Contributor I

Answered

SONOS, Onkyo Works with SONOS, Unifi, pfSense

Forum|Forum|5 years ago
May 21, 2021
25 replies
1313 views

I've been working with Onkyo support off and on over the past few months on the following issue and am hoping someone else with a similar issue will find this post and help me (and hopefully Onkyo) troubleshoot.

I purchased the Onkyo around a year ago, setup my Port connected to an Onkyo that supports Works with SONOS (NR686) following some youtube video... Onkyo: Settings>Hardware>Works with SONOS>Connected device - choose my Port and all works great. I turn receiver off when done using, later on I start playing something on the Port zone using my Sonos app and it turns the receiver on, sets volume correctly so it can be controlled from my sonos app. Life is good.

Sometime last fall it all stops working. I can't point my finger on the root cause, but my thoughts were: sonos S2 or other update, onkyo firmware, I swapped in a new POE switch... lots of variables around the same time.

Now if I go to Onkyo: Settings>Hardware>Works with SONOS>Connected Device it either says "SONOS CONNECT was not found" or it just spins there on searching (sometimes locking up the Onkyo all together so I to yank the power before it'll work again).

Onkyo support couldn't replicate and suggested messing with Airtime Fairness settings in the Unifi environment. no dice.

I finally found some time to bang my head against the wall on this with many combinations of:

-consumer grade netgear router instead of pfsense

-netgear unmanged switch instead of unifi

-reboot equipment in every order under the sun

-sonosNet/wifi enabled on all devices except for 1 that is both wired and wifi enabled

-wifi disabled on every device and wired only

After a few false "I got it!" celebrations, here's where I am and wonder if others can replicate.... router doesn't matter at all - pfsense isn't the issue. Switch may or may not matter. Sonos relies heavily on Spanning Tree Protocol (STP). wifi enabled/disable probably doesn't matter. The issue is how many Sonos devices you have and maybe a timeout (?) on the Onkyo/STP side.

If I unplug my unifi switch/all sonos/onkyo, then first plug in my switch, then the onkyo, then my first 5 Sonos devices... things work. I can see a list of sonos devices/IP addresses when I go to Hardware>Works with SONOS>Connected Device. When I choose my Port, I can turn off my receiver, start playing something on that zone, and it will turn on the receiver and start playing. Life is good again.

That is until I plug in the rest of my SONOS devices (combo of Amps/Plays/Soundbars/etc). Then Hardware>Works with SONOS>Connected Device goes back to SONOS CONNECT was not found, selecting that zone does not turn on receiver and set it to the correct volume.

I did also add more Sonos devices last fall too - so maybe has nothing to do with firmware (onkyo or Sonos), a new switch or anything else, and it just number of Sonos devices

My working theory is that Onkyo uses STP as well when it's trying to talk to Sonos devices. When there's 5 or less devices, it can find everything before a timeout happens (??), but more than 5 devices a timeout happens first (??). Probably why Onkyo couldn't replicate... unlikely they have more than 5 Sonos devices in their lab.

Anyone else experiencing the same or similar problem? Other ideas?

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Best answer by James L.

Hi @brandilton,

We’re aware of an issue that can cause certain “Works with Sonos” compatible receivers to become unable to discover Sonos players. We have reached out to the manufacturers of the affected receivers to address issues caused with recent firmware updates that have broken the "Works with Sonos" link and believe a root cause has been discovered. A future firmware update on the receiver is expected to resolve this issue, but unfortunately we do not have an ETA on when it will be available. I’ve noted and passed your thread on to our Escalation Engineering team for review, and we will follow up with you if we need any additional information.

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controlav

Lead Maestro

I provided a bunch of packet captures to Sonos support. Among these, I noticed that my Sonos Port was sending an HTTP 412 error code in response to the UPnP subscribe message that seemed to get sent from the Onkyo when trying to set up Works with Sonos. Other UPnP implementations appear to send this message when there are too many subscriptions to keep track of. So, having a lot of Sonos speakers, as well as a lot of UPnP devices trying to subscribe (including Windows computers) might be what triggers this.

Interesting, sounds like the Onkyo simply cannot subscribe to enough events to work on larger systems. Sounds like an easy fix though (allow 32 per service). Why is it taking them this long??

Author of the leading independent Sonos apps for Android, MacOS, iOS, Windows and Xbox.

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Reggie_1

Trending Lyricist I

I provided a bunch of packet captures to Sonos support. Among these, I noticed that my Sonos Port was sending an HTTP 412 error code in response to the UPnP subscribe message that seemed to get sent from the Onkyo when trying to set up Works with Sonos. Other UPnP implementations appear to send this message when there are too many subscriptions to keep track of. So, having a lot of Sonos speakers, as well as a lot of UPnP devices trying to subscribe (including Windows computers) might be what triggers this.

