Enthusiast II

Answered

Volume levels too high after 15.2 update

170 replies
12392 views

Good evening,

My system updated to 15.2 today and following this update, all of my speakers’ volumes are easily double what they were before.

I run one of my Play 1’s at volume 4 at night and have done for years, but volume 4 is now way too loud and even setting it to 1 is very loud.

I have 2x Play 1’s, 1x Play 3 and the latest Five and it’s the same on all of them.

I’ve had to set a volume limit of 50% on each speaker but now all of my volume references for me and my family are all over the place which is incredibly annoying.

Any ideas?

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Corry PAnswer

Sonos Staff

Hi @Tom_69 et al

Thank you @Tom_69 for bringing it to our attention that we did not yet update this thread - this was an error on our part, and apologies for the lateness.

With the advent of spatial audio from Apple Music becoming available to play on Sonos devices, Apple expressed an interest in actioning a change due to the volumes of stereo tracks being inconsistent with each other and with tracks from other music providers. In line with this, and with long-standing requests from our customers to apply volume normalisation to tracks, we have added to our speakers a response to the normalisation figures provided.

The current behaviour of the sound volume is intentional and by design. Due to the way we now utilise volume normalisation metadata from Apple Music in update 15.2, average loudness is now better aligned between different tracks. Some stereo tracks may appear louder than before and some stereo tracks may appear quieter as a result, but as I said this is expected behaviour.

Knowledge of these changes were not widely distributed internally, hence the reason why we raised this as a possible "bug" on the basis of everyone's experience on this thread. We aim to improve this in the future to minimise the chance of this sort of misunderstanding happening again.

I understand this is not ideal for everyone, and as such I have internally raised as a feature request the option to disable this normalisation process at will from within the Sonos app.

"Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen." - Albert Einstein

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Corry PAnswer

Sonos Staff

Hi @Tom_69 et al

Thank you @Tom_69 for bringing it to our attention that we did not yet update this thread - this was an error on our part, and apologies for the lateness.

With the advent of spatial audio from Apple Music becoming available to play on Sonos devices, Apple expressed an interest in actioning a change due to the volumes of stereo tracks being inconsistent with each other and with tracks from other music providers. In line with this, and with long-standing requests from our customers to apply volume normalisation to tracks, we have added to our speakers a response to the normalisation figures provided.

The current behaviour of the sound volume is intentional and by design. Due to the way we now utilise volume normalisation metadata from Apple Music in update 15.2, average loudness is now better aligned between different tracks. Some stereo tracks may appear louder than before and some stereo tracks may appear quieter as a result, but as I said this is expected behaviour.

Knowledge of these changes were not widely distributed internally, hence the reason why we raised this as a possible "bug" on the basis of everyone's experience on this thread. We aim to improve this in the future to minimise the chance of this sort of misunderstanding happening again.

I understand this is not ideal for everyone, and as such I have internally raised as a feature request the option to disable this normalisation process at will from within the Sonos app.

"Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen." - Albert Einstein

T

thkl

Lyricist III

Hi @Corry P,

thanks for the explanation. This sounds clear to me but it makes no sense for me. The current state of my setup is: online radio is much quieter so I have to crank up the volume. Next I switch to Apple Music and it will blast my ears away.

the goal for the customer should be an equal volume between all music services the customer uses. And he should not be forced to make volume adjustments every time. If there is a need to setup a „normalization level“ for every service manually by the customer once then ok, but the current state is not acceptable…

best

Thomas

T

Tom_69Author

Enthusiast II

Hi @Tom_69 et al

Thank you @Tom_69 for bringing it to our attention that we did not yet update this thread - this was an error on our part, and apologies for the lateness.

With the advent of spatial audio from Apple Music becoming available to play on Sonos devices, Apple expressed an interest in actioning a change due to the volumes of stereo tracks being inconsistent with each other and with tracks from other music providers. In line with this, and with long-standing requests from our customers to apply volume normalisation to tracks, we have added to our speakers a response to the normalisation figures provided.

