Either I'm misunderstanding or this scheme is just encouraging people to throw away perfectly good Sonos equipment.
The way I read it, you "trade up" by selecting an eligible device and it then gets deactivated by Sonos for you to bin.
This is surely ethically wrong?
Looks like lots of very unhappy customers . Sonos you really need to relook at this ? If your speakers are as good as you say … then they should be just as good without software … or am I missing something on how speakers actually work !!! Very annoyed .
Which is not easy to do, because if you accidentally update your App on your mobile device, it will immediately demand you update your speakers and do nothing else until you do. This is the annoying aspect of Sonos, which almost no other update system employs. I’d happily just not update, but Sonos makes it unnecessarily difficult to not update.
If they made it easy, they would be acting in a proactive way, and they’d have to support it. Unfortunately, that is not technically (in the case of iOS) or financially possible. On top of that, by the very definition, Sonos users locked at one release are eventually going to have a useless system (except possibly local libraries) and are very unlikely to ever purchase again.
-ios could roll back through iTunes. Sonos supports different things on different controls, this could be another just another in the long list of differences. so to say they can't is narrow sighted and inward thinking. As a fan, you should look outside your box
- financially possible? You aren't identified as an employee, so you know jack
- Useless system? Talk about tribal hyperbole. It's called choice. I see lots of posts of owners happily locked down and lots of posts of angry owners who now need to buy new control hardware because of an incremental update.
Hope that isn't too antagonistic and doesn't hurt anyone.
Just chiming in here again to throw back to my posts on the first page.
I posted about my opinion regarding the trade up program from a sustainability perspective, saying that I personally disagree with bricking a perfectly functional device. I've seen some good arguments for trade up since, still not convinced, but I acknowledge that everyone should do as they see fit.
Seeing how this thread has unfolded, I feel compelled to state, for clarification, that although I'm skeptical about Trade Up for other reasons, I don't subscribe to the conspiracy theories about forced obsolescence. Neither do I feel inclined to compare Sonos to a toaster or some other unrelated product to make a convoluted point about longevity. I think I most agree with Bruce's statement that Sonos is most like a smartphone or a personal computer. Like it or not, eventually these products will lose support or will no longer be able to keep up with the ecosystem, and Sonos should be commended for how long they've managed not to obsolete any Player. If and when that happens to some of my Sonos units, I may consider Trade Up, but until then I see no need to recycle my Gen1 Play 5s.
By the way, you must have a Bonehead for Public Relations to send out an email like that.
+22
grazey I’m missing what Sonos is forcing you to do?
Everything I have seen on the Trade-Up program is optional and voluntary. What am I missing?
Sonos is t forcing me - yet, but it is coming. They are a company I no longer trust. You completely evaded the points I actually did make such as the aim of controlling the market, turning customers into cash cows, the fact that its not ethical to brick tech that works.
I didn’t evade. I ignored your opinions - not points, as points have facts behind them, opinions have feelings.
I still haven’t received the email from Sonos. I never got the offer email when the CR100 was dumped either. I think this is because I had to change the email address that my system was linked to and their system cannot cope with this. I have to find these things out from the internet rather than from Sonos.
If I log into my Sonos account and view my details it does tell me that I have 4 items that will be ‘trashed’ soon.
The so called “Connect Amp” has two different models, one of which is obsolete under this program, one is not. At the time when the hardware got rev’d there was a mix of the two Connect Amps in the marketplace, a person could have purchased one of each and inadvertently ended up with an end of life product. I’d call that false advertising, or some sort of violation of consumer laws.
I have that exact problem. Multiple amps and connects that were purchased and deployed amongst young units and old units. Several key areas that I used are now going to potentially drag down other current systems.
i also question if this will be a rolling “10 year old” product issue… so next year the 2012 units fall off and on and on.
It would be helpful to get some insight as to the scope of the problem created by stopping future updates. Lack of access to new streaming services or smart home inter connectivity I can leave with. Unit log offs and content interruptions would be a deal breaker. As referenced in other threads, Sonos taking the carrot approach over the stick would feel better to those of us who have gone all in on years and years of products.
grazey I’m missing what Sonos is forcing you to do?
