Enthusiast I

Feature Request: Roam stereo pairing - automagically, not "fixed"

17 replies
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I bought my second Roam recently, to add the option of stereo playback but I must say I’m disappointed with how it works. These are portable rechargeable speakers and will spend a fair amount of time powered off - so with a mic built in (and trueplay++) there’s an obvious opportunity to stereo-up when the laws of physics suggest it makes sense, automatically.

This could be done intelligently:

If one Roam speaker is playing and another on the same system is turned on and can hear the track playing via the mic (you know it’s a Roam speaker and what it should outputting so can be sure it is the “other” Roam) it should switch to stereo pair automatically.
You also know what volume it should be playing, so can judge if the distance is too far for decent stereo imaging (and decide NOT to stereo up in that case).
Grouping with another single Roam (eg by long press play/pause) could switch into stereo by default, with an advanced setting not to if the user so chooses when the speakers can hear each other (or a double long-press to indicate don’t stereo - but surely that would be rare).
A pair of stereo-upped Roams should separate if the other’s output can no longer be heard when the line level isn’t expected to be silent (eg a track is playing, volume isn’t muted and it’s not playing recorded silence).

You’ll need to continue the (somewhat kludgy) fixed stereo pairing for the Roam SL setups but if “smart” stereo-up was available it would simplify config and make setup so, so flexible.

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Ken_Griffiths

@senecan,
The play/pause button ‘room-grouping’ feature, allows the Roam to ‘group’ or ‘cycle-through’ (& group with) different playing rooms that are in use by other (family members) speakers on the same local network/Sonos household. …and to also ungroup the Roam from those playing room(s). You can also swap the playing audio to/from the Roam with another speaker (room) in the HH, without ever opening the Sonos App.

SVC voice instructions can also do these things too and much more besides. These groupings are usually just ‘temporary’ and so are not the more-permanent option, which is usually the case with stereo pairing of the Sonos devices, especially as they are portable.

melvimbe

melvimbe wrote:

There isn’t a technical reason. Google simply doesn’t allow it. You can have Alexa and SVC, but not Google and Alexa, Google and SVC, or all 3.

Ah I didn’t know that. Hmmm… and yet I can “group” the two separate Roam 1 (with Alexa) and Roam 2 (with Google Assistant) and then ask Google to play something from Youtube music… and, yep, it plays on both. Now I ask Alexa to play something else from Spotify and both play that instead. So the only difference (between keeping a dedicated left/right pair with two different voice assistants, one per speaker) is that both speakers are mono in this “standard” group. Maybe someone should tell Google?

You’re conflating how a command is made with the actual process of the command. Whether you use Alexa or GA, your command is sent to a cloud server were is then translated and sent back to the Sonos speakers to execute the command. Google doesn’t get to look a the state of your Sonos speakers (grouped) and see that a command came from something other than Google (Alexa, SVC, the Sonos app, some third party controller) and say “nah, not going to do it”. All they are saying is that they don’t want GA to be implementing on the same smart speaker with other voice assistance. They will say that it is so they can provide a better customer experience. My opinion...it just makes things more complicated, if it has any impact at all, and made it easier for me to just not use GA at all.

The glamping scenario was from Ken_Griffith’s use case, but I guess not hard to have a similar wifi setup in a campervan.

I’ll explain my scenario and why I think it would be a commonly useful feature to have portable speakers behave as standalone but “smarten up” when they detect another of their kind (especially with wifi connectivity, not bluetooth):

We have multiple family members, each with their own unique taste in music. Sometimes two of us like the same thing and/or are in the garden at the same time - it would be great to share that experience in stereo. And sometimes we are in different rooms or different sections of the gardens and listening to our individual choices, both at the same time.

So you want this feature so that you don’t have to buy more speakers? 😁 I see your point, but essentially, this is not what the Sonos portable speakers are for. Sonos at it’s heart a wireless whole home audio system. The goal is that you try out speakers in one room, or a portable speaker, and are then motivated to build out speakers for the rest of your house. You could solve that issue by getting a pair of Ones in the room you use the most and then take the Roams outside when you want that. Slowly add rooms as budget allows and see the need. To be fair, I think you could argue that making it easier to split/pair the Roam automatically might still result in customers buying more speakers, but I can’t see it being an additional motivator. And I’m not saying that everything Sonos does has to be for more sales. This just seems to be a particularly difficult one that many people wouldn’t want to use, and may end up hurting sales more than helping.

Also, I think you will find that having speakers pernanently in the rooms you need them to is better than having to move them around all the time. Portables are good for the backyard if you can’t wire outdoor speakers. And being able to regularly group several rooms together is a huge plus.

I just don’t want to keep reconfiguring for stereo pairing via the app and/or re-adding the voice assistant each time I “break” the pair. These are portable speakers and have an environmental awareness in auto trueplay already, so this doesn’t feel like an impossible ask.

