play music from the same NAS source, I have NEVER experience dropouts or those horrific Sonos messages saying it’s lost connection and for me to check my remote access or whatever.

Sorry for my rant.  My main goal here is to make sure Sonos is going to perform as needed. If not, I’ll stick with the app version I use still before the May 2024 fiasco until I am 100% certain. I would hate to have to look at other options given the thousands of dollars I’ve invested in Sonos products.

I sincerely appreciate the feedback and hope to hear back further.

Hi ​@bubbascant 

There are a few questions there, so I’ll break them down:

Yes. I see now that you were only referring to the use of Plex, whereas I initially thought you were asking about both Plex and (Sonos’) Music Library. My apologies for the misunderstanding.

As mentioned, I cannot use Plex in conjunction with my Sonos system through no fault of Sonos, so I could not give you screenshots of that.

All my playlists are manually created by WinAMP as m3u files stored with my Music Library. As my method of doing this basically predates Music Library indexing by anyone, all my albums have a corresponding m3u playlist file. I don‘t really have any Sonos Playlists created within the Sonos app, so I cannot relay my personal experience with these.

There is a general limit of 10,000 tracks that can be stored in all Sonos Playlists combined. Once the total number of all tracks in all playlists exceeds this number, new playlists cannot be made and items cannot be added to playlists. Your speakers have fairly limited RAM and storage resources, so cannot save huge playlists in the manner of a Plex server with the resources and storage of an entire, modern PC.

As far as I am aware (after reading the documentation on this issue) it is only tracks that are greyed-out. In fact, the documentation mentions searching for the album that the track is on and playing from there as a workaround to this issue. As far as I am aware, playlists are unaffected.

I highly recommend that you update - the new app is now more successful at many tasks than the previous app ever was. We know this to be true from telemetry. There are one or two quality-of-experience additions yet to be made (some coming next week!), but many people now have no issues with operating their Sonos systems with the new app.

Other than the tracks being greyed-out (on search results only, to be clear) you should be fine.

Honestly, this sounds a lot like local electromagnetic interference. Just because your internet connection is fast, that does not mean that every wireless connection to the router is just as fast. I recommend you get in touch with our technical support team who have tools at their disposal that will allow them to give you advice specific to your Sonos system and what it reports. Though, a read of our Reduce Wireless Interference help page may save you the trouble.

Not at all - if all rants were as well thought out, I’d be a happier man!

That is our goal too! I can't give you a rock-solid guarantee that you’ll be entirely without issue (which I would not have done 2 or 5 years ago either), but things have improved a lot in the last year.

You are most welcome!

I hope this helps.

Thank you for your kind reply.  

One thing in your reply intrigued me:  There are one or two quality-of-experience additions yet to be made (some coming next week!)

Can you illuminate me on what that will be? And if not, would you be able to remember our exchange and let me know when it comes out?  Seems logical that I wait until these additions before I upgrade?

As one who is very cautious with new releases, I’m still not on iOS 18 simply because of the huge blowback to the big changes with Photos and how that is handled.  Do you think I should update my iOS before I embark on updating the Sonos when I do or would I be okay keeping the version 17.6.1 I’m on?

As for speed on my internet, I understand what you mean.  Still, a good three years ago now, all my problems were elevated to higher tier support working with Brandon, Adler, Joseph and Patrick (and one or two others as I recall), and we ended up pretty much at the place I’m at now.  I’d have to go back over all my archived exchanges (made from tickets or support calls and/or zoom type) but the problems haven’t really gone away - certainly not to the degree of what I would expect in performance.  My Move and Roam work well where I rarely have dropouts. The Move is one I can’t recall the last drop-out but I never listen with other zones - it’s in the main bathroom so that’s the only time its used. The Roam suffers when paired with other zone(s).  If I listen to Sonos in my Media room for example and no other zones are on, again, no dropouts happen.  I use Plex of course no matter what zone(s) I’m listening with.  I’m hopeful that improvements in this area will eliminate my problems. 

It really seems like the ARC is a large culprit when it’s part of other zone(s) (I don’t really listen just with the ARC). I have JBL ceiling speakers for example in the same room as the ARC and I’ll add those two together. Dropouts happen quite regularly. For example, if I skip a song, then another or two, that’s when Sonos drops. I’ve learned to wait a couple of minutes and just bring the last song playing up again and it will usually be okay.  When I add Roam (by the kitchen) to those two speakers, then it really wreaks havoc.  ARC is ethernet connected as are the 4 JBL ceiling speakers (Sonos amp), while Roam is only wireless. The media room Sonos amp is wired as well.

