Either I'm misunderstanding or this scheme is just encouraging people to throw away perfectly good Sonos equipment.
The way I read it, you "trade up" by selecting an eligible device and it then gets deactivated by Sonos for you to bin.
This is surely ethically wrong?
You do know “encouraging” is not a gun to the head, right? Of all the policies to complain about, you pick one that encourages recycling? First world problems indeed. 
You see it as encouraging recycling and I see it as encouraging waste. So I guess we'll agree to disagree.
Sadly though it's not a first world problem. Just a world problem.
I don’t seen how the Sonos tradeup program is a problem for the world. Are you saying the volume of Sonos speakers that are recycled instead of used is going to have a significant impact on the environment? Or maybe suggesting that the program is going to encourage people to recycle instead of reuse in general...and that’s going to damage the environment in a noticeable way?
+26
The insert shows products that are eligible for the 30% discount coupon through BestBuy. I find it odd that the Play 3 and Play 1 (especially the Play 1) are missing from the BB list of eligible products.
Question (I realize you may not be able to comment on anything):
Hey AjTrek1, the same units are eligible through us as through all of the other retailers who are participating in the Sonos Trade Up offer. I can’t speak specifically to why certain devices were picked for the program, though the determination was made to start with the Play:5 gen1, Connect, and Connect:Amp. For ease, the ZP80 and ZP100 are included in the Connect and Connect:Amp product family. These are all devices that were originally designed around or longer than 10 years ago.
True, “fair” is a relative term which is why there is such backlash. Some users may want new equipment, but answering your own hypothetical remains hypothetical. I’ve yet to see any company make public apology made for treating people fairly. Clearly, Sonos knows of the unfairness or there would be no need to apologize or offer a discount. They also knew of the impending issue while still producing and selling the soon to be outdated equipment, now that doesn’t seem fair or does it?
Leasing equipment? Do you mean like the cable companies do with modems? No thanks.
Just my observations. BTW anyone with 16,834 replies is far too biased.
You have some of your information off here. First Sonos offered the trade up discount long before they announced any change in support for legacy items. I’m not sure you could really call it an apology at that point, as it certainly looked as if Sonos was trying to reduce the volume of legacy products out there. Second, Sonos is not producing and selling soon to be outdated equipment. None of the legacy items that are to be part of the S1 system were produced less than 5 years ago, most much longer than that. And Sonos has stated that every product will be supportted for a minimum of 5 years after they stop selling it.
Lastly, I don’t think it makes much sense to say someone’s statement should be thrown out because of too many or too little post count. Why not take a statement for what it’s worth regardless of where it came from?
You do know “encouraging” is not a gun to the head, right? Of all the policies to complain about, you pick one that encourages recycling? First world problems indeed.
You see it as encouraging recycling and I see it as encouraging waste. So I guess we'll agree to disagree.
Sadly though it's not a first world problem. Just a world problem.
I don’t seen how the Sonos tradeup program is a problem for the world. Are you saying the volume of Sonos speakers that are recycled instead of used is going to have a significant impact on the environment? Or maybe suggesting that the program is going to encourage people to recycle instead of reuse in general...and that’s going to damage the environment in a noticeable way?
Yes, recycling (although no surety that they will even at best, be recycled) instead of using a Sonos product is obviously worse for the environment. We don't know the numbers but just imagine several thousand, possibly tens or hundreds of thousand of units now just being binned or recycled for no good reason.
Nothing like that will be noticeable to you or I but it's just another thing to add to the list of things that is ruining the planet.
Surely we can at least agree that it's not a good thing?
In your opinion what would be “fair”?
I’d absolutely support such environmental arguments, so long as they come from folks who haven’t taken a flight for at least 10 years.
I’d absolutely support such environmental arguments, so long as they come from folks who haven’t taken a flight for at least 10 years.
You can double that and more to 23 years. Thanks for supporting me.
Good for you. I was setting the bar low at 10 years.
I should have added ocean cruises too.
I’m glad I read some of these posts before I “blindly” upgraded! Sonos what the hell are you up to? I was an extremely early adopter of Sonos, way back when Apple was trying to get people to use Air Tunes, remember that piece of crap? I’ve actually been responsible for turning a lot of people on to Sonos.
