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Peter Mc
August 23, 2016
Question

Connect no longer bit-perfect?

  • August 23, 2016
  • 450 replies
  • 29769 views
It looks like the Connect is no longer bit-perfect. Here's my evidence: let's discuss this.

First, I constructed a wav file of pink noise with amplitude ramping up from zero to digital max and back to zero.
I play this through my Connect and record the SPDIF output from the coax output into my PC.
The recording uses a Scarlett 8i6 audio interface set to use the Connect as master clock.
I record into a DAW (Sonar) multiple times - all instances are identical.
However, this recorded signal is not quite the same as the original wav file - it can be up to -21dB different.
See https://www.dropbox.com/s/t8od479xo9hi5el/connect_diff.PNG?dl=1
Note the expanded scale on the difference (third) track.

It looks like the difference gets larger when the signal is larger. To confirm this, I import the
original and difference files into Matlab and plot the raw data (difference vs original). There is clearly audio compression
happening here. See https://www.dropbox.com/s/p1yq6wcqafvnhaj/diff_vs_orig.png?dl=1
The scale is such that digital maximum is 1.

There also appears to be a slight bias when the waveform is negative and the signal is below the
compression threshold. See an expanded version of the previous plot
https://www.dropbox.com/s/9001tl9mkle4wly/diff_vs_orig_zoom.png?dl=1

Happy to answer questions about the method and conclusions.

Cheers, Peter.

p.s. Volume is set to fixed - I haven't tried variable.
In a loopback test (8i6 out from DAW to 8i6 in, no Sonos gear involved), I get bit-perfect cancellation.
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    450 replies

    Trending Lyricist I
    January 29, 2017
    The silence represents Sonos's arrogance IMO. Does Sonos have a great products yes. Is there room for improvement on on both the hardware and software -Yes. I think the secrecy surrounding new product refreshes(if any are even coming) is getting a little frustrating for us loyal Sonos supporters. Lets look at the outdated Connect. Aesthetically it ugly. I personally hide my three behind all my other gear. Not bit perfect, does not have a 12v trigger output, does not support high res files (even over a hard wired connection) wont be able to support MQA even if MQA is successful. Compeditors like the Bluesound and their Node 2 hardware has surpassed offering from Sonos. They have listed to their customers and critics and responded with upgraded equipment. Why can't Sonos do the same for their customers. If Sonos is working on a Connect replacement what would be wrong with a small press release from Sonos to stating exciting times ahead for you Sonos Connect users. Give us loyal customers a bone. if they are not working on a replacement connect then let us know here in this thread. If Sonos does not feel a replacement Connect is where they want to spend their resourses at this time please let the rest of us know. Maybe they dont sell enough connects to warrant an upgrade in their opinion. I dont think there are many users here who are heavily invested in the Sonos ecosystem want to change from Sonos. This is of course provided the Sonos offereing are up to date and current. I personally do not what to change. I only what an upgraded connect that will compete with the majortiy of other streamers in the market today addressing todays requirements. Sure Sonos is going through some overdue changes in management. Hopefully the new president will have vision of the future and wont be scared to talk about it. If new connect hardware is not in the future then let us know so we can move on to other offerings in the market place. We all want Sonos to succeed. Sonos not answering valid customer questions makes me feel slighted and unappreciated by Sonos.
    jgatie
    January 29, 2017
    Lol @ MQA. 😃
    Trending Lyricist I
    January 29, 2017
    I agree on the MQA front, but it still does not address the silence from Sonos. I just spent the last hour reading over at the the Bluesound forums. I must admit it was refreshing. Bluesound employees answering questions and concerns.

    If the Node2 bit perfect. Answer yes. Employees addressing issues and acknowledging customer requests for future software upgrades. It is just a different culture over there. I think Sonos could learn a little from visiting their compeditotrs forums. Like I said i dont want to change from Sonos but the Node2 is looking more interesting everyday. In the mean time we the Sonos supporters are left with well, nothing to look forward too on the connect front.
    chicks
    January 29, 2017
    Bluesound caters to a tiny niche market, audiophiles who often believe things which have no basis in fact. They really aren't much of a threat. Sonos has moved well beyond that niche to become the premier provider of high quality connected speakers for the fast growing music streaming market. So long as they don't lose their focus on sound quality, ala Bose, I'll be a happy customer.
    jgatie
    January 29, 2017
    I find it amazing that people will put up with a crap interface like Bluesound just because they "answer" questions in a forum. Apparently for some, tickling egos with promises of future enhancements is far more important than actually following through with those promises. Personally, I'm not interested in being stroked.
    Trending Lyricist I
    January 29, 2017
    Jgaitie

    Like I said a completely different culture over there. I hope to in the next few days write to the new Sonos President and use your reply as an example of how the Sonos community is moving forward with a positive attitude and direction. Let's hope he does not take your lead or Sonos will be destined to fail.

    Let's hope he appreciates the customers he does have.

    Enjoy the rest of your day.
    Trending Lyricist I
    January 29, 2017
    Chicks

    I can appreciate your response if all you may be looking forward for is good sounding wireless speakers. I agree and I enjoy the Sonos speaker lineup. I personally would like to see enhancements to products other that their speaker lineup. I would like a 12v trigger in a connect to be able to turn on a separate amp to drive a better set of speakers than what Sonos is the offering. The Sonos connect amp does not have enough power for my use.
    January 29, 2017
    Use a Sonos Connect with an amp that can turn itself on when it senses audio. These amps also usually provide 12V out in case you need to activate other devices as well.
    Local music library with carefully constructed playlists - no shuffling!, Integration with Homeseer Automation, No touch screen devices, No streaming services, No Apple products ever
    Trending Lyricist I
    January 29, 2017
    UpstateMike

    Thanks for your reply.

    I have tried that with inconsistent results. Parasound A23 amp set to turn on when it senses audio worked inconsistent. Low volumes it would shut down. Better audio equipment use 12v trigger as a standard. I would hope Sonos would consider my suggestion in future upgrades to the connect.
    jgatie
    January 29, 2017
    Jgaitie

    Like I said a completely different culture over there. I hope to in the next few days write to the new Sonos President and use your reply as an example of how the Sonos community is moving forward with a positive attitude and direction. Let's hope he does not take your lead or Sonos will be destined to fail.

    Let's hope he appreciates the customers he does have.

    Enjoy the rest of your day.


    Use my reply all you wish. I hope he actually does follow my lead. I'd much rather Sonos keep doing as it is doing than follow companies like Denon or Bluesound who promise the world to their customers and never follow through. I also don't want Sonos chasing nonsense like MQA. I couldn't care less about the culture of a company if their product doesn't match up. As I said, I don't need my ego stroked in a forum and I don't need audio snake oil.