And I do need to add that, aside from the monetary investment, I have spent hours upon hours of my personal time trying to get this resolved. It’s a constant problem that has not been eliminated. My A/V guy worked alongside Sonos tier support and me. We did different switches, settings, changed some equipment and all sorts of things as guided by Sonos support - mostly based on the diagnostics that were sent as we progressed.  

I sure would like to enjoy listening without all these problems.  It’s not for lack of trying on my part but I think you can understand my deep hesitancy in moving to the new app given all the horrific things experienced by users.  

As has been mentioned by others, when Sonos works, it’s a beautiful thing.  But unfortunately, aside from the aforementioned Move or Media room examples where they’re isolated alone with no other zones, I’ve not experienced that beautiful thing.  :(

I appreciate your feedback.

Hi ​@bubbascant 

I cannot tell you that yet, no - I'd get in trouble. Details will be forthcoming, however.

I can’t really promise to update this thread as I may forget, but if I remember, I will.

I’m on Android so I have zero thoughts on this - it’s your iPhone. Update it or not. As far as I know, it will make zero difference to the Sonos app, which is all I am qualified to say on the matter.

As long as you encounter audio interruptions, my recommendation is to always get back in touch with our support team until they literally say they can do no more to help you. Interruptions are pretty much always the work of less-than-ideal network conditions.

If the Amp is ethernet-wired, it would be a good idea to make it the Group Coordinator (the first selected when grouping) and put it in charge of managing the playback and distribution because it will have better network transport performance.

As mentioned, I can only recommend getting back in touch for as long as you continue to see playback issues. Without diagnostics and full details of your network, I can only guess, and doing that level of troubleshooting here on the forum would likely take weeks rather than hours. I/we do feel for you - your enjoyment of your music is important to us, and we will do what we can for you, always.

I hope they can help.

Hi ​@bubbascant 

I just now learned about an issue discovered - do you have any Cisco Meraki access points, by any chance?

Do you have a link to a recent support article for Group Coordinator? I remember the suggestion to only have one zone on when I first start a playlist and then add the other(s) you want - so I’m sure this is much the same as group coordinator?  I did browse a bit just now and saw it suggested to have the GC be the one with the best signal, wired preferred instead of wifi.  I think the signal is solid everywhere in the house.  Also, since I reported MOVE and Media room playback never dropping out as examples of running independently without any additional zones, that seems to be somewhat consistent with the GC concept.  I’ll work back to doing that as I usually leave the zones most commonly used the same, meaning I leave the Amp with the JBL speakers and Fireplace room speakers on together. So each time I go to listen, I usually play from where I left off, or bring a new playlist up.

During all the work the top tier support folks involved did with me and my A/V company (he’s great, does major set ups for place like Disney World and other large projects), the one thing in my memory that kept showing up was a conflict with my Control4 unit. They had my A/V guy set up Control4 on its own mesh or something to isolate it from Sonos.  Don’t remember exactly. We covered all sorts of things and it’s certainly better than it was. 

I’ll take your lead to get back with support but right now I think I want to first update Sonos and see how performance is.  It could be much improved based on what Sonos information was released with each update since May of 2024.

As for the Cisco Meraki access points, I don’t think so. I can go back to the various invoices and look for certain but I believe the additional outdoor access point unit is a Luxul model. In the invoices I see four access points were set up not counting the outdoor until attached to the house lanai.  Just curious as to what was discovered related to the Meraki?  I sent my A/V guy who led the project an email asking about the Cisco Meraki query just to make sure.

Thanks!

Hi ​@bubbascant 

I don’t think there is a support document for selecting a group coordinator, no, but I do cover it in my article linked below:

There’s no need to start playback before grouping. It’s just about which speaker is selected before the grouping action is performed - that speaker will end up in charge (and listed first in the group), and changing it can make a difference if not all connections are equal. Basically, any time you encounter interruptions when multiple speakers are grouped, experiment with which speaker is in charge. Looking into reducing wireless interference is also good practice in this situation.

I know nothing about Control4 other than the fact it exists, I’m afraid.

A recent issue was discovered whereby grouping 3 or more speakers that connect via Cisco Meraki WAPs can cause interruptions. If you don’t have Meraki, it does not apply.

i’d love your input per below.

When I use ARC (wired) with other zone(s) - usually the JBL and Fireplace zone - I have dropout issues more.

When I add Roam to JBL and Fireplace (and/or ARC) that’s when dropouts happen more regularly.