Everything I have seen on the Trade-Up program is optional and voluntary. What am I missing?
Sonos is t forcing me - yet, but it is coming. They are a company I no longer trust. You completely evaded the points I actually did make such as the aim of controlling the market, turning customers into cash cows, the fact that its not ethical to brick tech that works.
I didn’t evade. I ignored your opinions - not points, as points have facts behind them, opinions have feelings.
no you ignored my feelings based on facts. Sonos seeking to control the market is a fact backed up by experience. Sonos killing me using my iphone is a fact, not an opinion. Perhaps you are not capable of producing a coherent argument?
Sonos Shareholder meeting;
| Time and Date: | February 27, 2020 at 10:00 a.m. Pacific Time | ||
| Place: | 614 Chapala Street, Santa Barbara, CA 93101 | ||
I notice that Engadget are trying to make a fuss about this scheme and even the BBC News app is too.
I think this is a decent scheme for those who want to take it up, similar to the car scrappage scheme that is sometimes run here in the UK.
I for one will not be using the trade up, for 2 reasons
1. They is no trade up for the play:3 I own
2. I only bought a connect:amp a year ago, so might be old in sonos mind set, its still new for me and the 30% off isn't worth my time upgrading.
I agree with most comments and that sonos are doing nothing to help their reputation in waste management and helping our environment. Bricking device because they are not the latest, or don't have features like airplay (that I personally wouldn't use) seem irresponsible. Selling them on to others at a lower price will introduce people to sonos products that might not be able to afford the newest version, or scared of spending to much trying the world of wireless speakers. They'll probably buy an echo and use that, ;-)
+22
Download the app version you want and keep it stored away. If you accidentally update your phone’s copy uninstall and reload the old version?
….
I don’t really care that my zp80’s and zp100 are old - I’m getting old too lol. They do what I want and I don’t care that they run on Wireless G - big deal - wireless G can cope with streaming audio - that’s why the products worked in the first place. They work just as well the non microphone versions of recent Sonos Products for my purposes and work with far better speakers than the recent Sonos products to boot.
I don’t care about the upgrade offer either because to me most of the products are a downgrade for my purposes or only offer the same functionality in terms of my usage.
There is absolutely no reason by the ZP80’s and ZP100’s should be not supported because they are no different to the new Ikea speakers with no microphones or the Sonos One version that is new with no microphones.
I would therefore be annoyed if my audio equipment was forcibly deactivated and I don’t give a toss about fanboys here who don’t care because they have recently bought the latest and greatest. I’m not in the habit of charitable donations to companies that can’t manage their business models into the future. I didn’t sign up for a perpetual income stream back to Sonos (although I did recently buy a Sonos Beam for my TV because I thought the company was decent since I found my older products reliable). I bought supposedly simple media streamers and a media streamer amplifier that is effectively part of my house ie. inbuilt ceiling speakers. Not my fault they took away the CR100 interface and then have to support an app to control them.
Besides they are no different to their other modern products in terms of function anyway other than the wireless G network protocol which is no skin off their teeth. I mention that functionally they are not much different to some of their other products because from a programming perspective their user interface functionality through the app would work the same way and from a coding perspective it’s not much different.
All I can say is I’m loyal to Sonos for the moment and did recently buy a new product as mentioned - but I deactivating would make me instantly disloyal and they wouldn’t be getting any more of my cash in the future no matter what - hypothetically speaking. My ZP100 is an expensive bit of kit especially for the modern equivalent and is a perfectly good amplifier as well.
Also as far as supporting their app goes you have individuals that write sophisticated apps that aren’t companies including ones for Sonos would you believe - so I don’t buy the lack of resources constraint I’ve heard touted here on their part. If a single developer can do it - so can Sonos.
