Apple lossless with Play5 / Sub Configuration

Cory,

Thanks for your reply
-- this makes sense because I believe I have a Gen 2 Sub (it works with S2).

My only other question (and perhaps I will post this):
When I add my Gen 2 Sub with my Play:5 pair, I lose the lossless badge on my Sonos IOS app.
Does this mean that all three speakers are now downsampled, or is the absence of the lossless banner just an indication that Sub is lossy, but the Play:5 are lossless?

Sub Gen2 is supported, I think @Corry P may have miss typed. 
Sonos reference only mentions the Gen1, see additional details here 

https://support.sonos.com/en-us/services/apple-music

Thanks, Almazri.
 

My Sub is 
Sonos OS : S2
Vers. 16.3.1 (Build 80.1-55240)
HW Vers. 1.25.1.8-1.2

I’ll try to confirm w/ Sonos which generation this unit is.
 

If you log in to your Sonos account and go to the system area it lists all your hardware and will tell you the gen of your sub and other Sonos products. 

Almazri,

Thanks!  I logged in and confirmed that my Sub is Gen 2.

Regards,

Tom

Hi @tomadelaney 

The entire room will be playing the same thing, so the Play:5s will be playing lossy audio due to the Sub Gen 2 not being capable of lossless.

And I am inclined to go with my assertion that the Sub Gen 2 is not supported due to a) the source of my info, and b) the fact that it doesn’t work.

Thanks to @almazri, however, for finding that support page - I’ll see if I can get it updated.

I hope this helps.

@Corry P my Sub is Gen2, Hardware Version: 1.8.6.6-2.2 paired with Arc, and I can play Apple Lossless, I see logo in App, and confirm bandwidth is 3-4Mb/s to Arc. I thought this was the case, but just confirmed a few moments ago.

What I suspect is happening is the Sonos system and adaptive bitrate protocol is deciding if the hardware and network is capable of lossless, ie if the hardware is capable, the network also has to be capable. So if its not working on supported hardware, the network connection to player and/or bonded Sub is not sufficient to sustain the higher bitrate.

Hi @craigski 

There could be a second test involved, but it would be strange if info I was given is wrong. 

Could I please ask both you and @tomadelaney to submit a support diagnostic while playing (or attempting to play) lossless tracks from Apple Music with Sub Gen 2 involved? Please don’t post the number - just let me know when you have done so. Thanks. I would like to get to the bottom of this.

Hi @craigski & @tomadelaney 

OK, scratch that. I’ve just been informed that when a Sub is bonded to a Home Theatre Primary device (like your Arc, @craigski), it is the HT Primary that determines what quality is played, not the Sub.

In other words, it is expected that a Sub Gen 2 will play lossless when bonded with an Arc, Beam or Ray, just as it is expected that when a Sub Gen 2 is bonded to a single speaker or stereo pair, it will not play lossless.

I hope this helps.

Corry, Craigski and Almazri,

Thanks to all of you for your follow-up.
My conclusion from your valuable discussion is that although all the components (Play:5 pair and Sub Gen2) are capable of playing lossless on my network, when grouped together in one room, Sonos can not deliver lossless.

I hope that this situation is improved through the latest products, or future products and firmware updates.  Perhaps it is time for me to also look at a product like Roon which would allow me to extend high fidelity endpoints beyond my current well-regarded Sonos ecosystem.