If I listen to MOVE (WiFi) or Media room zone (Wired) individually with no other zones, I never experience drops.  Same with the Pool zone which is always played individually, I experience no dropouts.

The JBL and Fireplace alone seem to experience fewer dropouts than when I add Roam or ARC.

Since the ARC serves as the TV soundbar, if it’s been part of the group during last playback of music, then I have to add it back in.  It is a bit of a conundrum as to the proper sequence (though your GC comments will help focus again on that).

Here’s the example I’d like your instruction on:

Let’s say I had ARC, JBL, Fireplace and Roam on together during playback and then I stop.  At some point I open Sonos and start playback again (same playlist - or even choose a different one) - I usually will leave the zones selected though I may drop Roam and/or ARC may be muted or removed because of watching TV.  

What is the best method to pick up listening if I’m on the same playlist - meaning I don’t want to start over?  Do I turn off all the zones but one, or unselect all of them and then pick one, and then pick another zone or two? But I don’t playback until I do one zone and then another one or two for example?

Do you understand my query?

Thanks.

Hi ​@bubbascant 

Ah - I thought you were referring to JBL speakers (the brand), but I see you have a room called JBL!

If I understand correctly, you are referring to poorer performance/reliability when grouping to play TV Audio, specifically, to rooms other than where the TV is connected?

This is to some extent expected, as sound-bars* will not wait for other rooms to sync before playing audio as it is more important to stay in sync with the TV picture - unlike with music, where a grouped speaker can be pre-fed what is to be played and buffer it prior to playing in sync. For a time, we allowed users to do this, but did not officially support it due to it relying utterly (and more than normal) on the robustness of the network.

Since then, however, we have added a buffer option for this use case. Increasing it will improve playback reliability, but will also make the grouped rooms more and more out of sync with the sound-bar* connected to the TV. Please go to Settings icon » croom with TV connection] » Group Audio Delay and experiment with each level - you’ll want the lowest level that is reliable.

Note that if you can still hear the sound-bar in another room where you have a speaker grouped in, the combination will likely sound bad to your ears.

*If you have an Amp connected to a TV, please read Amp instead of “sound-bar”.

I hope this helps.

The four speakers in the living room are JBL and are in the ceiling.  They are in the same area as the ARC with the Sony TV.

You said: If I understand correctly, you are referring to poorer performance/reliability when grouping to play TV Audio, specifically, to rooms other than where the TV is connected?

No, nothing to do with TV audio if I’m understanding you correctly.  All my references are playing music with Sonos app and Plex.  

I don’t think room with TV connection is part of things. I never hear music out of sync not matter which zone(s) I am playing to.

You said: *If you have an Amp connected to a TV, please read Amp instead of “sound-bar”.

What does this mean? Sorry.  The ARC is connected to the TV and serves as its own amp, right?  There is no amplifier used in any zone except the Sonos Amp boxes (one in the media room, three in my credenza under the TV which plays to the four JBL ceiling speakers, the Pool outdoor speakers and the two Fireplace ceiling speakers).

Does this help?  Again, I’m just wanting to set up the GC concept properly for best performance from Sonos (which the new update will also hopefully improve on).

I wanted to compliment you on the document you put together and shared with me.

I don’t think there is a support document for selecting a group coordinator, no, but I do cover it in my article linked below:

I sent that to my A/V company guy and asked for his feedback - and whether our current setup needs any modification, especially with respect to the update on the app when I do that.

Hi ​@bubbascant 

Ah ok. If you are hearing these dropout issues with music playback, I recommend you get in touch with our technical support team who have tools at their disposal that will allow them to give you advice specific to your Sonos system and what it reports - I can only guess as to what is happening.

Sorry - I was trying to cover all bases. I was just saying that I had used the term “sound-bar” a fair bit, but that what I was saying also covers Amp connected to a TV, which is not a sound-bar.

Sorry - I would not expect an upcoming update to resolve this issues. They are likely caused by local networking conditions. While experimenting with which speaker is the GC may help, if it does not, I recommend again that you get in touch with our technical support team. The speaker logs will be needed to determine the best course of action, moving forward.

Thank you - I hope you found it helpful!

I appreciate your feedback.  A bit overkill I know, but just so I make sure I’m communicating properly…

ARC - connected to TV via ethernet

JBL, Pool, Fireplace - three Sonos amps in the living room credenza connected via ethernet

Media room - sonos Port connected via ethernet

Roam and Move - WiFi only

A quick question, I went into the Sonos app on my iPhone and went to settings/system/Products and then the Arc and I noticed as I scrolled down a bit it said “Home Theater” and then underneath that I see TV Autoplay (enabled) and Ungroup on Autoplay (enabled).