So, if I get this correct, Sonos gives me 30% off the over-priced newer speakers who’s only improvement is that it works with AirPlay 2, but my old Speaker becomes useless! WTF? There’s nothing wrong with my current Play 5, it sounds great. This is really leaving a sour taste in my mouth, and maybe I replace everything with Apple.
Sincerely, an old and now unhappy customer,
Frank Castro
The insert shows products that are eligible for the 30% discount coupon through BestBuy. I find it odd that the Play 3 and Play 1 (especially the Play 1) are missing from the BB list of eligible products.
Question (I realize you may not be able to comment on anything):
Hey AjTrek1, the same units are eligible through us as through all of the other retailers who are participating in the Sonos Trade Up offer. I can’t speak specifically to why certain devices were picked for the program, though the determination was made to start with the Play:5 gen1, Connect, and Connect:Amp. For ease, the ZP80 and ZP100 are included in the Connect and Connect:Amp product family. These are all devices that were originally designed around or longer than 10 years ago.
Hey Ryan...Thanks for the reply!
But then again, I don’t think that those who do so are in any way “wrong” to do it. It’s a choice, that each of us have to make.
Sorry - this quoting is atrocious, now…
Couldn’t agree more
Unfortunately, I’ve never found a tech company that works to exactly what I want. I have to figure out what the best use is of what’s available out there on the market, and make it work for what I need it to.
Spot on…
I originally thought that Sonos would be a good long term solution but it turned out not to be, for my purposes, as their system evolved. I still like the speakers, so intend to get full use out of them - in the best way that I can.
But then again, I don’t think that those who do so are in any way “wrong” to do it. It’s a choice, that each of us have to make.
Sorry - this quoting is atrocious, now…
Couldn’t agree more
Unfortunately, I’ve never found a tech company that works to exactly what I want. I have to figure out what the best use is of what’s available out there on the market, and make it work for what I need it to.
Spot on…
I originally thought that Sonos would be a good long term solution but it turned out not to be, for my purposes, as their system evolved. I still like the speakers, so intend to get full use out of them - in the best way that I can.
As owner/operators of the SONOS system we can DEMAND how stuff works or as you state “abandon” it. Not sure you are wrong with your assessment. This idea of making my money worthless... I am not keen on it (e.g. trade up / bricking).
You do know “encouraging” is not a gun to the head, right? Of all the policies to complain about, you pick one that encourages recycling? First world problems indeed.
You see it as encouraging recycling and I see it as encouraging waste. So I guess we'll agree to disagree.
Sadly though it's not a first world problem. Just a world problem.
I don’t seen how the Sonos tradeup program is a problem for the world. Are you saying the volume of Sonos speakers that are recycled instead of used is going to have a significant impact on the environment? Or maybe suggesting that the program is going to encourage people to recycle instead of reuse in general...and that’s going to damage the environment in a noticeable way?
Yes, recycling (although no surety that they will even at best, be recycled) instead of using a Sonos product is obviously worse for the environment. We don't know the numbers but just imagine several thousand, possibly tens or hundreds of thousand of units now just being binned or recycled for no good reason.
Nothing like that will be noticeable to you or I but it's just another thing to add to the list of things that is ruining the planet.
Surely we can at least agree that it's not a good thing?
Nope, I can’t agree. I understand that reuse is better than recycle is better than throw away. I’m not debating that. I disagree that a program where a person has to recycle instead of reuse is a world altering problem. I disagree with the premise that people were going to chose to continue to use/reuse a product till it dies or sell it if this program didn’t exist. And I don’t doubt that many people currently just throw away electronics instead of recycle. In that regard, the program is going to bring some awareness that electronics can be recycled and provide incentive to do that with other products that no longer use and don’t want to sell.
No, this doesn’t bother me at all. I plan on using the program with one, maybe two, perfectly functioning units, and I don’t feel the least bit guilty about it. In fact, I will likely recycle several other devices I’ve got laying around as well, all in good working order.
Ok, so we can agree to disagree on most of that but I find your last point a bit odd in that you'd recycle something that's in perfectly good working order rather than pass it on to someone to use. Why would you do that?
