Connect:AMP digital input

Interesting posts. It certainly shows that different people have different expectations of this pretty good system. It's a pity that Sonos seems so aloof, somewhat snobby and silently disrespectful of its customers. I'm a very new user with just one Play1 and a boost with which I'm trying to tackle drop-outs. I was totally under-whelmed by the European help-desk: next to useless for outcome, but tried hard and was polite!

I feel there may be a generation thing here. My HiFi amp is so old that it doesn't have a line-out, so I'm expecting audio line-in to Connect to work if I use tape-out from my amp. I have a huge collection of vinyls, tapes and CDs that I'll never convert or replace, so Connect probably does well for me. I rarely listen to internet radio, as I usually prefer to put together my own play-lists, so the market is probably broader than some assert. As a Sonos novice, I would find It useful if they gave a comprehensive set of possible connection modes, rather than relying on trial-and-error and a community bale-out.

On the portable comment, I move my Play1 around the house, but have to reboot every time I do so. It would be useful for it to have a small rechargeable battery on board that would maintain registration and storage for, say, 30 mins down-time. Being able to label it 'portable' is rather a misnomer without something like this.

LHC - don't be rude to someone you don't know. Perhaps you are too young to recognise humour. In ten years time most equipment now will be obsolete anyway - the market place is now, not in ten years time. If you can't be polite or helpful, you might as well not bother (That's me paraphrasing you, in case you don't recognise it). I can't speak for 'most people' - I only speak for myself. Not a helpful post.

PGMA - tape out and line out are in effect the same thing. I struggle with the Sonos site, as do others - it doesn't do well in telling you in simple terms what you need for what. I'm an electronic/computing engineer and if its not clear to me I expect that Joe Public hasn't a chance. I guess the sales staff at outlets cover for that.
My point is that it seems a missed opportunity to have other digital sources in the house that have to be converted to analogue in order to connect to to the Connect. A possibly ironic name...

The kit so far seems very good - the only problem I have had is with my Server 2012 streaming, which cuts out but is possibly a Bill Gates issue - or maybe my 'best of breed' BT wifi...

LHC - don't be rude to someone you don't know. Perhaps you are too young to recognise humour. In ten years time most equipment now will be obsolete anyway - the market place is now, not in ten years time. If you can't be polite or helpful, you might as well not bother (That's me paraphrasing you, in case you don't recognise it). I can't speak for 'most people' - I only speak for myself. Not a helpful post.

Humour? In what way was that supposed to be funny? The comment makes no sense whatsoever and isn't remotely funny, it doesn't even give any indication that it's supposed to be funny. An octogenarian wouldn't recognize that as humour.

And I agree the marketplace is now and right now the overwhelming majority of Sonos users are NOT using the line-in. Incidentally the original Sonos products, the zp80 and zp100 are ten years old now and still integrate with the rest of the system perfectly.

PGMA - tape out and line out are in effect the same thing. I struggle with the Sonos site, as do others - it doesn't do well in telling you in simple terms what you need for what. I'm an electronic/computing engineer and if its not clear to me I expect that Joe Public hasn't a chance. I guess the sales staff at outlets cover for that. [/quote]

I do find it amazing the number of engineering/IT people that claim they can't make head nor tail of the system, as someone with an electronic engineering background now working in IT it all seems trivially simple to me, what exactly is the problem?

My point is that it seems a missed opportunity to have other digital sources in the house that have to be converted to analogue in order to connect to to the Connect. A possibly ironic name...

I expect the thinking was that the Sonos system would replace any previous source devices. It does seem counter-intuitive to buy a digital audio system and then attempt to use a CD player with it but then I haven't owned a CD player in the house for about twenty years. I still listen to all my CDs through my Sonos system though.

The kit so far seems very good - the only problem I have had is with my Server 2012 streaming, which cuts out but is possibly a Bill Gates issue - or maybe my 'best of breed' BT wifi...

Is the server wired or wireless? A wireless file server isn't officially supported by Sonos, it's an outside variable that they can't control. If it is wireless, try wiring it temporarily to see if that improves matters.

I do find it amazing the number of engineering/IT people that claim they can't make head nor tail of the system, as someone with an electronic engineering background now working in IT it all seems trivially simple to me, what exactly is the problem?.
I don't want to go too far off subject on this thread - I guess this is a subject in itself. It is trivially simple to set up and use, but conceptually to someone who hasn't dealt with any streaming before, the 'what do I need to do what I want' is not obvious from the website - and there is a fair amount of similar comment on this subject when I started searching to find out for myself. I'm pleasantly surprised to find that the controller is fully usable on PCs - my initial impression was that it was aimed at IOS/Android, and I set it up on my iPad before adding various PCs into the mix.


