Contributor I

Why is there input delay on line-in and digital inputs?

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So, I know this topic has been discussed a gazillion times already. But I’m really getting upset by this. Why does there have to be a delay when using Sonos (Five or Amp for example, I’ve owned both) in standalone mode?

8/10 times my usecase for Sonos is casual listening via streaming services. But 2/10 times I want to use Sonos for live instrument playback. Such as a drum machine and other stuff I own. Or for desktop/youtube playback.

I’ve spent literally hours searching for the best speaker setup for casual multiroom usage and some small birthday dancing and an input for live instruments. It exists, but I’d have to leave Sonos and go for Denon. But I would rather not.

The minimum of 50-75ms delay in standalone usage for the Sonos Amp and Five is completely unnecessary. It forces me to have an extra pair of Yamaha hs7 at hand, while I’d rather get an Sonos Five instead.

I know the arguments of people defending Sonos:

Sonos is not made for that usecase
The delay has to be there per design and cannot be removed
Removing the delay would add complexity and not be user friendly
Only a very small portion of the users would use this

but this is simply not true

Denon heos/Home allows for standalone use with AUX input and only adds delay when grouping for stereo or other rooms.
If Sonos is not made for external instruments, why have a line in? If you want line in only for streaming purpose with delay, there is a Sonos Port for that.
It’s super user friendly actually to have no delay in standalone mode. It would solve all lip sync threads from people who only have 1 device. Also, as soon as other speakers are added you simply add delay. Like Denon does, no questions asked.
It would add usecases to expand the userbase actually. Right now it’s a small portion of the SONOS users. But how about everyone who does not buy sonos because of this? Those voices are unheard and who knows how many people they consist of 🤷🏼‍♂️

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Pinned Reply By Martech

@Martech - I do get why you want this. I just think you are destined for disappointment. But who knows?

I have just registered the fact that you also mention digital inputs. The delays here should be smaller than for analog inputs - to the point of being unnoticeable. Has that not been your experience?

As far as I know there will always be a minimum of 50-75ms delay. Correct me if i’m wrong. HDMI is supposed to negotiate with your television to achieve ‘lip-sync). And I must admit, it took me a few days to get used to ‘lip-sync grade delay’. In the beginning I would notice, but after some time I didn’t bother anymore.

But for live instruments (keyboard, drum machine) where you have to time your input based on the sound, a delay of 50ms+ is to high.

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jgatie

I replaced my Sonos S1 system last week, which previously consisted of 3 Sonos Connect and a Sonos Connect AMP with Sonos Port and Sonos Amp.
Why I did that I wonder now - maybe I just wanted to continue to support Sonos as one of the first users.
So now I have a new Sonos Amp in my home office. Here, my typical usage looked like connecting via line-in to the audio output of my notebook.
I played music mostly through the Windows Controller app and for video conferencing I use the line-in signal.
This worked wonderfully with the old S1 Sonos Connect Amp, but is NOT possible with the new device.
The audio delay described here is a game stopper here. So this is what I spent thousands on - cool.

The Line-In delay has been present since the very first ZP100 rolled off the assembly line back in 2005. There is no difference in the Line-In delay from then to now, or from S1 to S2.

Katte

Lyricist I

@jgatie - Thanks for your answer, which motivated me to dig a little deeper into the Sonos device settings. Here I saw that there was a default value for the signal delay of 2000 ms - no idea why this is the new default value - but I was able to solve my problem very easily by lowering this value to 70 ms. Now everything works like before!

Thank you very much again!

B

Bartbart

Contributor I

Just adding my own feedback regarding line-in delay.

I have a bunch of Symfonisk speakers to listen to music.

I also have a couple of synthesisers that I toy around with. Those synths sit in my living room, and they need their own speaker, becasue the Symfonisk doesn’t have line-in. That speaker sits directly to the side of one of the Symfonisks.

On top of my Symfonisk speakers not working with my synths, they also don’t connect with my Samsung TV.

Yesterday, I purchased an Era 100 to replace one of the Symfonisks and plug to my synths. But this morning I discover there is that 70ms delay issue.

So, the price I pay to get a wireless speaker system is quite high, because I cannot use these with my TV or music instruments. By that, I mean that just to get things wireless, I need to re-add wired speakers to my TV or synths. At this point, I’m considering selling them and getting a wired system only, which will enable me to get everything to work.

Honestly, I don’t know what Sonos is thinking. As much as I’m probably one of few users wishing to use my Sonos speakers with my music instruments, I sure can’t be the only one wanting to use them with my TV? I’d assume 90% of Sonos/Symfonisk customers would want to use their TV with their speakers.

With regards to a line-in option with no delay: would it be impossible to add a simple software switch in the app, which would enable users to choose between:

line-in playback to the entire Sonos system, with delay
line-in playback to only that specific speaker, without delay

This switch would trigger the signal being either processed through the Sonos networked system, or directly connected to the speaker’s amp.

It’s true that not many users would need such feature. Probably less than 5%. But if addressing that needs requires little investment, why not do it? Small profit/benefit, but also small investment.

Sonos has done magical things since the company started many years ago.

But there are fundamental hurdles to a truly good experience, such as TV connection, or line-in.

Again, there are probably rich Sonos customers who may have the cash and the room to purchase all the speakers they need - but I feel like Sonos is failing a huge portion of their existing or potential user base.

I would bet that a huge portion of their customers always find themselves having to purchase wired speakers in some places, because Sonos just doesn’t do certain things.

jgatie

Sigh.

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