End of Software Support - Clarifications

Not much new, but some interesting tidbits. Not sure if it was already posted here:

https://www.fool.com/investing/2020/01/29/heres-why-sonos-customers-were-angry-about-plans-t.aspx

Certainly so. I don't deny this is a watershed moment for Sonos. They’re a canary deep down the coal mine right now.

I want to go further to address the additional disparity between definitions of “SUPPORT” here, many that seem to extend all the way down to “ABLE TO USE AT ALL”. They are not the same thing.

(Even though I was harsh on analogies a bit ago, I’m going to use one.)
Take the auto industry. Liken “support” to “under warranty”. You can expect your car to receive product recalls and certain amounts of maintenance from the manufacturer, including all the perks the car salesman rattled off and you looked at on a sheet of paper and on screen when you got home. These days you get enrolled into a myriad of other tech plans as well; remote start features via apps or roadside service at a button-touch within the car. All of these services eventually run out. You eventually pay for them separately, but the car still runs. As support fades, you’re responsible for keeping it on the road and you accept that some things aren’t worth it and you let those features fade away, but you still drive the car and have it serviced out-of-pocket. 

And liken to if you wish, anything you’ve added after purchase to that car’s “system” (though in many cases, depending what it is it may void your warranty) by way of performance upgrades, a new stereo, accessories in the cabin, a hot set of wheels and/or winter tires, etc. etc. Many of those additions can be transferred to a new car, under warranty, when you choose to move on. Or you can part with them when sell the car and include them, not adding much value in many cases but attractive additions for the new buyer. You certainly won't recoup all that initial outlay of expensive or even close to it.

This analogy sucks. In many ways. I know that. No analogy truly works. Many will try and pick this one apart and I will largely agree with them. I’m just making it to illustrate that no one really questions that auto industry reality and haven’t for decades. This IoT realm is all new. Whether this was planned by Sonos or not doesn’t really matter to me, not pragmatically. The software is not the hardware and never will be. Proceed accordingly, in spite of the marketing and the new car “amazing warranty” features sales pitch. If you feel irreparably burned by Dodge, buy a Volkswagen or ride a bike. 

(edit: and I know what’s coming.
“Sonos didn’t tell me when my warranty was to run out”.
I know. That’s the problem. That’s the source of the anger. That’s the naivety. That’s the “new” information and IoT enlightenment and I’d wager it will all change in the near future.)

As you say,  analogies are difficult to postulate.  But I’m failing to see you point on this one.  Your car warranty example I think is a perfect example of the point I was trying to make before.  After warranty,  I can choose to maintain it myself or trade up to a new car.  I will have many avenues to get the help and parts to keep it on the road as long as I like.  The auto manufacturer does not have the ability to pressure me into a new car if I don’t want.  If that were the case,  there would be no auto transportation available in Cuba.

To reiterate my words,  “Functionality of the system at any equipment age should not be affected if the customer does not wish to progress to the next technological level.”

That is what Sonos has reiterated they will try to accomodate for those remaining within a legacy framework. To what degree that succeeds is a complete unknown at this point. But again, it's interconnected; the hardware is not the software but the two are linked. This is all new.

To the auto industry analogy, you can choose to replace the integrated (eventual) Amazon Music API failure with a “part” from a 3rd party manufacturer as it were. (And further, Amazon and others are already 3rd party capability to the “car” itself, e.g. warranty & support comes into clear focus if you replace a stock header on a Subaru with one from Borla - you get more performance but it’s additional outlay and if something goes wrong Subaru isn’t the one to address the concern to, but Borla). One thing Sonos has said, multiple times, is indeed that the core operation of the system, e.g. grouping zones and playing music served from a personal library is the thing least likely to be affected at all over time. The wheels will still turn. The car will still start. But your car is ineligible for navigation system upgrades and newest brake caliper design does not apply. But you can fit it out 3rd party or DIY. You can attach a Chromecast to a line-in. Or buy Garmin nav system. Again, this analogy is terribly insufficient.

I’m not interested in debate. Many have strong feelings that are largely justified. I just wanted to share my more measured thoughts as they’ve coalesced in the that past week or so. They’re very different my own initial reactions. Cheers.

I bought my Sonos Connect from Amazon four months ago. In fact, Amazon is still selling them, brand new. 

Don’t tell me Sonos stopped selling this product over five years ago. Even if you stopped selling them directly on your own website, Amazon is still getting its stock from somewhere.

Your commitment means nothing. How about if I send you my Connect, less than four months old, and you give me credit for the FULL VALUE toward a product that will still work?

Oh yeah, you won’t.  Because you are a fraud.

@Winter S, if you purchased a Connect brand new that recently it shouldn’t be legacy. Any Connect still for sale from an official reseller should be 2015 version of the Connect which has some updated specs and is not a legacy product. In May, when the older version of the Connect becomes legacy, the 2015 Connect will continue on as a modern device. To check if you have a legacy device, you can go to your account page here: https://www.sonos.com/myaccount/system/households/devices/

There are multiple products with the same name? That wasn’t clear from the notification I read. Adding to the confusion, I have received several Emails from Sonos urging me to trade up this product, even though I just bought it. Thanks for the clarification -- I’ll check my account but I’m done with Sonos over this whole incident, regardless.

Why are there 125 pages when yesterday there was over 170?

Ryan,

isn’t this part of the problem? Sonos never informed customers of changes to the internals of the products. Why would I think that a Connect bought in 2016, even assuming that Sonos has perfect inventory management, would be any different than one bought in 2014? or for that matter why would a store feel the need to clear out their older inventory before putting the new shipment on the floor?

The fact is that I suspect that Sonos has been happy to continue selling the “same” product for years as it reinforced much of the messaging that it continues to deliver to this day (Everything works together…, Start with one speaker...). Consumers are reassured about slowly expanding their network when they see the product bought 10 years ago is still being sold without knowing that maintaining the outer shell was actually a bait and switch.

I feel like a fool who believed that Sonos would actually stand by its words. At this point I have started to move away from the Sonos ecosystem and will likely never come back. I returned 2 play 1s, am selling a Connect, will try to sell another Connect and a Connect:Amp, and will soon be selling one of my playbars and subs because I replaced my Sonos home theater setup with a Denon amp with Heos support. At this stage I will still hold on to my Gen 1 Play 5s but I am continuing to debate even that. While I can’t be sure how long Denon and Marantz will continue to support the platform, I am getting better sound, for less money, and I know that I will always be able to use it in that room (can’t be sure how long the playbar will be able to work with the Play 3s that I use as surround speakers). I may also experiment with other platforms as the opportunity arises. I would not have even considered this 2 weeks ago.

I am getting over the anger I feel but not the disappointment. A clear message could have gone a long way to addressing what I feel but I don't see one coming and don’t even believe that whatever is said or done in May will help, it will be too little too late.

I will get back whatever money I can on the used market and will deal with the few pieces I decide to keep while I gradually switch over to another platform. The odds are that I will end up with a legacy system and I hope it doesn’t die quickly but I have little to no confidence at this point that Sonos will do anything to delay the demise of legacy components.

I have been spending a lot of time on this as I was holding out hope that some new information would emerge. I’ve been slowly taking a step back and will continue to do so.