Either I'm misunderstanding or this scheme is just encouraging people to throw away perfectly good Sonos equipment.
The way I read it, you "trade up" by selecting an eligible device and it then gets deactivated by Sonos for you to bin.
This is surely ethically wrong?
No thank you. You misunderstood my point. Perhaps you can read my post again.
+2
What’s going to happen is we’ll see these ‘bricked’ units being sold through 3rd-party channels, like Ebay etc… The market will be flooded with ‘as-is, for parts or repair’ units that have nothing physically wrong with them, but cannot be used. Unsuspecting buyers (who may have had previous experience buying such units and getting them to work) will be flooding Sonos tech support only to find out their serial number has been permanently blacklisted. Used Sonos has an unusually high resale value (which points to how much people really enjoy these products!) Tanking that market will not necessarily result in more sales of new units for them, IMO...
case in point: https://www.ebay.com/itm/-/324002474324
At least this seller KNOWS and DISCLOSES that this unit has been bricked by Sonos as part of the trade-up program. I predict we’ll see many more people ‘recycling’ in this fashion and it’s not going to be pretty...
This program is ridiculous. I'm not going to get rid of my perfectly good two Play 5 first gens to get Airplay 2. Lol I hope the next step will be not supporting older devices at all and being deactivated by the company. I spent over a $1500 for all my speakers and gave out eight Sonos speakers to all my family members two years ago for the holidays. I am huge fan of Sonos but this promotion is just a money grab to get people to upgrade to the newer models while taking a perfectly fine model off the market. Imagine if you went to a Honda dealership and bought another Honda and they said we will give you a $500 off for the being a loyal customer but you have to total your old car. What the hell?
+22
Since they paid me more in the discount than I paid for my ZP-80s when I first bought them new I’m sure not feeling ripped off. I see it as I got 13 years of free use and a small cash gift for upgrading.
The upgrade is an offer, if you don’t like it ignore it.
I for one will not be using the trade up, for 2 reasons
1. They is no trade up for the play:3 I own
2. I only bought a connect:amp a year ago, so might be old in sonos mind set, its still new for me and the 30% off isn't worth my time upgrading.
I agree with most comments and that sonos are doing nothing to help their reputation in waste management and helping our environment. Bricking device because they are not the latest, or don't have features like airplay (that I personally wouldn't use) seem irresponsible. Selling them on to others at a lower price will introduce people to sonos products that might not be able to afford the newest version, or scared of spending to much trying the world of wireless speakers. They'll probably buy an echo and use that, ;-)
I don’t really care that my zp80’s and zp100 are old - I’m getting old too lol. They do what I want and I don’t care that they run on Wireless G - big deal - wireless G can cope with streaming audio - that’s why the products worked in the first place. They work just as well the non microphone versions of recent Sonos Products for my purposes and work with far better speakers than the recent Sonos products to boot.
I don’t care about the upgrade offer either because to me most of the products are a downgrade for my purposes or only offer the same functionality in terms of my usage.
There is absolutely no reason by the ZP80’s and ZP100’s should be not supported because they are no different to the new Ikea speakers with no microphones or the Sonos One version that is new with no microphones.
I would therefore be annoyed if my audio equipment was forcibly deactivated and I don’t give a toss about fanboys here who don’t care because they have recently bought the latest and greatest. I’m not in the habit of charitable donations to companies that can’t manage their business models into the future. I didn’t sign up for a perpetual income stream back to Sonos (although I did recently buy a Sonos Beam for my TV because I thought the company was decent since I found my older products reliable). I bought supposedly simple media streamers and a media streamer amplifier that is effectively part of my house ie. inbuilt ceiling speakers. Not my fault they took away the CR100 interface and then have to support an app to control them.
Besides they are no different to their other modern products in terms of function anyway other than the wireless G network protocol which is no skin off their teeth. I mention that functionally they are not much different to some of their other products because from a programming perspective their user interface functionality through the app would work the same way and from a coding perspective it’s not much different.
All I can say is I’m loyal to Sonos for the moment and did recently buy a new product as mentioned - but I deactivating would make me instantly disloyal and they wouldn’t be getting any more of my cash in the future no matter what - hypothetically speaking. My ZP100 is an expensive bit of kit especially for the modern equivalent and is a perfectly good amplifier as well.
Also as far as supporting their app goes you have individuals that write sophisticated apps that aren’t companies including ones for Sonos would you believe - so I don’t buy the lack of resources constraint I’ve heard touted here on their part. If a single developer can do it - so can Sonos.
+17
Not sure what you are trying to say here. Sonos isn’t forcing anyone to take this offer under thread of deactivating their devices. Accepting the offer is a choice. Choosing this will have you agree to having Sonos deactivate your old device.
Not sure what you are trying to say here. Sonos isn’t forcing anyone to take this offer under thread of deactivating their devices. Accepting the offer is a choice. Choosing this will have you agree to having Sonos deactivate your old device.
