Line-In Latency/Delay Disable PLAY:5

Good luck @somatic.  SONOS has been happily ignoring this defining requirement of all speaker products, for years; Supported by a chorus of echoing audiophile fanatics with rose colored glasses.

The absence of a clear pre-sale warning label stating that delay is intentionally added, combined with the fact that most other speakers do not intentionally add delay should itself be grounds for a class action false advertising suit, not just their victims emberassingly pointing it out on a web forum.

The delay we experience is not an accident, or physics, it’s intentionally designed into the code by choice of Sonos.

That sonos doesn’t have an off button for this misfeature, just adds insult to injury.

Yep.

First off, the new headphones and mini-move are likely to operate similar to the Move, in that they will have a WiFi mode and BT mode.  No delay (other than standard BT delay) in BT mode.  So in some way you’ll likely get what your asking for in these products.  The headphones are even rumored to have a aux line in.    I’d argue they are still part of Sonos wheelhouse though, as they surely will be able to to participate in the whole home network, as the Move does in WiFi mode.

Worth noting thought that all three of the products have a BT mode not so much to remove delays but so that they can be used away from the home.   So does it makes sense for Sonos to make products that work with TVs and be part of the whole home system?  Yes, they have made several of those.  Does it make sense to make a product that can be used as a computer speaker, DJ speaker, or PA system?  Right now, doesn’t appear to be a high priority. 

I’m not criticizing the request personally.  I just think it’s a bit much to conclude the development and support of the feature on existing products is easy and cheap, or that loads of customers consider it a must have feature. 

And exactly what evidence does the poster have that this is an “artificially added delay”?  For all we know, the only path from the line is through the digitizing and buffering hardware and it can’t be changed in software.  A lot of rank speculation in this thread, with no balance to the other possibilities.

And yes, the number of posters clamoring for this feature is miniscule compared to the number of owners.  Vocal? Yes.  But 1,000 posts by 10 people is not equivalent to 10 posts by 1,000 people.  It’s hysterical that one without any knowledge of Sonos’ use case data is saying Sonos, who collect and collate this data on a massive scale, are the ones with their heads in the sand.  Guess a sense of irony is not their strong suit.

uhm.  how about the settings screen in their own app….  where the Sonos gods graciously let us choose which delay of four choices they personally excreted, which happen to all be round numbers.

Get your facts straight before you open your mouth.

That setting should be a variable slider with 0ms on the left side.  If 0ms results in jittery audio, great!  pop up a little we told you so notice when the user selects less than 70ms.  But don’t interfere with 0ms if that’s what users paid for.  (And it is what they paid for unless you can show me where on the box it says 70ms minimum latency.)

Suggest 70ms as the minimum if you want.  Let the slider “snap” to 70, and the other recommended latencies.  fine. but get out of the user’s way and OBEY THEM if they want to choose 5ms or 10 or 0.

So because you have the option to modify the delay within a range, you assume that the delay can be modified to less delay than in your provided range?  That’s your evidence?  Could it possibly be the range is limited for technical reasons rather than arbitrary?

Good grief! 

Of course it is arbitrary.  Otherwise, the argument would be moot, and the posters asking for this feature would be incorrect in their assumptions.  And that can never happen.  Ever.  So they apply their “logic” in any way that makes them correct.  Rinse.  Lather.  Repeat.  Just like the people who still think you can fit a 1 Gig application in a 124 K bag.

It is arbitrary.  You know it.  I know it. 

I’ve worked at embedded hardware companies before.  Some QA team (maybe just one guy) tested a range of latencies on a couple linksys routers a decade ago and decided 70 was “about as good as it would get without stuttering”, and they closed the ticket and went home for the day.

Call it arbitrary or not….  It was a subjective decision.  One in which I’m not interested.

This is like someone at Burger King’s corporate office deciding three pickels is the right number to put on a burger.  Yeah, it’s probably a fine decision for most people.  And most people won’t even think about it.  But if I want an extra pickel or no pickels, you know, I bet even Burger King would do that if I asked, with minimal to no complaints, instead of sticking their head in the sand.  And there wouldn’t be someone standing around telling me how unusual my no pickels request is and that it doesn’t fit the business model.  GIVE ME A BREAK.

OK, y’all have made your points, you’re not making any progress here. Accept that there might be someone wrong on the internet. The thread would be more fruitful if it’s just a space for people to post their support for low-latency line-in and how they’d like to use it. 

Adding my support for no latency option on the 5's. However this could be possible, I was so surprised to hear there was a delay when using the line in. I had incorrectly assumed sync wouldn't be an option when using line in, but that they would be just bypassing the sync software.

If this feature removes the ability to sync that's the price you pay for no latency, fine by me or if there is a delay on other speakers also fine by me, or if it's advised against due to stuttering then let users decide, but do allow the speaker to be a simple speaker in line in mode if... possible.

The option to use the 5's as standalone speakers will appeal to more than just those willing to post here, many musicians for instance.

For now I've got two 5's as my surround speakers, and two other brand simple monitor speakers on top for my decks, piano and computer sequencing!