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dominiklei
Enthusiast II
December 2, 2024

Era 300 rear driver is silent (with Arc Ultra)

First things first. This is not a rant. This is an expalation of a problem, which reduces the experience in 3D audio a lot. For background: I'm a sound engineer and music producer and I don't wanna sound arrogant, but I know what I'm talking about. (I'm a really nice and funny guy :D)

So lets get to the problem then :D

NO I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT THE FRONT FACING DRIVER

for better understanding watch this VIDEO

This bug appeared the moment I switched the Arc with the Arc Ultra. Before I made the switch I was on the 16.1 app and firmware. So I don't know if the Ultra causes the problem or the app/firmware. Before the switch everything was running as it should.

So, since there is not much of a topic around this, I'm curious if I am still one of a few who have this bug or one of a few who noticed it.

I made this post in Reddit, but not everyone is on Reddit and the more people know, the faster Sonos can work on it. Reddit discussion

I didn't saw any review which mentioned it.
As you can see in the video, the rear driver is completly silenent when the Era 300's are paired with the Arc Ultra. Also Truplay isn't "sweeping" the driver either. (Timestamp 0:44)
So the mesurement isn't right.
First I thought it could be a feature instead of a bug, but it doens't fit the Dolby Atmos recommendations like this. You won't get sound from "behind" your seating position.
And I remember Sonos self promoted it how it should work, where the rear driver is playing.
 

DOLBY ATMOS LAYOUT

Sound from side driver/channel should boucing off your side walls, rear driver/channel bouncing off the back wall of your seating position and height channel obviosly bouncing off your ceiling. Thats why you should position them facing forward. At the moment you don't get the immersion that sound is coming from behind you, since the driver is silent.

I tested every setting, played the Dolby Atmos testfile (MKV [TrueHD Atmos] and MP4 [EAC3 + joc Atmos]) from different sources (TV Plex app, Nvidia Shield, from a USB through TV) Same result everytime.

If someone could test this behavior and can confirm this, it would be very nice. Sonos can't fix something they don't know and if most people doens't recognize doens't mean something isn't wrong.

Currently I'm running app version 80.12.04 (Android) and 80.12.03 (iPhone) and firmware version 81.1-58210.
If you don't have this problem, what version are you running?

And last but not least: IF this ever getting fixed, the experience with Arc Ultra and Era 300 will be much better! I love my Sonos products soundwise and Arc Ultra is sounding really good, but it could be much better.

Have a nice day

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Pinned Reply By Jamie A

Hi all, thank you all for your patience.

I was going to post at the same time as Keith on Reddit, however I wasn’t able to. I see that the link to the reddit post has already been copied here, but just to confirm what you've already discovered, this is expected behaviour as explained by our audio team.

I’m happy to forward any questions and feedback you have, as well as forward this as a feature request.
 

The side tweeters on the Arc Ultra are “overpowering” the bonded rear surrounds.
Side channels are virtualized by both the Arc Ultra and Era 300’s. While you can use “Surround Audio” features to dial in the sound level of your preference there are a few important things to keep in mind:

Surround TV Level and Music Level Slider Behavior: The surround level sliders adjust the sound level for both the Arc Ultra and the surround channels equally. This is the intended behavior.

Using Surround Distance Setting to Adjust Rear Sound Levels: The surround distance setting can be modified to influence the output level from the rear speakers relative to the sound bar:

  • Setting it to “Less than 2 feet (0.6m)” reduces the volume from the rear speakers.

  • Setting it to “More than 10 feet (3m)” increases the volume from the rear speakers.

Perceptible Differences: While the surround distance slider adjusts the levels equally for both the Arc Ultra and the surround speakers, testing has indicated that listeners may perceive differences in the sound from the listening position, as described above.

Impact of Trueplay: The surround distance setting is disabled when Trueplay is active, as Trueplay automatically corrects for this. To adjust the surround distance, Trueplay must first be disabled.

There is no audible output from inner woofers when Era 300 is bonded as rear surrounds.
This is by design. The rear speakers are designed to disperse sound throughout the room, rather than directing it to the listener exclusively. 

The Era 300 plays rear channel audio through its height array.
This, too, is by design. The Era 300’s DSP (Digital Signal Processing) leverages either the rear height tweeter OR the outward-facing tweeter/woofer to create the intended sound experience. Because of this, when you play the Dolby test track, you might notice that rear height channel as being active during rear-channel playback. This is expected.

Edit: Modified the wording on the 2nd and 3rd bolded points to closer match the wording in the app.

 

393 replies

Mr. T
December 19, 2024

​@Corry P has presented an answer from the Sonos engineers that the audio behavior of the Era 300’s is as to be expected. So until Sonos reverses that decision all of the Sabre rattling in this thread is pointless, IMO.