JBL, Fireplace & Pool - the autoplay and Ungroup on Autoplay are all disabled.

Media room - doesn’t show the same options for Autoplay and Ungroup on Autoplay

Roam and Move don’t have those options either.

Since the Arc is the only one that has TV autoplay and Ungroup on Autoplay enabled and the other amps (JBL, Fireplace and Pool) don’t, could that be causing any issue on dropouts during playback? Should they all have the same setting in other words for the Autoplay and Ungroup?

Thanks

Hi ​@bubbascant 

No. These settings (or lack thereof) are not going to cause any issues.

Most likely, a network interface somewhere is maxing out - an issue probably caused by interference, or multicast flooding, or limited local bandwidth. As stated, I can only guess as to what the issue is without seeing reports from the speakers, and there are many too many possibilities to list.

Of course, part of the issue is that I cannot know all I need to know. You have stated that your Arc (not ARC - ARC is something completely different) is connected to your TV with an ethernet cable, which, while possible, certainly would not result in TV audio coming out of the Arc. Having most of your players ethernet-wired will largely eliminate interference as an issue, but if another device is flooding them with multicast packets, they would certainly struggle with distributing audio to other rooms. Remember that while ethernet is free from interference, at 100Mbps, it is considerably slower than modern WiFi, so any flooding would likely overwhelm the interface.

I recommend you get in touch with our technical support team who have tools at their disposal that will allow them to give you advice specific to your Sonos system and what it reports.

Again, thank you so much for your prompt reply.  

When I say “Arc” - I’m meaning this model - Sonos ARCWMWW1BLKARC Wall Mount.

I’m a touch confused when you say that I stated that my Arc (not ARC - ARC is something completely different) is connected to my TV.  What does that mean?  Arc versus ARC?  I’m meaning the Sonos Arc soundbar.

As mentioned, Sonos support seemed to isolate the issues as bandwidth from Control4 - which their lead support team says is poppycock  - but nonetheless, we set C4 up on its own so as to not conflict.

This is why i was hoping the new app would help.

I will do as you stated with getting in touch with Sonos technical support.  My plan is:

Update my iOS for my iPhone and iPad. Update my apple TV devices.

Then update Sonos app at that point.

I have told my A/V guy that I want to remove the C4 setup as Sonos should not have a problem with that according to C4 and my A/V guy who stated is beyond bewildering why Sonos has problems with interference with the C4.  I have to pay C4 a yearly fee just to use their app on my iPhone because of this current setup. They said a home user should not have to pay to use the app but, because of the setup that was done, the only way is to use the higher end method and that requires a yearly subscripton.

Anyway, all info you probably aren’t needing but that’s my plan. I’d rather not pay for a free C4 app just because has trouble. My A/V guy who does major setups for a lot of known companies, says Sonos and C4 work fine in other setups and says my setup he did is the same as for other setups he does.

Hi ​@bubbascant 

I was being a bit pedantic, but at the same time trying to make a point.

You mentioned your “ARC was connected to the TV with ethernet”. This makes no sense in multiple ways - ARC is Audio Return Channel, a particular kind of HDMI port on a TV. Obviously, you meant Arc, but if you have it connected to the TV with an ethernet cable, then the TV is trying to access the internet via the Arc, and the Arc is trying to access the internet via the TV - nether of which will work for internet access nor TV audio transport. While I would like to think you meant that you have an Arc that is wired to the TV with HDMI and is wired to the network with ethernet, that is not what you said and I have learned (the hard way) not to make assumptions.

In attempting to clarify, you seem to have provided the product code for a wall mount.

So, I am not able to confidently ascertain via this channel of communication exactly what your situation is, which is why I have mentioned that I think you should call in several times now.

In addition, I really don’t know anything about Control4 - and neither, I think, will any level 1 agent you speak to on the phone - as we simply do not receive any training on the platform whatsoever. I have a rough idea that it is for home automation, and that is about it. I cannot even parse the sentence "As mentioned, Sonos support seemed to isolate the issues as bandwidth from Control4”. I would be surprised if the issues you are having with Control4 are Sonos app related - it sounds to me like Control4 would be an alternative to using the Sonos app, as is Alexa, which also has literally nothing to do with the new app. But, as I don’t know much about it, I cannot be sure.

Your opening question was about whether or not to update to the latest version of the Sonos app - I recommend that you do so. For any issues with stability when grouping, I recommend you get in touch with our technical support team, and for any issues with Control4, I recommend you contact them directly.

I hope this helps.