Interesting, sounds like the Onkyo simply cannot subscribe to enough events to work on larger systems. Sounds like an easy fix though (allow 32 per service). Why is it taking them this long??

It’s not entirely obvious to me that’s where the problem lies. The Sonos is sending the 412 error code, not the Onkyo. And it’s sending it to other devices, too.

From reading the UPnP specs, it seems like it should be a recoverable error code. But it also sounds like it’s a rather uncommon one.

It seems plausible that there are bugs on both sides.

Its pretty disappointing that this issue has been around for 6 months without a resolution, though. Hopefully the engineering teams are working together as opposed to pointing fingers at each other.

controlav

Lead Maestro

If the Sonos is sending the 412 then there are too many subscriptions, I guess the Onkyo is over-subscribing for some reason? Or maybe forgetting to unsubscribe (though that happens automatically after a timeout).

Whatever it is, it is unacceptable that it hasn’t been fixed in 6 months.

Author of the leading independent Sonos apps for Android, MacOS, iOS, Windows and Xbox.

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Reggie_1

Trending Lyricist I

If the Sonos is sending the 412 then there are too many subscriptions, I guess the Onkyo is over-subscribing for some reason? Or maybe forgetting to unsubscribe (though that happens automatically after a timeout).

Whatever it is, it is unacceptable that it hasn’t been fixed in 6 months.

I wonder how long it took for Sonos to actually believe the people that were reporting the problem. My experience with Sonos support was absolutely miserable.

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brandiltonAuthor

Contributor I

FYI (from OP), the latest Onkyo firmware bumped it from 8 to 32 and is working great (finally!)

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Reggie_1

Trending Lyricist I

FYI (from OP), the latest Onkyo firmware bumped it from 8 to 32 and is working great (finally!)

Did they release it publicly? Or did you have to get it from Sonos or Onkyo support? I don’t see a firmware update for my model. (Onkyo TXNR787)

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brandiltonAuthor

Contributor I

Was available under settings>misc>firmware update on the Onkyo, like usual... Nothing special to get it applied.

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Reggie_1

Trending Lyricist I

Was available under settings>misc>firmware update on the Onkyo, like usual... Nothing special to get it applied.

Interesting. How did you see the limit was changed to 32 device? I don’t see any release notes posted on: https://www.intl.onkyo.com/support/firmware/tx-nr686.html

So far nothing for the TX-NR787. I called Onkyo support, and the service rep knew exactly what I was talking about. He said they’re working on it, but that it’s going to take a while to get it fixed on every device. Oddly, he suggested that the NRx8x models had a special network interface and would take more time. But it looks like you have one of those. Maybe he meant the NR8XX series, or perhaps just the NR78X series.

Nonetheless, I was glad to hear that they’re working on it, which if a big improvement over when I called in December. But I’m disappointed that he didn’t sound optimistic that a fix was coming soon for my model.

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brandiltonAuthor

Contributor I

Was available under settings>misc>firmware update on the Onkyo, like usual... Nothing special to get it applied.

Interesting. How did you see the limit was changed to 32 device? I don’t see any release notes posted on: https://www.intl.onkyo.com/support/firmware/tx-nr686.html

So far nothing for the TX-NR787. I called Onkyo support, and the service rep knew exactly what I was talking about. He said they’re working on it, but that it’s going to take a while to get it fixed on every device. Oddly, he suggested that the NRx8x models had a special network interface and would take more time. But it looks like you have one of those. Maybe he meant the NR8XX series, or perhaps just the NR78X series.

Nonetheless, I was glad to hear that they’re working on it, which if a big improvement over when I called in December. But I’m disappointed that he didn’t sound optimistic that a fix was coming soon for my model.

They did tell me the same thing at one point, then it came fairly quickly anyway. Hope they are just under promising in your case

R

Reggie_1

Trending Lyricist I

Was available under settings>misc>firmware update on the Onkyo, like usual... Nothing special to get it applied.

Interesting. How did you see the limit was changed to 32 device? I don’t see any release notes posted on: https://www.intl.onkyo.com/support/firmware/tx-nr686.html

So far nothing for the TX-NR787. I called Onkyo support, and the service rep knew exactly what I was talking about. He said they’re working on it, but that it’s going to take a while to get it fixed on every device. Oddly, he suggested that the NRx8x models had a special network interface and would take more time. But it looks like you have one of those. Maybe he meant the NR8XX series, or perhaps just the NR78X series.

Nonetheless, I was glad to hear that they’re working on it, which if a big improvement over when I called in December. But I’m disappointed that he didn’t sound optimistic that a fix was coming soon for my model.

They did tell me the same thing at one point, then it came fairly quickly anyway. Hope they are just under promising in your case

I guess I’d feel a bit better if I heard clear confirmation specifically about my model number, as opposed to general statements about the problem across a broad range of Onkyo AVRs. They’re probably working on it, but with consumer electronics companies I’m always worried about how long they’ll provide firmware updates to fix bugs that come up.

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