Sonos:Connect Delay Line-In

A pair of PLAY:1, PLAY:3 or PLAY:5 gen2 speakers can be bonded as surround with the PLAYBAR. It will also be able to group with the others to send that audio coming in over the optical (music or otherwise) across your network.

So if bonded to the Playbar, can the 1, 3, or 5 still be grouped with any other speakers? Seems like the word "bonded" is distinct from simply "grouped". As is creating a stereo pair, I'd guess. In other words, if you bond a speaker into a surround system, you make it unavailable for the rest of the Sonos network? True?

And then, looping back to the original question-- it sounds like, if you're a DJ, you could get your latency down to 30ms minimum if you had an analog-to-digital converter (assuming it does not introduce a delay of its own) to go from your mixer (unless it's an all-digital mixer) and then into your Playbar, then create a surround sound bond with other speakers you want to be part of your PA. You would just have to accept that 30ms delay between your headphones & speakers.

Worth experimenting?

So if bonded to the Playbar, can the 1, 3, or 5 still be grouped with any other speakers? Seems like the word "bonded" is distinct from simply "grouped". As is creating a stereo pair, I'd guess. In other words, if you bond a speaker into a surround system, you make it unavailable for the rest of the Sonos network? True?

True, "bonding" is a term which means those players are part of the room named after the PLAYBAR. They act only with the PLAYBAR unless un-bonded and operate as surround speakers.

And then, looping back to the original question-- it sounds like, if you're a DJ, you could get your latency down to 30ms minimum if you had an analog-to-digital converter (assuming it does not introduce a delay of its own) to go from your mixer (unless it's an all-digital mixer) and then into your Playbar, then create a surround sound bond with other speakers you want to be part of your PA. You would just have to accept that 30ms delay between your headphones & speakers.

Worth experimenting?

Also correct, with assumptions that is 🙂

So there's no confusion: analog-to-digital or digital-to-analog conversion is virtually instantaneous. The inbuilt delay is to allow for synchronised playback across an asynchronous packet network. Sufficient buffering must be provided at the receiver to cater for the expected variation in transit times across the network, i.e. the packet jitter.

I've stumbled across this and other threads on this issue - had I known, I'd have never bought my connect amp. I too want to be able to run my decks, etc. via the line-in, and the delay makes it exceptionally difficult to mix (speaking as a former professional DJ of 25 years in clubs!)

Can someone (ideally Sonos staff) confirm that the playbar reduces the delay - or better still, allows you to adjust it manually

Finally, any other fellow DJs tried the playbar to do the same

PLAYBAR's delay through its optical port is 30ms. Satellite speakers bonded to it for 5.1 (surrounds, SUB) obviously always play in sync. However any other rooms grouped with it are subject to the same 70ms delay as with a regular Line-In. In other words grouped rooms are out of sync with the PLAYBAR for TV.

There's no way to reduce these delays, though PLAYBAR has a lip-sync adjustment which can be used to increase its delay. The delays are due to network buffering, essential to maintain synced play without dropouts.

There used to be a FAQ explaining all this, but for some reason it seems to have been pulled.

Frankly, Sonos is not for you if you need to do split-second DJ style cueing.

PLAYBAR's delay through its optical port is 30ms. Satellite speakers bonded to it for 5.1 (surrounds, SUB) obviously always play in sync. However any other rooms grouped with it are subject to the same 70ms delay as with a regular Line-In. In other words grouped rooms are out of sync with the PLAYBAR for TV.

There's no way to reduce these delays, though PLAYBAR has a lip-sync adjustment which can be used to increase its delay. The delays are due to network buffering, essential to maintain synced play without dropouts.

There used to be a FAQ explaining all this, but for some reason it seems to have been pulled.

Frankly, Sonos is not for you if you need to do split-second DJ style cueing.

To be honest, I'm having issues with the latency listening from only one deck at a not-too-low volume. I can hear the needle playing before I hear it in the speakers. Would be great to somehow eliminate the lag...

Would be great to somehow eliminate the lag...
You can't I'm afraid. Yours is not an application which Sonos is designed for.

I’m experiencing this also, it seems like a crazy issue for a high tech piece of kit that can run into £$£$. I bought a couple of Sonos one speakers and a connect to wire into my existing amp/cd set-up - but when I hit play there is a noticable (even at 70ms) delay between the Sonos speakers and hard wired speakers. I didn’t expect this from Sonos, who I feel have either mislead on what their product is capable of (why would you buy this to connect to an amp if there is a known lag?) or have simply failed to produce a seamless multi room/ multi connected experience. My fault for not checking these things before purchase I guess but really It didn’t cross my mind to be an issue from such a highly regarded company. Rant over.

FWIW,

Some home theatre Amps and surrounds come with built-in lip sync delay features. One example that I use in one of my rooms at home, is an old Sony HT-AS5 5.1 Home Theatre System, which allows you to slow down its audio source to the HT system (eg. TV audio) in 10ms increments ... up to a maximum of 200ms delay .. I have found that I can get away with a 30ms delay on the HT audio in my case to the Home Theatre Speakers and also connect the HT system VIA a 3.5mm line-in on a stereo paired of Play-5 speakers, which in turn are grouped (via the Sonos App) with a stereo pair of Play-1 speakers and I do get great TV surround sound in excellent sync with the TV picture. The delays are obviously such that the picture to audio sync is unnoticeable.

Obviously the Sony HT takes over completely from the inbuilt TV Speakers... so there are no sync issues in that respect at all.

It’s s cheap way of getting TV (stereo) surround sound, albeit not in any strictest sense of the word, but it does work well enough. The audio out to the 5.1 Sony Speakers is sync'd brilliantly with my four Sonos speakers.

I have set the Sonos Settings to use uncompressec audio...and the line in in room settings source name is set to Home Theatre with a setting of Level 2 A/V component.

The other line in on my Play-5 in the stereo pair, is also in use with an Apple Airport Express device and that works well too with the audio set to uncompressed and the line in source name set to Satellite Receiver (which you can rename to something like Airplay etc.) with a setting of Level 4 (Airplay) and all that seems to work quite well for me too.

So it’s sometimes a case of trying to find a home theatre with a lip-sync built p-in delay capability and then messing around with the Sonos audio settings to get the best possible sync across the devices available.

But like Ratty says above in his post, Sonos is not a system that I see for DJ style queuing, but it is sometimes possible to get things in sync with a TV Home Theatre systems, but they really must have their own in built lip-sync features.

Just thought that these things were also perhaps worth sharing here.