I don’t really care that my zp80’s and zp100 are old - I’m getting old too lol. They do what I want and I don’t care that they run on Wireless G - big deal - wireless G can cope with streaming audio - that’s why the products worked in the first place. They work just as well the non microphone versions of recent Sonos Products for my purposes and work with far better speakers than the recent Sonos products to boot.
I don’t care about the upgrade offer either because to me most of the products are a downgrade for my purposes or only offer the same functionality in terms of my usage.
There is absolutely no reason by the ZP80’s and ZP100’s should be not supported because they are no different to the new Ikea speakers with no microphones or the Sonos One version that is new with no microphones.
I would therefore be annoyed if my audio equipment was forcibly deactivated and I don’t give a toss about fanboys here who don’t care because they have recently bought the latest and greatest. I’m not in the habit of charitable donations to companies that can’t manage their business models into the future. I didn’t sign up for a perpetual income stream back to Sonos (although I did recently buy a Sonos Beam for my TV because I thought the company was decent since I found my older products reliable). I bought supposedly simple media streamers and a media streamer amplifier that is effectively part of my house ie. inbuilt ceiling speakers. Not my fault they took away the CR100 interface and then have to support an app to control them.
Besides they are no different to their other modern products in terms of function anyway other than the wireless G network protocol which is no skin off their teeth. I mention that functionally they are not much different to some of their other products because from a programming perspective their user interface functionality through the app would work the same way and from a coding perspective it’s not much different.
All I can say is I’m loyal to Sonos for the moment and did recently buy a new product as mentioned - but I deactivating would make me instantly disloyal and they wouldn’t be getting any more of my cash in the future no matter what - hypothetically speaking. My ZP100 is an expensive bit of kit especially for the modern equivalent and is a perfectly good amplifier as well.
Also as far as supporting their app goes you have individuals that write sophisticated apps that aren’t companies including ones for Sonos would you believe - so I don’t buy the lack of resources constraint I’ve heard touted here on their part. If a single developer can do it - so can Sonos.
I wrote this a month ago - I must be psychic huh… I’m one of the smartest people ever it seems.
Lots of talk about everything from the moon landings being fake to the Earth being flat.
Sonos has an excellent reputation for keeping future plans quiet which leads to trolls trying to get responses by posting all kinds of stuff.
You will save yourself a lot of grief if you filter out all the predictions based on nothing but bile and speculation.
Only reliable sources on future plans I’ve found are the Sonos staff and posts linking to FCC filings.
Well personally I don’t think I’m trolling by saying I’d be annoyed if a company bricked the audio equipment that I own that is working perfectly well and trying to find out what is going on. I invested a fair sum in it whether or not it was in the past.
To me it’s fairly unprecedented that a piece of equipment that is connected to my stereo and my in ceiling speakers in the bedroom just suddenly potentially gets “taken” from me unless I buy a modern version that does exactly the same thing. Even Apple’s multipurpose iPhones don’t get deactivated. They continue to run on the old software. With an audio component they are even simpler and only perform a predefined role so even harder to justify. So it’s fair enough in my opinion to ask whether they are planning to brick them if we don’t upgrade at some point. Knowledge is power.
Not supporting the CR100 is different because a viable alternative was provided via smartphones and desktop applications which 99.9% of people had access to therefore no loss was really suffered.
Also people’s circumstances change. When I bought them I had a much higher income. Now I’m retired spending that sort of money on replacements is not trivial. Like I said, I did not subscribe to a perpetual gravy train business model when I purchased them. I owe them nothing. They owe me a working product for the life of the hardware imo. The only constraint is software and as I said a one man development team has created a third party UI for it - so they can manage it no problem at all with their resources. Also that software constraint is a problem of their own making, it’s their design, it should not become my problem that they didn’t potentially think about the whole of life support costs. They should be supported until I decide they are no longer useful and decommission them myself.
And yes some of this is pre-emptive. If you don’t speak up you get walked over.
I also wrote this.
Not sure what you are trying to say here. Sonos isn’t forcing anyone to take this offer under thread of deactivating their devices. Accepting the offer is a choice. Choosing this will have you agree to having Sonos deactivate your old device.