I hadn’t really though about having to redo the voice assistant every time. That would prompt to just give up one of the assistance (well, I was already done with GA) ...but I never would have used your strategy anyway.

Danny

S

senecanAuthor

Enthusiast I

Thanks for your help Ken_Griffiths - I do use the grouping feature a lot. I sometimes grab a Roam to take with me to the kitchen to continue listening to the audio of a TV programme playing via a Sonos Arc, using the fast grouping feature.

I didn’t mean to overplay the inconvenience - but as I’ve become older and sadder I’ve found myself wondering, “Why in 2022 am I not hearing stereo when these two identical speakers are alleged grouped?” I do think the benefits in soundstage and expanse are worth it, even if you can’t always be sitting right in the sweet spot.

Ken_Griffiths

Thanks for your help Ken_Griffiths - I do use the grouping feature a lot. I sometimes grab a Roam to take with me to the kitchen to continue listening to the audio of a TV programme playing via a Sonos Arc, using the fast grouping feature.

I didn’t mean to overplay the inconvenience - but as I’ve become older and sadder I’ve found myself wondering, “Why in 2022 am I not hearing stereo when these two identical speakers are alleged grouped?” I do think the benefits in soundstage and expanse are worth it, even if you can’t always be sitting right in the sweet spot.

I’m sure the Sonos Staff will forward your suggestion onto their engineers, as many such suggestions are of course worthy of consideration.

I just wanted to put my ‘pennies-worth’ here, as I’m just not convinced that such random auto-stereo pairing (or even auto-grouping of speakers) due to their proximity to each other etc; would be something that I would like to see, particularly with Sonos portable devices moving often around my Home & Garden etc.

I’m more than happy with the way the ‘temporary’ grouping options work now, and at the very least, I would want a user-option/intervention (button press etc.) that allows the user to decide to ‘pair’ two near-identical devices together, rather than it is just allowed to occur automatically.

F

furacaopr

Prodigy III

The first thing I do when installing new software is to disable all the “smart” auto correction features, which always try to do something I don't want to. This idea request sounds like some of these “smart” features to me.

Do you recall this little guy?

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senecanAuthor

Enthusiast I

I keep saying that the existing mechanism can’t just be disabled - remember, there are Roam SLs out there that have no mic and therefore can’t auto trueplay. This is a value add - an optional one - for those with full Roams and who want to exploit the portability to the fullest, separating them often.

No-one needs to get p*ssed off, unless that is just your thing.

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senecanAuthor

Enthusiast I

Melvimbe wrote:
You’re conflating how a command is made with the actual process of the command. Whether you use Alexa or GA, your command is sent to a cloud server were is then translated and sent back to :
...
They will say that it is so they can provide a better customer experience. My opinion…

Respect and appreciate your opinion, but just for clarity I do know how it works and my observation was that if I have two Roam separate speakers I can install Alexa on one and GA on the other, but if I combine them to make a pair I have to choose one voice assistant for the “pair”, and one of the mics is then redundant. IMHO that’s a loss of functionality by pairing - and my (just in my opinion) very good reason is that I want to play Audible, Spotify and Youtube Music and the spat between Amazon and Google means their voice assistants don’t cross-pollinate. And yes I really do have subscriptions to all those services - my household is … complicated and needy!

On the other hand if a “Group” them I can use both mics, both voice assistants and the output plays on both. So it seems like a Sonos decision to restrict to one voice service on a stereo pair.

Melvimbe wrote:
So you want this feature so that you don’t have to buy more speakers?

Ah we’re not going to personal accusations and I’m certainly not making any or going to defend against. I admit to being a bit disappointed that this thread didn’t become more interesting with actual examples of how this feature would inconvenience existing setups or be a bad idea other than “I like how it is now” or “this will just p*ss everyone off” and the strange drone that “likes” every casual negative without actually contributing one. It is interesting to hear opinions and I appreciate anew the tough line Sonos have to walk with innovations versus the “I always turn off every smart feature” stalwarts, although they might want to discourage the guy that plugs his waterproof speakers in, in his bathroom.

If it helps (it shouldn’t), MY SONOS SETUP includes fixed speakers in stereo or surround in almost all rooms except bathrooms and outbuildings (and I also have a shed full of S1 speakers that I’ve replaced now). I even have a Move that rarely does (move that is).

All I want is for my portable speakers to be flexible, because they’re portable. Automatic trueplay is an impressive example of innovation that sets them apart from permanently-plugged in, fixed speakers, as they react to their environment. The next stage is to add a “prefer automatic stereo pairing” checkbox on Roams with a mic and let these great speakers sort it out for you.

And then these lower-price point speakers might sell to households don’t want to have to buy fixed speakers for every room but might be one per household member instead and use them… like portable speakers.

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