The current behaviour of the sound volume is intentional and by design. Due to the way we now utilise volume normalisation metadata from Apple Music in update 15.2, average loudness is now better aligned between different tracks. Some stereo tracks may appear louder than before and some stereo tracks may appear quieter as a result, but as I said this is expected behaviour.

Knowledge of these changes were not widely distributed internally, hence the reason why we raised this as a possible "bug" on the basis of everyone's experience on this thread. We aim to improve this in the future to minimise the chance of this sort of misunderstanding happening again.

I understand this is not ideal for everyone, and as such I have internally raised as a feature request the option to disable this normalisation process at will from within the Sonos app.

Hi Corry,

Thanks for the update. Unfortunately, this is completely unacceptable from a customer perspective and I am absolutely shocked that Sonos did not understand the implications of such a change to it’s user base. Can you raise an official complaint on behalf of all Apple Music users and everyone who has shared the frustration on your forums please?

The update renders many user’s systems as unusable in certain scenarios since update 15.2, mine included. I have not been able to use my Sonos system at night (which I’ve been doing happily for circa 7 years) since update 15.2 as the volume does not go low enough. This is not acceptable.

As @thkl highlights above, there is such a wild difference between music services that the Sonos experience is now horrendous day-to-day and involves constantly changing volumes when you want to enjoy different services. I shouldn’t have to explain to my household that they must change the volume levels to at least 50% of what they’ve been using for years when playing Apple Music. This is not acceptable. As you just removed iOS hardware volume controls too, you must go into the app to make these volume changes.

Sonos clearly does not care about or understand their customers if a change like this was made without any testing or consideration. The irony is, I’ve never had any issues with the volume levels of Apple Music tracks on my Sonos system at all.

Please escalate your ‘feature request’ as a matter of urgency so that your customers can turn this bug off and continue to actually use their Sonos systems fully again.

Regards,

An incredibly frustrated Sonos customer called Tom.

Corry P

Sonos Staff

Hi @thkl

Thank you - this is just the kind of feedback we’re looking for!

We are, of course, unable to normalise if the normalisation levels are not supplied, and typically with online sources, they are not. This is why I have already put forth the idea of having a togglable option in the app.

the goal for the customer should be an equal volume between all music services the customer uses

While this would be a nice-to-have, I feel I should set some expectations - this is unlikely. There are literally hundreds of online sources available, and an order of magnitude (or two) more when you start including radio stations too. They would all need to supply normalisation data for each and every track, and I think that would be beyond the resources of most of them to achieve, especially the radio stations.

"Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen." - Albert Einstein

Corry P

Sonos Staff

@Tom_69 - thank you too for your feedback.

"Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen." - Albert Einstein

T

thkl

Lyricist III

Hi @Corry P ,

yes I’m aware of this. It would be nice if there is a magic way to make the audio levels consistent over all services and tracks. But there is no such a way. I don’t have a better idea as a little slider for advanced like settings, for every service the customer has installed, where the audio level can be adjusted as „a setup like thing“ so it will be all the same level for using the volume slider for a speaker or group. So that I can adjust the online radio a little bit louder and Apple a little bit softer and the volume is the same on eg level 10 in the app.

this may be not the best and easiest solution for all customers but if anyone has this problem he can solve this.

best

Thomas

N

Neksio

Lyricist III

Hi @Tom_69 et al

Thank you @Tom_69 for bringing it to our attention that we did not yet update this thread - this was an error on our part, and apologies for the lateness.

With the advent of spatial audio from Apple Music becoming available to play on Sonos devices, Apple expressed an interest in actioning a change due to the volumes of stereo tracks being inconsistent with each other and with tracks from other music providers. In line with this, and with long-standing requests from our customers to apply volume normalisation to tracks, we have added to our speakers a response to the normalisation figures provided.

