Contributor I

Lost surround and sub ( after update ?)

Forum|Forum|4 years ago
April 23, 2022
1604 replies
81294 views

Hi

I don’t know if my issue is related to the 14.6 update but I noticed today that I had no sound from my surround (play 3) and my sub (Gen 2), only the Arc is working They are still present in the app under the my System view but now sound which every sources

When I reboot each of them, the sound comes back temporary, but when I switch to another source or audio format, thé Sound disappears again. Tried several times, same behavior

Thanks for your help

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peterbault

Enthusiast II

bonded speakers use 5ghz when on wifi but they use 2.4ghz when on sonosnet right?

I experience the issues with both scenarios which makes me think it’s not interference. What are the chances I’d have interference on a certain channel on both bands around the same time

No, that’s not the case. The surrounds ‘bond’ to the master HT device using the ‘fast’ 5Ghz band ad-hoc wireless connection - it matters not how the Arc/Beam etc; is connected to the LAN. The 2.4Ghz band is not quite fast enough to keep up with the video on the TV screen.. you would end up with lip-sync issues if all were to use that band.

A HT device uses its 2.4Ghz band for its wireless connection for music audio/updates etc but the TV audio is received over HDMI-ARC or Optical and the rear channel TV audio is sent to surrounds immediately - hence only the 5Ghz band can be used to do that task (unless you choose to wire all to the router/switch).

Wow okay I had the wrong understanding all this time

B

Brad Porter

Enthusiast II

@Brad Porter,

If you can get the surrounds to dropout, it would be interesting to see what, if anything, happens to the 5Ghz ad-hoc wireless channel frequency. I understand that the channel is set by the master HT player and I’m just wondering if the surround might be dropping when on a certain assigned channel, as that might infer something is causing wireless interference - perhaps something near to one of the speakers using the routers 5Ghz band, perhaps?

My other thoughts are, that some modern routers and mesh-base systems (which can often have the same WiFi SSID for both their 2.4Ghz and 5Ghz bands) may have ‘band steering’ enabled to assign network devices to the most appropriate local WiFi band... Sonos speakers do have both 2.4Ghz & 5Ghz radio adapters, so I’m wondering if the routers are trying grab the surround speakers away and put them on their own band, causing the ad-hoc 5Ghz WiFi connection (between the main player and surround) to drop.

Of course that’s just some ‘pie in the sky’ thoughts, but maybe those who have this issue might want to perhaps explore such things.

Thanks @Ken_Griffiths - sounds like a good area to rule in/out. I have made notes and will check this the next time my system drops.

B

Brad Porter

Enthusiast II

@Brad Porter,

My other thoughts are, that some modern routers and mesh-base systems (which can often have the same WiFi SSID for both their 2.4Ghz and 5Ghz bands) may have ‘band steering’ enabled to assign network devices to the most appropriate local WiFi band... Sonos speakers do have both 2.4Ghz & 5Ghz radio adapters, so I’m wondering if the routers are trying grab the surround speakers away and put them on their own band, causing the ad-hoc 5Ghz WiFi connection (between the main player and surround) to drop.

Early on, I had some similar thoughts. However, I was thinking it was related to the 2.4Ghz 20Mhz and 40Mhz co-existance. i.e. whether the router was moving between 20Mhz and 40Mhz and that is why the speaker sounds is lost. I was further encouraged when I sometimes heard this really poor base sound that did not sound right - a little bit like a CB where someone is talking off-frequency so you can hear them in a garbled way as the frequency are close.

Not sure how much water that theory holds and I have turned off co-existance anyway and still had issues. But my router still broadcasts 40Mhz when I look at my Wi-Fi scanner…..

Ken_Griffiths

@Brad Porter,

My other thoughts are, that some modern routers and mesh-base systems (which can often have the same WiFi SSID for both their 2.4Ghz and 5Ghz bands) may have ‘band steering’ enabled to assign network devices to the most appropriate local WiFi band... Sonos speakers do have both 2.4Ghz & 5Ghz radio adapters, so I’m wondering if the routers are trying grab the surround speakers away and put them on their own band, causing the ad-hoc 5Ghz WiFi connection (between the main player and surround) to drop.

Early on, I had some similar thoughts. However, I was thinking it was related to the 2.4Ghz 20Mhz and 40Mhz co-existance. i.e. whether the router was moving between 20Mhz and 40Mhz and that is why the speaker sounds is lost. I was further encouraged when I sometimes heard this really poor base sound that did not sound right - a little bit like a CB where someone is talking off-frequency so you can hear them in a garbled way as the frequency are close.

Not sure how much water that theory holds and I have turned off co-existance anyway and still had issues. But my router still broadcasts 40Mhz when I look at my Wi-Fi scanner…..

