UPDATE: I have just realized there is an “advanced setup” section of the forums. But I don’t know how to move my existing question. If a moderator can move it, please do! I’ve had a Sonos system for a while (all Play3s) always with one wired to my home network. Times have changed, my home network has grown more complex and now I’m in the situation where I have several APs all using the same SSID but on different channels. This is a common practice to increase coverage, but the end result is on 2.4Ghz, the APs are already broadcasting on either 1,6, or 11. Letting Sonos use SonosNet, just ends up causing interference both to my wifi network and to Sonos. I use my wifi network for a lot more things, so I’m not very tolerant of interference from Sonos here. I’m comfortable with the reliability of the wifi network, so I decided to try moving Sonos to my wifi network. A few things surprised me, so I thought I would ask here: I’ve got at least one spot it would be easy to use a wired connection with a Sonos player, but it looks like if any Sonos devices are wired, then the whole system uses SonosNet? It seems like it would be better to let all devices be on wifi or wired, as long as they are all reachable on the same subnet. When switching to wireless, I put in the SSID from my Sonos mobile app. I assumed each device would join the AP nearest to it, but it looks like all Sonos device want to join the same wifi channel, which puts a couple of them pretty far from their AP. I verified this by checking: http://X.X.X.X:1400/status/proc/ath_rincon/status for each of the devices. In my case this is channel 6. Two of them are sitting very near APs using channels 1, and 11, but they’re staying fixated on the farthest AP, which uses ch6. Is this right? What I’m looking for is some advice for Sonos co-existing nicely with a multi-AP network that already uses Ch1, 6, 11.

Contributor III

Answered

Using Sonos on home wifi same SSID, different channels

16 replies
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UPDATE: I have just realized there is an “advanced setup” section of the forums. But I don’t know how to move my existing question. If a moderator can move it, please do!

I’ve had a Sonos system for a while (all Play3s) always with one wired to my home network. Times have changed, my home network has grown more complex and now I’m in the situation where I have several APs all using the same SSID but on different channels. This is a common practice to increase coverage, but the end result is on 2.4Ghz, the APs are already broadcasting on either 1,6, or 11. Letting Sonos use SonosNet, just ends up causing interference both to my wifi network and to Sonos. I use my wifi network for a lot more things, so I’m not very tolerant of interference from Sonos here.

I’m comfortable with the reliability of the wifi network, so I decided to try moving Sonos to my wifi network. A few things surprised me, so I thought I would ask here:

I’ve got at least one spot it would be easy to use a wired connection with a Sonos player, but it looks like if any Sonos devices are wired, then the whole system uses SonosNet? It seems like it would be better to let all devices be on wifi or wired, as long as they are all reachable on the same subnet.
When switching to wireless, I put in the SSID from my Sonos mobile app. I assumed each device would join the AP nearest to it, but it looks like all Sonos device want to join the same wifi channel, which puts a couple of them pretty far from their AP. I verified this by checking: http://X.X.X.X:1400/status/proc/ath_rincon/status for each of the devices. In my case this is channel 6. Two of them are sitting very near APs using channels 1, and 11, but they’re staying fixated on the farthest AP, which uses ch6. Is this right?

What I’m looking for is some advice for Sonos co-existing nicely with a multi-AP network that already uses Ch1, 6, 11.

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J

John BAnswer

I believe Sonos uses direct routing between devices where it is preferable to following the paths determined by STP. And I think that requires them to be on the same channel.

That's the design. Pros and cons I guess.

I believe Sonos states that the system is not compatible with enterprise deployments. It is certainly the case that this is not a common deployment in Sonos' target market.

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ratty

Sonos also tries to use direct routing between grouped peers in WiFi mode, for which the nodes would need to share a channel.

Is this “direct routing” at the wifi level or is it a normal layer 2 thing, like broadcast or multicasting on the same subnet?

Well, it’s layer 2 at the WiFi level. The physical channel is intrinsically a broadcast medium. Stations using direct routing between peers target one another directly via their MACs.

Does having wifi station isolation turned on break this?

As it happens, station isolation imposed by a central AP would possibly not block direct p2p traffic, but it’s an academic question since isolation stops Sonos working anyway. Wireless controllers wouldn’t be able to locate the players. This is why Sonos and guest networks don’t mix.