Is it too much to ask that SONOS honor that same ethic?
I agree, but all those who have been involved in making new and old devices continue to work together know that there’s a cost to the company to achieve this - and apparently it’s not one that Sonos are prepared to absorb. Personally, I would have more sympathy with them if they made it easier for people to run whichever versions of the software they choose, but that hasn’t happened, either.
I have a Hobart made Kitchen Aid Mixer from the 70’s that is still bullet proof.
It’s all about the software - your mixer doesn’t have any…. 
Trade up timing isn’t at issue, nor relevant it was the original announcement that Sonos would no longer support legacy systems (originally in May) and then the damage control that followed 1. Apology, 2. Clarification 3. S1 and S2.
I said they knew (past tense) about the impending incompatibility issues, and they did, as confirmed by their VP of Software in an interview with Wired in March. The article also clarifies the chronology of events.
Here you go, WIRED
Again, just my observations and 5000 replies is a lot too;)
Have a great day and stay healthy.
In your opinion what would be “fair”?
First, I’ve been a Sonos fan for a long time. I worked through the quirky stuff and I still think they make a far superior product than any competitor.
As far as fair, replace legacy products at cost (cost of goods sold). Meaning, no markup, just the cost to build the product, not including operational costs, marketing, advertising, etc. They know the exact cost to build an individual unit of all their products, and they know their margins, etc. Customer pays shipping and handling etc. This way the customer doesn’t get anything for free and Sonos stops anyone from complaining or accusing them of using software upgrades as a way to drive new revenue.
It shuts the whole conversation down and it would probably cost less and relieve a lot of headaches in the long run than supporting two distinct software platforms.
At a minimum, the 30% replacement discount should be applied to any other discount at the time. E.g. Sonos One - Currently $50 off so the price is $149 then take the 30% discount, $104.
Thanks
Ok, so we can agree to disagree on most of that but I find your last point a bit odd in that you'd recycle something that's in perfectly good working order rather than pass it on to someone to use. Why would you do that?
The quoting feature sucks right now, so I’m using italics instead.
Anyway, because I do not know anyone who could want a Connect (otherwise it would be gone already), I don’t like pushing my hand-me-downs on friends, they are old and I don’t know how long they will last. I don’t want to go through the effort of selling it, and obviously because of the financial incentive Sonos is providing, If there was no Sonos program the Connect would remain sitting on a shelf, wasting away. These are pretty obvious reasons I’m sure you’re already aware of, but I’m guessing you think the environmental impact of using a Connect until it no longer functions outweighs all these reasons? Eh, not to me.
Trade up timing isn’t at issue, nor relevant it was the original announcement that Sonos would no longer support legacy systems (originally in May) and then the damage control that followed 1. Apology, 2. Clarification 3. S1 and S2.
I said they knew (past tense) about the impending incompatibility issues, and they did, as confirmed by their VP of Software in an interview with Wired in March. The article also clarifies the chronology of events.
Here you go, WIRED
Again, just my observations and 5000 replies is a lot too;)
Have a great day and stay healthy.
You said that Sonos knew this was unfair, because of apology and the trade in offer. I don’t see how the trade in offer means that Sonos thinks it unfair. I think they know that others will think it’s unfair, and they were aware that many folks won’t like the decision they’ve made. Perhaps that’s close enough, but I also think there actual explanation has merit as well, that they want people to experience modern Sonos (and thus want to buy more speakers) rather than legacy Sonos.
And as far as Spence’s apology, it was not about unfairness, it was per the Wired article “ apologizing for the confusion and clarifying some of the company’s plans around aging speakers.”
For the record, I think Sonos has botched much of this transition, starting from the trade in annoucement. IMO, they should have started with upcoming S2 features, then followed with what happens with S1 and the trade in program, as it is now with no recycle requirement. I didn’t have an issue with the recycle requirement, but better to start without recycling than drop it months later..
Anyway, because I do not know anyone who could want a Connect (otherwise it would be gone already), I don’t like pushing my hand-me-downs on friends, they are old and I don’t know how long they will last. I don’t want to go through the effort of selling it, and obviously because of the financial incentive Sonos is providing, If there was no Sonos program the Connect would remain sitting on a shelf, wasting away.