Is the server wired or wireless? A wireless file server isn't officially supported by Sonos, it's an outside variable that they can't control. If it is wireless, try wiring it temporarily to see if that improves matters.
The server is wired to my wireless hub - I'd expect Sonos to cope with the wireless connection from there. I suspect the issue is with the server as a reboot has resolved the problem of tracks cutting halfway through (occurred twice so far). Server2012 streaming capability is limited to around 50000 tracks - I'm using MediaMonkey which seems to get round that limit. My Homeserver2011's streaming function does not have that limit. If it continues to occur I'll wire the PlayBar to the hub to see if it is wireless link - thanks for the suggestion. I'd also tried connecting to a music share but seemed to hit an index limit on the PlayBar library so reverted to streaming.

Back to the first comment above, the Sonos website does not oversell the capabilities/technical aspects of the system - I guess that there is a fair amount of controller technology in the individual items. I only have the PlayBar and sub so far, and was waiting for the new Play:5 and possibly some Play:1s or 3s to scatter round the house - and the Connect for the HiFi. From the website I wasn't sure how the system worked - I knew it connected source to player/speaker but didn't expect to see a media library function on the PlayBar when I used the share as a source. It's intrigued me as to how its done. Do the speakers have the same functionality - is it shared/distributed between components, and how much of the controller function is duplicated (might explain the high costs)? It certainly works and produces excellent sound - which is why I've bought into it.

You seem to be a vehement supporter and multi-poster - are you in any way affiliated to Sonos, or just an enthusiastic enthusiast?

keiths,

SONOS support staff and employees are identified as such as part of their user names.

Think of each SONOS player as being an independent agent that fetches its own music. Once the players have been given a list of things to do, the controllers can be shut down. A full system could include 32 hardware units and 32 simultaneous controllers.

As far a cost is concerned, it depends on your roots. If you are approaching SONOS as a whole house audio system it is inexpensive and, in my opinion, offers better features and benefits than anything else. (However, no product does everything for everyone) If you approach SONOS as a computer accessory, SONOS is too expensive because computer accessories must be priced at about $100 or less.

I do find it amazing the number of engineering/IT people that claim they can't make head nor tail of the system, as someone with an electronic engineering background now working in IT it all seems trivially simple to me, what exactly is the problem?.
I don't want to go too far off subject on this thread - I guess this is a subject in itself.

Yeah, but it's the internet, what's a little thread drift...

It is trivially simple to set up and use, but conceptually to someone who hasn't dealt with any streaming before, the 'what do I need to do what I want' is not obvious from the website - and there is a fair amount of similar comment on this subject when I started searching to find out for myself. I'm pleasantly surprised to find that the controller is fully usable on PCs - my initial impression was that it was aimed at IOS/Android, and I set it up on my iPad before adding various PCs into the mix.

Well, it's not so surprising when you realise that Sonos pre-dates the smartphone/tablet by a few years, so originally the only free controller was the PC software, with the hardware controller costing over £250.

Is the server wired or wireless? A wireless file server isn't officially supported by Sonos, it's an outside variable that they can't control. If it is wireless, try wiring it temporarily to see if that improves matters.
The server is wired to my wireless hub

Do you mean your router? That's fine then.

I'd expect Sonos to cope with the wireless connection from there.

Yes, although bear in mind that configuring Sonos to connect directly to your own wireless is a recent addition to the system and the preferred method is still to use Sonosnet, which requires one device to be wired. As you've only got the Playbar and Sub it probably won't make any difference but once you start expanding beyond a handful of units it may become relevant, particularly if you start placing units on the edge of your wifi's range.

I suspect the issue is with the server as a reboot has resolved the problem of tracks cutting halfway through (occurred twice so far). Server2012 streaming capability is limited to around 50000 tracks - I'm using MediaMonkey which seems to get round that limit. My Homeserver2011's streaming function does not have that limit. If it continues to occur I'll wire the PlayBar to the hub to see if it is wireless link - thanks for the suggestion. I'd also tried connecting to a music share but seemed to hit an index limit on the PlayBar library so reverted to streaming.

Yes, Sonos is limited to 65,000 tracks, however that's dependent on efficient tagging, if you have particularly long tags (ie for classical music for example) you may hit the limit a lot sooner. You could investigate Subsonic, I understand that's very popular with users with large collections (and you won't get any sort of answer out of Sonos on this issue).

Back to the first comment above, the Sonos website does not oversell the capabilities/technical aspects of the system - I guess that there is a fair amount of controller technology in the individual items. I only have the PlayBar and sub so far, and was waiting for the new Play:5 and possibly some Play:1s or 3s to scatter round the house - and the Connect for the HiFi. From the website I wasn't sure how the system worked - I knew it connected source to player/speaker but didn't expect to see a media library function on the PlayBar when I used the share as a source. It's intrigued me as to how its done. Do the speakers have the same functionality - is it shared/distributed between components, and how much of the controller function is duplicated (might explain the high costs)? It certainly works and produces excellent sound - which is why I've bought into it.