I understand that but isn’t there talk of them basically turning off support for them via the Sonos Controller app and the upgrade offer is basically a sweetener before that happens? My point was basically that short of wireless G protocol ceasing to exist, I can’t see why they can’t be supported given their hardware functionally is basically the same as the new incarnations. The front end has to deal with the same logic flows virtually as a Sonos Connect.
I guess I’m fishing for what is going on and what’s behind all this… I do know that as long as they work I’m happy with them the way they are,
+22
Lots of talk about everything from the moon landings being fake to the Earth being flat.
Sonos has an excellent reputation for keeping future plans quiet which leads to trolls trying to get responses by posting all kinds of stuff.
You will save yourself a lot of grief if you filter out all the predictions based on nothing but bile and speculation.
Only reliable sources on future plans I’ve found are the Sonos staff and posts linking to FCC filings.
Lots of talk about everything from the moon landings being fake to the Earth being flat.
Sonos has an excellent reputation for keeping future plans quiet which leads to trolls trying to get responses by posting all kinds of stuff.
You will save yourself a lot of grief if you filter out all the predictions based on nothing but bile and speculation.
Only reliable sources on future plans I’ve found are the Sonos staff and posts linking to FCC filings.
Well personally I don’t think I’m trolling by saying I’d be annoyed if a company bricked the audio equipment that I own that is working perfectly well and trying to find out what is going on. I invested a fair sum in it whether or not it was in the past.
To me it’s fairly unprecedented that a piece of equipment that is connected to my stereo and my in ceiling speakers in the bedroom just suddenly potentially gets “taken” from me unless I buy a modern version that does exactly the same thing. Even Apple’s multipurpose iPhones don’t get deactivated. They continue to run on the old software. With an audio component they are even simpler and only perform a predefined role so even harder to justify. So it’s fair enough in my opinion to ask whether they are planning to brick them if we don’t upgrade at some point. Knowledge is power.
Not supporting the CR100 is different because a viable alternative was provided via smartphones and desktop applications which 99.9% of people had access to therefore no loss was really suffered.
Also people’s circumstances change. When I bought them I had a much higher income. Now I’m retired spending that sort of money on replacements is not trivial. Like I said, I did not subscribe to a perpetual gravy train business model when I purchased them. I owe them nothing. They owe me a working product for the life of the hardware imo. The only constraint is software and as I said a one man development team has created a third party UI for it - so they can manage it no problem at all with their resources. Also that software constraint is a problem of their own making, it’s their design, it should not become my problem that they didn’t potentially think about the whole of life support costs. They should be supported until I decide they are no longer useful and decommission them myself.
And yes some of this is pre-emptive. If you don’t speak up you get walked over.
I notice that Engadget are trying to make a fuss about this scheme and even the BBC News app is too.
I think this is a decent scheme for those who want to take it up, similar to the car scrappage scheme that is sometimes run here in the UK.
It’s good for some, not good for others, which is fine. There’s no requirement I’m aware of for a company to satisfy only one person’s desires. I’d probably feel much differently if it was a required upgrade, i.e. your hardware is going to stop working, but we’ll give you a 30% discount to replace gear that’s not going to work next week.
I can understand what Sonos is trying to do. I’m pleased that they’re at least getting a commitment from the trade in process to recycle the old equipment, rather than just giving the discount and forcing people to throw the items away. I’m also pleased that there’s no requirement to upgrade existing equipment, it’s purely an option for those who want to avail themselves.
Everyone has the option of doing it if they so desire, and not doing it if they don’t. I’ve seen several posts from people who have gotten more than the 30% by reselling their equipment without trading it in for the discount, good for them. Passing on the equipment is great. Recycling the equipment is good, too. Simply tossing it in the trash is bad.
+15
This controversy has blown up in other places as well - Business Insider has a story.
Also in that story is this gem, which no doubt will be poo-pooed by the sycophants here
"The reality is that these older products lack the processing power and memory to support modern Sonos experiences," it told The Verge. "Over time, technology will progress in ways these products are not able to accommodate."
If you own something on the trade up list, be prepared for a forced brick this year.
Flame away, disingenuous die-hards.
This controversy has blown up in other places as well - Business Insider has a story.
Also in that story is this gem, which no doubt will be poo-pooed by the sycophants here
"The reality is that these older products lack the processing power and memory to support modern Sonos experiences," it told The Verge. "Over time, technology will progress in ways these products are not able to accommodate."
If you own something on the trade up list, be prepared for a forced brick this year.
I’m not convinced that it will be that quick, but the answer is to take control of your system and lock it off… It’s yours - you paid for it - it runs on your network. If you must have streaming access then they’ll find a way of messing you up eventually (or let’s hope not), but you can hold off updates for some while, I’d have thought...
+15
How do you lock it down when the controller app will force you to update eventually? Get rid of my phone?
+22
Download the app version you want and keep it stored away. If you accidentally update your phone’s copy uninstall and reload the old version?
How do you lock it down when the controller app will force you to update eventually? Get rid of my phone?