We can agree the quoting feature has gone pot!
You've given a number of reasons/excuses why the Connect would sit in your shelf wasting away. But the key word you used is effort. It just takes a little bit of it and you could find it a good home I'm sure and keep it in circulation until it does die at which point it can then be recycled.
I'm obviously not going to convince you otherwise but hopefully others will read it and be convinced, who knows? Just trying to do my bit.
Cheers
In your opinion what would be “fair”?
First, I’ve been a Sonos fan for a long time. I worked through the quirky stuff and I still think they make a far superior product than any competitor.
As far as fair, replace legacy products at cost (cost of goods sold). Meaning, no markup, just the cost to build the product, not including operational costs, marketing, advertising, etc. They know the exact cost to build an individual unit of all their products, and they know their margins, etc. Customer pays shipping and handling etc. This way the customer doesn’t get anything for free and Sonos stops anyone from complaining or accusing them of using software upgrades as a way to drive new revenue.
A couple problems with this. First, I don’t think Sonos wants to make their margins public. Besides competitive reasons, I’m sure many customers would be upset and decide that Sonos is charging too much at regular prices, etc. The second is that many customers don’t feel like they should pay anything at all, since their speaker is working right now at zero additional cost to them. This will not make everyone happy.
It shuts the whole conversation down and it would probably cost less and relieve a lot of headaches in the long run than supporting two distinct software platforms.
I don’t see how it would avoid supporting two systems. As I stated before, many feel that Sonos should not ask them to pay a penny to keep the system they already have going. Yes, you may feel this is fair and it would move you off S1, but many would not.
As an aside, I’ve thought about a Sonos prorated offer. Say a 10 year life of a device, so if you own 10 or more years, you get nothing or a minimum offer. If you’ve owned 5 years, then 50% discount. However, it penalizes longer term customers. It also would not make sense to limit the trade in to direct replacement products, rather than any speaker or speaker set in the store (where you can actually get a dollar value greater than original product price).
At a minimum, the 30% replacement discount should be applied to any other discount at the time. E.g. Sonos One - Currently $50 off so the price is $149 then take the 30% discount, $104.
Thanks
That could very well be a loss for Sonos. I’ve recommend others to just use the sale price now and save the 30% off for a future big ticket item.
I am confused! I’m in UK and have just been sent the Trade Up offer. When I go on to the web page I can see the items they suggest could be replaced but they do not say what with. I have to click the box and agree before I can see what the new item will be and how much it cost be and indeed what the benefit is.
I have old Connect Amps and Connect boxes - anyone know what I am supposed to replace them with and how much they cost (and why I should or shouldn't do it?!)
There’s absolutely no requirement for you to upgrade if you choose to continue to use your older generation speakers. However, it appears that if that’s the case, there’s no need to give you a discount on new equipment, either.
Before you go to commit to the Trade Up there’s a link for the terms & conditions. I suggest you read them. Basically for each product you recycle Sonos is offering a discount on any other Sonos product. Once the credit is applied, your view of the prices in the Sonos web store would change accordingly. There’s no “you should replace X with Y”.
In any event if your products are working fine you may perfectly well choose to continue with them.
I agree bricking otherwise usable devices is poor environmentally, though for anyone thinking of replacing a device anyhow this trade up does seem attractive.
I am concerned this is pointing to future lack of support for older devices. Hopefully I’m wrong (especially as the Connect was still for sale until recently), the longevity of Sonos products to date and the improvements Sonos has made along the way has been a big plus.
I’ve actually been a bit put off at the move to more frequent hardware iterations, for example I’m unsure about getting a Move in case there is a v2 on the horizon.
Yes sure, there is no need to upgrade for now. But before the annoucement I was a happy Sonos customer and now I’m not. I used to recommend Sonos speakers and I won’t do it again… there is a slight difference now.
As you say, it’s just my problem and a problem of Sonos customers ... but, in the mean time you can be sure also that it will be also a problem of Sonos.
Why should Sonos do a good offer to keep the customers happy? Don’t worry, just wait and see what happends.
Regards,
Manuel Martínez
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