The pinned reply to this thread does not accurately describe the audio behaviour of the Era 300s provided in the Reddit Q&A yesterday, where it was confirmed the Era 300 inner speaker (tweeter & woofer) is not disabled when used as surrounds.

Enthusiast II
December 19, 2024

First things first. This is not a rant. This is an expalation of a problem, which reduces the experience in 3D audio a lot. For background: I'm a sound engineer and music producer and I don't wanna sound arrogant, but I know what I'm talking about. (I'm a really nice and funny guy :D)

So lets get to the problem then :D

NO I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT THE FRONT FACING DRIVER

for better understanding watch this VIDEO

This bug appeared the moment I switched the Arc with the Arc Ultra. Before I made the switch I was on the 16.1 app and firmware. So I don't know if the Ultra causes the problem or the app/firmware. Before the switch everything was running as it should.

So, since there is not much of a topic around this, I'm curious if I am still one of a few who have this bug or one of a few who noticed it.

I made this post in Reddit, but not everyone is on Reddit and the more people know, the faster Sonos can work on it. Reddit discussion

I didn't saw any review which mentioned it.
As you can see in the video, the rear driver is completly silenent when the Era 300's are paired with the Arc Ultra. Also Truplay isn't "sweeping" the driver either. (Timestamp 0:44)
So the mesurement isn't right.
First I thought it could be a feature instead of a bug, but it doens't fit the Dolby Atmos recommendations like this. You won't get sound from "behind" your seating position.
And I remember Sonos self promoted it how it should work, where the rear driver is playing.
 

DOLBY ATMOS LAYOUT

Sound from side driver/channel should boucing off your side walls, rear driver/channel bouncing off the back wall of your seating position and height channel obviosly bouncing off your ceiling. Thats why you should position them facing forward. At the moment you don't get the immersion that sound is coming from behind you, since the driver is silent.

I tested every setting, played the Dolby Atmos testfile (MKV [TrueHD Atmos] and MP4 [EAC3 + joc Atmos]) from different sources (TV Plex app, Nvidia Shield, from a USB through TV) Same result everytime.

If someone could test this behavior and can confirm this, it would be very nice. Sonos can't fix something they don't know and if most people doens't recognize doens't mean something isn't wrong.

Currently I'm running app version 80.12.04 (Android) and 80.12.03 (iPhone) and firmware version 81.1-58210.
If you don't have this problem, what version are you running?

And last but not least: IF this ever getting fixed, the experience with Arc Ultra and Era 300 will be much better! I love my Sonos products soundwise and Arc Ultra is sounding really good, but it could be much better.

Have a nice day

To All

My apologies that I have to quote the OP in this manner as the OP is entitled to their opinion. However, IMO the OP regardless of their credentials should not have taken it upon themselves to unequivocally characterize their opinion as a “Problem” that Sonos should fix.

Humans have a tendency to automatically lend credibility to people who are supposedly an authority on a subject. In some instances the credibility bestowed is warranted as others in the specific field with equal credibility have given their approval to the additional findings. You don’t just cut your leg off because one physician says it’s necessary…to the contrary you would seek a second opinion.

Granted the OP goes on to present videos of sound tests they have chosen to justify their claim. Others in the community have allegedly made their own test using test sounds. However, the fault in doing so is that no one has a baseline of sound to say that the supposed lack of sound from the inner drivers is a fault. Furthermore there is no standardized sound test that everyone uses over another or has access to.

I mentioned in another post to this thread that I watched the movie Twisters and was thoroughly impressed with the Atmos sound in my space. That’s not to say that you watching the same movie will achieve the same enjoyment; as the accuracy of the Atmos “bubble” is heavily dependent upon the parameters of your space. That said one’s opinion as to how Atmos sound is reproduced in their space is not an inditement of a faulty design of the Era 300’s.

Your next comment may be that how is it so many in the Community are indicating the same issue. That’s a fair statement. However, I ‘d ask how many who claim they have the same issue may have been unconsciously convinced there is an issue based upon what the OP has presented as “gospel” because of their credentials that were presented at the start of their post.

​@Jamie A has presented an answer from the Sonos engineers that the audio behavior of the Era 300’s is as to be expected. So until Sonos reverses that decision all of the Sabre rattling in this thread is pointless, IMO.

There has been talk of making the volume adjustment for the inner drivers a feature request. The potential issue with such is that more issues may be created than resolved. One has to remember that the Era 300’s act in unison with the soundbar to create a balanced listening experience. Tweaking one aspect of sound has a direct impact on other sound parameters. I believe that Sonos has determined that some adjustments should be limited in scope or not offered at all. You might call such as “Big Brother” exercising too much control. However’ I would ask…”do you control everything in your life or are some factors limiting or beyond your control”. 