It’s looking like my wifi setup has outgrown the environment Sonos was built for. Unfortunately I value the wifi setup more than I do Sonos these days, it’s been a good 8-9 year run, but habits have changed.

In this day and age I’m surprised you’re so reliant on 2.4GHz, given the capacity and speeds available at 5GHz. Since your usage of 2.4GHz ought to be reducing I wouldn’t have thought it difficult to use just two of the 1/6/11 channels available, leaving one for SonosNet.

Good luck with whatever you choose. Whichever way you turn there’s likely to be compromise.

K

kbyrdAuthor

Contributor III

I’ll combine two different responses in one post. To be clear, my intent wasn’t to bash Sonos. It does what it does very well. Reading these responses, I forgot that it seems Sonos chooses reliability and performance of Sonos gear over flexibility. Given their target market, that’s the right choice, but I forgot that when I tried to get the system to jump on my new-ish wifi network.

I suspect that you could have a perfectly functioning home WiFi and Sonos set up without using all three 2.4GHz channels on WiFi, but you know your system and your aims.

Yes, this is exactly it. When I first bought my Sonos system ~8 years ago, it was exactly what I wanted and did it’s job EXTREMELY well, all the time, in a variety of conditions. It still does. I understand enough about wifi and some of the problems they need to solve to be amazed. What has changed is me and my family. We use the system much much less than we used to and use the other devices on the wifi network much more.

In this day and age I’m surprised you’re so reliant on 2.4GHz, given the capacity and speeds available at 5GHz. Since your usage of 2.4GHz ought to be reducing I wouldn’t have thought it difficult to use just two of the 1/6/11 channels available, leaving one for SonosNet.

Good luck with whatever you choose. Whichever way you turn there’s likely to be compromise.

The lingering dependence on 2.4 comes from mostly “ few older devices (mostly IoT) like light switches and such that I’m not yet willing to upgrade. But, even many new printers still come with 2.4Ghz only. The devices are annoyingly spread out across the house.

Since my initial posting, it looks like various Play:3s have re-associated over the last few days, choosing the AP nearest them, which is one of the thing I originally wanted. I haven’t used the system since then so I don’t know if it works well. I will have a look at getting rid of one 2.4g channel seeing if the 2.4g in near that AP can reach another one.

Thanks all for the explanations!

ratty

The lingering dependence on 2.4 comes from mostly “ few older devices (mostly IoT) like light switches and such that I’m not yet willing to upgrade. But, even many new printers still come with 2.4Ghz only. The devices are annoyingly spread out across the house.

None of these sound like bandwidth hogs. A single 2.4GHz channel throughout the house would almost certainly suffice.

Since my initial posting, it looks like various Play:3s have re-associated over the last few days, choosing the AP nearest them, which is one of the thing I originally wanted. I haven’t used the system since then so I don’t know if it works well.

All I can say is: be careful what you wish for. As already remarked, where players associate with APs on different channels they can no longer interconnect directly P2P in a group or bond. Performance can suffer. In fact a frequent diagnosis when users report problems on a meshed WiFi is that players have homed to different APs, on different channels.

Stanley_4

Grand Maestro

Trying for an optimal WiFi setup while also keeping to the restrictions Sonos requires to work just didn’t make sense for me. Far better WiFi setup by just using two of the channels for the APs and giving Sonos the cleanest of the three channels for SonosNet.

I wired multiple Sonos devices as well, further reducing the load on the SonosNet. System has far fewer issues in Boost mode than Standard mode going from my results.

baardog

Avid Contributor III

I have had all kinds of problems when using SonosNet. Network-storms, dropouts, missing players and so on. Earlier this year I switched to standard mode, and every thing has been rock solid ever since.

My players join the closest AP, as this screen grab shows. No problem for me. Using all the channels 1,6, 11

Smilja

I have had all kinds of problems when using SonosNet. Network-storms, dropouts, missing players and so on. Earlier this year I switched to standard mode, and every thing has been rock solid ever since.

My players join the closest AP, as this screen grab shows. No problem for me. Using all the channels 1,6, 11

Don’t jinx it!

Good luck.

»And the world is like an apple whirling silently in space, Like the circles that you find in the windmills of your mind.« (›Windmills Of Your Mind‹ [1967]. Music by Michel Legrand ; English lyrics written by Alan & Marilyn Bergman)

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