The current behaviour of the sound volume is intentional and by design. Due to the way we now utilise volume normalisation metadata from Apple Music in update 15.2, average loudness is now better aligned between different tracks. Some stereo tracks may appear louder than before and some stereo tracks may appear quieter as a result, but as I said this is expected behaviour.

Knowledge of these changes were not widely distributed internally, hence the reason why we raised this as a possible "bug" on the basis of everyone's experience on this thread. We aim to improve this in the future to minimise the chance of this sort of misunderstanding happening again.

I understand this is not ideal for everyone, and as such I have internally raised as a feature request the option to disable this normalisation process at will from within the Sonos app.

I think you missed the point.. we all love (or to be honest at least I love) normalized volume across our library.

The problem is that now there isn’t enough “notches” od the lower end of volume settings so after this change we could get a SILENCE and then the next lowest possible notch is WAY TOO LOUD to listen at night..

I’ve again compared my Sonos to Alexa and Homepod and the lowest possible Sonos volume notch (1%) is roughly compared to Alexa 15% and Homepod 10%

Again - the problem isn’t the normalization but the volume settings on the lower end of the scale..

just my 2 cents

Bohdan

O

officier

Lyricist III

Hi @Tom_69 et al

Thank you @Tom_69 for bringing it to our attention that we did not yet update this thread - this was an error on our part, and apologies for the lateness.

With the advent of spatial audio from Apple Music becoming available to play on Sonos devices, Apple expressed an interest in actioning a change due to the volumes of stereo tracks being inconsistent with each other and with tracks from other music providers. In line with this, and with long-standing requests from our customers to apply volume normalisation to tracks, we have added to our speakers a response to the normalisation figures provided.

The current behaviour of the sound volume is intentional and by design. Due to the way we now utilise volume normalisation metadata from Apple Music in update 15.2, average loudness is now better aligned between different tracks. Some stereo tracks may appear louder than before and some stereo tracks may appear quieter as a result, but as I said this is expected behaviour.

Knowledge of these changes were not widely distributed internally, hence the reason why we raised this as a possible "bug" on the basis of everyone's experience on this thread. We aim to improve this in the future to minimise the chance of this sort of misunderstanding happening again.

I understand this is not ideal for everyone, and as such I have internally raised as a feature request the option to disable this normalisation process at will from within the Sonos app.

This is just completely BS…

It is understandable that there is no magic fix to normalize the volume between all kind of services, but the current volume for Apple Music is just way too loud. All that is needed is to trim down the volume of Apple Music, in order to be it more equal to other sources. Currently, it is impossible to use a playlist that contains both Apple Music and your own library. It is also impossible to play Apple Music at night, even with a volume of 1, it is too loud.

How can you say this behavior is intentional? @Corry P ? It just does not make any sense.

M

millwood67

Lyricist I

It’s Apple Music. Not some random radio station or service. Between them and Spotify….that’s it. Make them both work really really well. The “it’s not us” and “we’d have to do it for hundreds of services” rationale is beneath a company of Sonos’s size. Clearly we all love the product and it’s not working properly if you can’t turn the music down. That’s a core feature….not a niche “ask” from a few users.

User199227

Lyricist III

Normalization is not the issue for me. It’s a great goal for Sonos and I hope that it can be improved upon in the future. I understand the difficulties in doing so, particularly across different services, and to a great extent that’s not a Sonos issue or something that Sonos can really fix.

What *is* a Sonos issue (and something Sonos *can* fix) is the overall playback volume at a given volume setting. Going from a volume of zero (silence) to a volume setting of “1” should be subtle. A “1” should be barely perceptible. A “2” should be a tiny bit louder, etc.

I shouldn’t have to go from silence to “way too freaking loud”. I see no reason that Sonos can’t adjust what a volume setting of “1” means for their hardware’s output.

It’s ok if a “1” is too quiet and I just have to turn the volume up to reach my desired level. What is NOT ok is not being able to turn the volume down low enough. If the Normalization process turns up the “gain” too high, then just lower the hardware’s output at a given volume setting!

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