No need to keep beating a dead horse so I’ll leave it to you to make your own decision as to how you move forward (or not) regarding the Era 300 inner drivers.

Yeah no. Rear channels don’t route to height channels. That’s why height channels exist. Hearing a car from the rear left or right shouldn’t give a height sensation. 
 

regardless, the older videos sonos had explaining how the era 300’s work clearly is not the way the 300 works now. Wheres the new video explaining this change aside from everyone raising their pitch forks to force Sonos to explain what happened? 

Enthusiast II
December 19, 2024

​@Corry P has presented an answer from the Sonos engineers that the audio behavior of the Era 300’s is as to be expected. So until Sonos reverses that decision all of the Sabre rattling in this thread is pointless, IMO.

The pinned reply to this thread does not accurately describe the audio behaviour of the Era 300s provided in the Reddit Q&A yesterday, where it was confirmed the Era 300 inner speaker (tweeter & woofer) is not disabled when used as surrounds.

Sonos is acting like they’re doing us a favor by heavily reducing the volume of the rear channels and making the height channels more active. 

AjTrek1
December 19, 2024

​@Corry P has presented an answer from the Sonos engineers that the audio behavior of the Era 300’s is as to be expected. So until Sonos reverses that decision all of the Sabre rattling in this thread is pointless, IMO.

The pinned reply to this thread does not accurately describe the audio behaviour of the Era 300s provided in the Reddit Q&A yesterday, where it was confirmed the Era 300 inner speaker (tweeter & woofer) is not disabled when used as surrounds.

FYI, I corrected and removed ​@Corry P and replaced with ​@Jamie A as he was the one who brought the information. 😊

Together Everyone Achieves More = T.E.A.M.
Mr. T
December 19, 2024

​@Corry P has presented an answer from the Sonos engineers that the audio behavior of the Era 300’s is as to be expected. So until Sonos reverses that decision all of the Sabre rattling in this thread is pointless, IMO.

The pinned reply to this thread does not accurately describe the audio behaviour of the Era 300s provided in the Reddit Q&A yesterday, where it was confirmed the Era 300 inner speaker (tweeter & woofer) is not disabled when used as surrounds.

FYI, I corrected and removed ​@Corry P and replaced with ​@Jamie A as he was the one who brought the information. 😊

*inaccurate information

Contributor I
December 29, 2024

Hey, guys. Is there any updates on this topic? I have an Arc + Era300, and recently noticed that the Atmos rear sound is being played by the height driver. Literally, if a person is talking from the back in a movie, I can hear them from the ceiling. Lol, if a car is driving in the back, I hear it like it's coming from the ceiling. It messes up the sound terribly. That's ridiculous. I read this whole thread then, and the company's responses. I can confirm that this is definitely a bug and not an intentional feature "fix" in any way. Disappointed.

Enthusiast II
December 29, 2024

Hey, guys. Is there any updates on this topic? I have an Arc + Era300, and recently noticed that the Atmos rear sound is being played by the height driver. Literally, if a person is talking from the back in a movie, I can hear them from the ceiling. Lol, if a car is driving in the back, I hear it like it's coming from the ceiling. It messes up the sound terribly. That's ridiculous. I read this whole thread then, and the company's responses. I can confirm that this is definitely a bug and not an intentional feature "fix" in any way. Disappointed.

Sonos already confirmed “this is not a bug” as dumb as it may be. 

Contributor I
December 29, 2024

Hey, guys. Is there any updates on this topic? I have an Arc + Era300, and recently noticed that the Atmos rear sound is being played by the height driver. Literally, if a person is talking from the back in a movie, I can hear them from the ceiling. Lol, if a car is driving in the back, I hear it like it's coming from the ceiling. It messes up the sound terribly. That's ridiculous. I read this whole thread then, and the company's responses. I can confirm that this is definitely a bug and not an intentional feature "fix" in any way. Disappointed.

Sonos already confirmed “this is not a bug” as dumb as it may be. 

Yeah, I can see it now. As someone who has experience in acoustics I can confidently say that this is exactly a bug. If a monster is running at you from behind and you can hear it from the ceiling, lol. Waiting for a fix

Enthusiast II
December 29, 2024

We’re all waiting but tbh i’m not holding my breath. So disappointed by how Sonos has handled this 

Contributor I
December 29, 2024

Really wish they would just add volume sliders in the app for:

soundbar surround drivers

soundbar height drivers

Era 100/300 surround drivers

Era 100/300 rear surround drivers

Era 300 height drivers

also level out volume for rear surround drivers since it is so low now.

problem solved.