Every Sonos player is effectively the same in terms of the internal system, the only differences are the number of amps/speakers they contain (none for the Connect, multiple amps and speakers for the Play devices), they are all fully integrated music players in their own right, there is no central "brain", each unit stores its own copy of the music index and service information, every unit can operate independently of each other and indeed without any controller interaction at all, the controllers only issue commands, they don't actually do anything beyond that, save display the current status. Once playing the controller unit can be switched off and the Player will carry on regardless.

You seem to be a vehement supporter and multi-poster - are you in any way affiliated to Sonos, or just an enthusiastic enthusiast?

The latter, I bought into Sonos back in the ZP90/120 days, I was sold from the moment I realised it had taken me longer to get the gear out of the boxes than it did to set them up and playing (still does, the Play:1 box is a sod to get open!). I've literally never had a single issue since, despite an uncooperative house with thick stone walls that effectively block wifi signals completely but a couple of conveniently placed bridges looking through doorways gets around that issue (that's the beauty of using Sonosnet incidentally, the mesh network is very robust).

So yeah, I'm an enthusiast, I mainly just get annoyed when people steam in here mouthing off about how the system "just doesn't work" or it hasn't been properly developed. I've got about 8 years experience which says it DOES work and if you want to see not properly developed, buy one of the competitor products.

PMGA - I have to disagree about the help desk. I have used both the Dutch and English language help desk and found them to be most knowledgeable and helpful and exceedingly patient in tracing and solving the problems that I have had. I don't know of any other hardware manufacturer that can match Sonos in this respect.

Here is the problem. The Sonos forums have countless threads that all variants of this topic:

It Would Be Great If Sonos Had (pick one: DTS, Digital Inputs, Inputs on X, Outputs on Y, etc...)

The sad part is, Sonos doesn't care, not even one little bit. They are marching down their own road which seems to dedicate all their resources toward software (which they do quite well). If you are waiting for hardware, interface, speaker quality, or just about any other tangible improvement, you are going to be really disappointed.

The good part is, for what they do, they do it really well (better than anyone else).

The part I cannot understand (and I see this with companies everywhere) why would you leave so much money on the table? For the cost of a few inputs, outputs, and licenses (most of which can be passed onto the customer at 500% margin and still not raise the price that much), why wouldn't you? Is there literally a person at Sonos who's job it is to say, "No, the we don't want DTS, I don't care if we can make money at it, and all of our users want it, No. And the same goes for digital inputs on Connect! We are even sure if this digital audio thing is going to catch on..."

I just boggles the mind.

It doesn't boggle the mind. There are a few very vocal people voicing their ire in multiple threads. A loud and angry mob is still just a mob, and is not the market Sonos is aimed at. The market Sonos is aimed at is the market that makes them the top selling multi-room system at Amazon, with every item, including Playbar, rating over 4 stars in customer reviews. A rating achieved despite a movement to slag those reviews by the same vocal few you find here.

Some folks get bogged down in technical specs and esoteric functionality, others just want it to work. And aside from DTS on the Playbar, it just works. Unlike the competition.

It doesn't boggle the mind. There are a few very vocal people voicing their ire in multiple threads. A loud and angry mob is still just a mob, and is not the market Sonos is aimed at. The market Sonos is aimed at is the market that makes them the top selling multi-room system at Amazon, with every item, including Playbay, rating over 4 stars in customer reviews. A rating achieved despite a movement to slag those reviews by the same vocal few you find here.

Some folks get bogged down in technical specs and esoteric functionality, others just want it to work. And aside from DTS on the Playbar, it just works. Unlike the competition.

Yup, aside from DTS, for you. All I am saying is that there are quite a few /aside/ froms with this product. And, if he multi room music market does not encompass integration with other I/O then they should drop the connection and connect amp.

And yes, I just want it to work. I would love to go to BB and pick up an optical cable and connect (hmmm....) my TV to my Connect. Nope. Just Work = 0. Where are those converts again? Just hang that down there, or tie wrap it up there and...

Too many companies reach the pinnacle of their market and start to believe their own press about how good they are and how they define and drive the market, and then develop sense that they are bullet proof.

To me, Sonos is in the whole house music business. Do they want me buying other companies products in their market to fill holes in their lines product lines? If they have a Connect then they want to input/output from other things (unless I read the manual wrong that came with my connect), yet it does not have digital inputs. There are many things like that in their product lines, that just don't make sense to me. I guess they don't have to. They are No. 1 in their market and so they ... (again, boggles my mine).

And, don't get me wrong. Like I said, Sonos is hands down the best at while house music. Right now it is not even close. I lead with Sonos for almost 100% of the the systems that I build, even with its short comings. No other product can handle both the TV surround and rest of the house from a single pane of glass.