I understand that but isn’t there talk of them basically turning off support for them via the Sonos Controller app and the upgrade offer is basically a sweetener before that happens? My point was basically that short of wireless G protocol ceasing to exist, I can’t see why they can’t be supported given their hardware functionally is basically the same as the new incarnations. The front end has to deal with the same logic flows virtually as a Sonos Connect.
I guess I’m fishing for what is going on and what’s behind all this… I do know that as long as they work I’m happy with them the way they are,
I also wrote this.
Don’t pat yourself on the back, I predicted the exact same thing in that thread, and I’m the biggest Sonos fan there is. Doesn’t take a genius to understand that eventually, older hardware can’t keep up with changing software. That’s been reality since Turing punched a ticker tape. 
When trading up from a connect to an Arc i clicked on Boost by mistake and my credit has been applied to the boost. Is there a way of changing credit to an Arc purchase please?
I also wrote this.
Don’t pat yourself on the back, I predicted the exact same thing in that thread, and I’m the biggest Sonos fan there is. Doesn’t take a genius to understand that eventually, older hardware can’t keep up with changing software. That’s been reality since Turing punched a ticker tape.
That’s BS though because it only needs to play an audio stream and the old stuff was designed to do that easily ie. it can easily handle the bitrate. I was awake up to the slimeballs.
That’s BS though because it only needs to play an audio stream and the old stuff was designed to that.
No, it needs to access the source, it needs to authenticate, it needs to decode the codec, it needs to be the master for any other devices that are grouped, it needs to incorporate timing queues into the stream, it needs to process track information, it needs to store the queue, track index, favorites, account info, diagnostic info, any service required DRM scheme, etc., it needs to communicate with the controller, it needs to communicate with Amazon Web Services, it need to manage the Sonosnet mesh, it needs to navigate STP . . .
Need more?
I don’t use a music service - I use a NAS (my own collection) and internet radio.
It can handle it - no problem.
Why would I want to upgrade so I can pay another subscription service for something I don’t want.
And all of those things it had to do back when I bought it - except for Amazon which I don’t give a flying about.
They see a headline, read a bit of it, see comments from others and then join in the ‘fury and disgust’ without actually reading the article and so not understanding what is actually going on in the real World!
A good commentary on the general state of our social media driven world today.
I don’t use a music service - I use a NAS and internet radio.
It can handle it - no problem.
Why would I want to upgrade so I can pay another subscription service for something I don’t want.
And all of those things it had to do back when I bought it - except for Amazon which I don’t give a flying about.
Well, how generous of you to feel your anecdotal account of personal usage speaks on behalf of millions of other customers!
Either I'm misunderstanding or this scheme is just encouraging people to throw away perfectly good Sonos equipment.
The way I read it, you "trade up" by selecting an eligible device and it then gets deactivated by Sonos for you to bin.
This is surely ethically wrong?
No one is fooled by Sonos and their trade up program I hope. It’s simply “hey look at our stuff and buy it cause the older expensive stuff we sold you is not making us any money anymore.”
I love my Sonos system but I think this program Is a bunch of crap. If the ports were $200 each then maybe I wouldn’t feel like I’m getting screwed but they’re not. I have two connects that I have to trade up if I want the new updates so even with credit it’s gonna be over $600. $600 to get the same service yet slightly worse than what I had before? Bunch of crap you ask me. I did trade one of my connects up already and am saving up enough money to do the second one but I’m not happy about it at all. Don’t release an upgrade able product and then years later after someone has invested a large amount of money say were not gonna do that anymore. And good lord lower the prices on your items. I can buy a top of the line Yamaha receiver for around $500 but I can only buy one Play 5 for that. Not consumer friendly but I gotta say I still love the products. Just wish I could afford more of them.
Mate Sonos can write middleware for the streams and do it in the cloud.
I really don’t know why you are complaining, if all you do is stream from an NAS and TuneIn, you can stay at a legacy version, not receive updates and your Sonos will play on until the hardware breaks. Sonos has given you exactly what you wish for.
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