A single 20MHz channel will be more stable in active regions with a lot of frequency noise and interference. A 40MHz channel-width provides for quicker transfer rates and higher speeds, but it does not work as well in congested locations (ie. neighbouring WiFi signals seen in your mobile network setup screen)… so when troubleshooting these type of speaker dropout issues, I would certainly aim for 20Mhz channel-width for your routers 2.4Ghz band and 40Mhz for the 5Ghz band.

I

Imamekanic

Lyricist I

I’m having same issue. I switch from Xbox one to Apple TV and my surrounds and sub will drop out. Just recently started. No prior issues and run an Eero mesh system.

Ken_Griffiths

I’m having same issue. I switch from Xbox one to Apple TV and my surrounds and sub will drop out. Just recently started. No prior issues and run an Eero mesh system.

I would note the Staff comment in this thread, to submit a Sonos diagnostic report within 10 minutes of it happening and note it’s reference …and contact Sonos Support via this LINK

peterbault

Enthusiast II

I still haven’t been able to break it after installing Sonos voice assistant

B

bschwartz

Contributor I

I’ve been running with eARC turned off for the past few weeks with a lot of success except when switching to the Xbox. I got cocky tonight and turned eARC back on because I really wanted to be able to use the Atmos I paid for by upgrading from my Playbar. Within five minutes of watching TV and just changing channels, not changing input sources, my sub and surround dropped out. Back to just using ARC. Will try the voice assistant activation route this weekend and see if I have any more luck. At this point the Arc is just a waste of money if I’m only going to be using Dolby 5.1. The Playbar handled that like a champ for years with no dropouts or problems. Not really happy I dropped $800+ right now for a worse experience.

W

W Lehmberg

Enthusiast II

Has Sonos stated that it’s definitively not a software issue? I’ve only seen responses that say they can’t reproduce the issue. Granted, I haven’t read every page of this thread.

That's a very fair question.

Sonos have remained fairly neutral in their responses. They have not explicitly ruled out a software issue, but neither have they offered any root-cause to why a subset of their customers are having an issue despite this thread and multiple support/diagnostics submissions.

I am certain this is challenging and specific edge case problem - which makes it hard to diagnose especially in lab type environments. But as mentioned before, there is a Sonos process to diagnose and resolve technical issues. But the process is being followed and once it gets to the Engineers, contact is severed or responses are untenable. In my personal situation, I now have two dead ends despite Corey P’s statement of the process to follow and Sonos commitment to fix.

Just checking in. Some of my posts have been deleted (external links of where to complain - heck - I even got banned from one of those sites for complaining, lol!)

Can’t remember my last post but can confirm that I haven’t had a drop since I installed the sonos voice assistant and power cycled everything. It’s been over a week and it’s just working flawlessly with my TCL series 6 Roku tv. I have not, and will not reconnect my ATV 4k (said I would try it but I don’t want to mess it up - too tired of this).

Two Ones, two gen 3 subs and an Arc, all up to date (14.8.1 in app). Even reconnected my satellite back up (Asus zenwifi ax 6600) and haven’t had a problem. Only installed voice assistant on Arc.

Hope this post doesn’t get deleted. I don’t switch inputs, just use the Roku and it’s been solid.

I’m happy to hear you’ve been unaffected but I like to switch inputs between my ATV and my 4K blu ray and my gaming consoles. Every time I do it’s a gamble to see if the system stays stable or not and frankly there is no consistency. I’m sure if I never switched inputs I’d be in the same boat as you but I want to get the most out of my system that I’ve spent a lot of money on…

I haven’t been unaffected. For two months since 14.6 update I was power-cycling everyday at one time or another just like everyone else. And I wasn’t even using my ATV or switching inputs. Just my using my Roku tv. There is no consistency, you are correct. That is what is maddening about it.

All I can say is it’s stable now. And I am not not switching inputs (wasn’t before). I don’t get it. All I did was install voice assistant on arc, power-cycle everything and it’s been fine like it was before the 14.6 update.

Just not sure the input switching is the definitive problem as I wasn’t doing it and still had the issue before installing voice assistant.

I’m sorry you and others are still dealing with this problem and I didn’t mean to sound flip about it. I can only report what I know.

B

Brad Porter

Enthusiast II

A single 20MHz channel will be more stable in active regions with a lot of frequency noise and interference. A 40MHz channel-width provides for quicker transfer rates and higher speeds, but it does not work as well in congested locations (ie. neighbouring WiFi signals seen in your mobile network setup screen)… so when troubleshooting these type of speaker dropout issues, I would certainly aim for 20Mhz channel-width for your routers 2.4Ghz band and 40Mhz for the 5Ghz band.

Thanks @Ken_Griffiths - sadly, the Netgear kit I have does not allow you to specifically set the band. You can disable co-existence support (to stop it moving between bands) but the advertised band is still 40Mhz for 2.4Ghz and 80Mhz for 5Ghz. Strangely, I have not had to worry about this up until April.

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