As
There’s a document here :-
http://www.amun.org.uk/Sonos/Sonos%20Lock%20Down%20Procedures.pdf
which a kind contributor here put together to tackle an earlier problem, but the basic principles still hold.
I don’t use the radio or streaming, so block everything off, but as long as you block the update process then you should be OK - unless Sonos change the way that they handle updates, of course ;-)
NB - Sonos do not support this approach, so make sure that your system is working reliably before doing it...
Everyone has the option of doing it if they so desire, and not doing it if they don’t. I’ve seen several posts from people who have gotten more than the 30% by reselling their equipment without trading it in for the discount, good for them. Passing on the equipment is great. Recycling the equipment is good, too. Simply tossing it in the trash is bad.
I have posted some comments in another thread, but the above summary seems eminently sensible. And, if it is correct, is why I can't understand the furore over the Sonos offer which is just another option to consider based on the realities of the vintage of one’s kit.
Everyone has the option of doing it if they so desire, and not doing it if they don’t. I’ve seen several posts from people who have gotten more than the 30% by reselling their equipment without trading it in for the discount, good for them. Passing on the equipment is great. Recycling the equipment is good, too. Simply tossing it in the trash is bad.
I have posted some comments in another thread, but the above summary seems eminently sensible. And, if it is correct, is why I can't understand the furore over the Sonos offer which is just another option to consider based on the realities of the vintage of one’s kit.
There’s a couple of reasons in my opinion why a fuss is being created..
They see a headline, read a bit of it, see comments from others and then join in the ‘fury and disgust’ without actually reading the article and so not understanding what is actually going on in the real World!
A good commentary on the general state of our social media driven world today.
Let’s be honest here. Sonos just wants to kill the second hand market. The 30% discount is so that when you upgrade, someone else also buys new instead of your second hand. Sonos wants to shorten the replacement cycle and kill the second hand market. It’s about $$$.
I read someone saying that 5ghz support was important. Are you kidding me? 5ghz is only short range, it doesn’t go through walls and is only useful for very high bandwith applications. Not audio and certainly not the lo-fi audio Sonos transmits.
There is no reason to stimulate the trading in of my connect:amp for example. It works perfectly and really needs no more updates or anything really. What are you going to add? I bought it to power my built-in bathroom speakers and control it wirelessly, that’s what it does and i don’t need other functionality. There is no functional update that Sonos can give the new AMP that will cause me to switch.
From my perspective, they don’t need to further update the Sonos app either.
How about these technological pioneers add DTS support to their home cinema stuff?
Let’s be honest here. Sonos just wants to kill the second hand market. The 30% discount is so that when you upgrade, someone else also buys new instead of your second hand. Sonos wants to shorten the replacement cycle and kill the second hand market. It’s about $$$.
They aren’t trying to kill the entire second hand market since trade up is only available on certain products. If this was their sole goal, then it would make more sense to offer trade up discounts on more products, or perhaps host their own second hand market to profit from. Sonos has said that they want customers to experience more modern Sonos speakers rather than old stuff. I can somewhat see that, but I think a lot of it has to do with reducing support costs for the older units, and allowing for new functionality that the old stuff can’t do.
I read someone saying that 5ghz support was important. Are you kidding me? 5ghz is only short range, it doesn’t go through walls and is only useful for very high bandwith applications. Not audio and certainly not the lo-fi audio Sonos transmits.
Sonos uses 5Ghz for home theatre setups, where short range makes sense and you need to sync the audio with video. The Connect:amp didn’t have 5Ghz, so had to be direct wired if used for rear speakers. The new Amp has 5Ghz, and can perform the task wirelesssly.
There is no reason to stimulate the trading in of my connect:amp for example. It works perfectly and really needs no more updates or anything really. What are you going to add? I bought it to power my built-in bathroom speakers and control it wirelessly, that’s what it does and i don’t need other functionality. There is no functional update that Sonos can give the new AMP that will cause me to switch.
For a bathroom application, this is pretty much true. I use a Connect:amp for my garage speakers and it does the job just fine. I don’t see a need to trade it in right now. However, I used to use the Connect:amp for backyard speakers and it wasn’t adequate. Not enough power. I also wanted to use a TV out there at times, and the Connect:amp could do the audio for that . The Sonos Amp was a great upgrade for that space.
+22
Killing the resale market as a Sonos motive is silly to even propose.
If that was the Sonos goal they could bought a decent sized pile of old Sonos gear off ebay for what they paid me in rebates that only got rid of one device each.
I come from a background of buying separates that allow me to choose how and when I want to upgrade depending on budget and need. Mostly, I wont want to upgrade. My main speakers at home are 20 years old. I dknt need to change them and have no fear that B&W might try to brick them. I probably come from a different era but I dont regard hi fi as the same as buying a mobile phone and no I don't want to change every few years. I hadnt realised Sonos viewed me as a cash cow and that they would change the terms if I didnt produce enough milk to try to force me to.
+22
grazey I’m missing what Sonos is forcing you to do?
Everything I have seen on the Trade-Up program is optional and voluntary. What am I missing?
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