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Anyone else experiencing severe APP LAG & slow loading/refresh with S2?

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K
Userlevel 6
Badge +3

Thanks Bruce,

Really this question is directed AT THE SONOS COMMUNITY - not support as you can probably tell from my postings. 

I’m asking if ANY other Sonos S2 users have experienced the Sonos applications reacting/launching/refreshing slowly compared to other iOS/Android apps and S1.

 

I do agree that it makes it tough when Sonos’ support has their hands tied with communicating broadly to the community. 

 

controlav
Userlevel 7
Badge +23

Device discovery is entirely the same whether it is S1 or S2. Your router is by far the most probable cause, please tell us what kind it is (and whether you are using WiFi [likely] or SonosNet [less likely].

Device discovery is:

SSDP broadcast (3 seconds per UPnP spec)

SSDP multicast (3 seconds concurrent with broadcast)

mDNS search (concurrent)

When a device is found (on the correct Household) then it is scanned for services, and the interesting services are subscribed to. Some UPnP calls are also made to each device.

That is all local network device-to-device calls, and as we have seen too many times, some routers suck at this.

None of this has changed between S1 and S2.

If using a PC or a Mac then there are some human-readable logs generated which might give a clue. On all devices you can always generate a Diagnostic for Sonos support to take a look at.

Author of the leading 3rd party Sonos app for Windows, the only Sonos app for Xbox, and a Sonos app for iOS
controlav
Userlevel 7
Badge +23

That’s absolutely fascinating. And counter to the way I understood the software to work. Thanks for the followup.

The S2 app these days caches the details of all speakers it has seen (so it can show the little spanner/wrench icon when they are “missing”). The app obviously cannot “see” other networks, but it sounds like this caching code is broken somewhere and caused the OPs problem by spending too much time trying to “find” these missing devices. Which makes no actual sense, if they didn’t respond to the SSDP call at startup then it should give up IMHO.

Factory resetting everything is an overkill solution, a reinstall or reset of the app should have fixed it much more quickly.

This cache is not required for a functioning system.

Author of the leading 3rd party Sonos app for Windows, the only Sonos app for Xbox, and a Sonos app for iOS
J

Even the PC app takes an age to sort itself out and load. Slow updating on Android, used to be a really quick to load but obviously doing too much at startup. 

Except that mine still only takes 2 seconds to load, and this thread still has only a few posts after nearly three months.

I
Userlevel 4
Badge +4

Thanks - this makes sense but one of the households was still on S1 (I’ve a solitary Play 5 remaining which I use for line out ) and the other S2.  Both had issues.  Both do and had been functioning when the “spanner” missing speakers occasionally appeared.  The first port of call was to reset and ultimately reinstall the apps but these just reconnected to the broken systems so some legacy  info was being carried by the Boost / speakers.  System update wasn’t the issue either since all were current.  The only apparent fix was total factory reset although as I found on the second reset (S2 properly) due to my reluctance to reset the router, the router reset was not actually required.  Best wishes 

Ken_Griffiths

I would guess for an iPhone or iPad/iPad Pro with 26 Sonos network devices to respond to the multicast packets for ‘device discovery’, we’re probably talking about 7 seconds from App launch and probably 2 or 3 seconds when launching the app from a background state.

I don’t mind the wait on my older controller devices and if any devices are not discovered, then in my own past experience, that’s usually been down to local network conditions - which of course can change quite often in some circumstances, like being located next to several neighbouring properties which may auto-change their WiFi settings on router startup, or update etc.

A

Hi, I’ve been experiencing similar issues since I upgraded to the S2 app too.

“When people OPEN their Sonos S2 app does it take 10-40 seconds to load/refresh?  Is it laggy when changing sources, volume levels? Do the graphics take time to load after the app has started?” - Yes!

I have recently bought an Amp, Move and Arc and connecting to those speakers via AirPlay and the Sonos S2 app were very unreliable (also my other Sonos speakers). As you described my S2 experience was very laggy, taking many seconds to connect to the speakers if I was lucky. As you have experienced yourself, this was immensely frustrating when spending a not small amount of money on Sonos speakers expecting them to perform professionally and very disappointing.

Since researching about this issue and coming across this community post, I’ve now connected one of my speakers directly to my router, which means my Sonos speakers are now using SonosNet Channel 6 (you can also choose channel 1 or 11) to talk to each other rather than using my Wi-Fi channels and the lag has almost disappeared (AirPlay connection reliability seems to have improved too). This may have been caused by too many devices being on my Wi-Fi router. I only carried this out earlier today, but the results so far have been very promising.

I know there has been an update to the S2 App since you posted this, so I may also be experiencing an improved service due to the App update. I hope this helps.

D

Same problem for me.  EVERY time I open the S2 app, it takes 10-30 seconds to load.  No other apps have this issue.

 

update:  uninstalling and reinstalling the S2 app resolved it for me.

Airgetlam

The ‘lag time’ is a pretty good indicator of some sort of interference between the controller and the actual application running on the speaker. I’d be pretty strongly looking at the wifi interference FAQ, and if that didn’t help, I’d be submitting a system diagnostic within 10 minutes of experiencing this problem, and calling Sonos Support to discuss it.

There may be information included in the diagnostic that will help Sonos pinpoint the issue and help you find a solution.

When you speak directly to the phone folks, they have tools at their disposal that will allow them to give you advice specific to your Sonos system and network.

Bruce
Airgetlam

Since the controller is talking to the app running on the speakers, unless there’s an issue with the controller device talking to the router, it shouldn’t make any difference which controller you’re using.

I’d suspect a duplicate IP address issue at first blush, although DNS issues can’t be ruled out, there are a lot of things involved with network events such as a search.  This is why a diagnostic submitted within 10 minutes, followed by a call to Sonos, who has the ability to read them, is helpful. We peons on this forum don’t have access to that hard data. 

Bruce
Ken_Griffiths

Hi

 

I’m having similar issues - I’ve four systems in four locations using separate WiFi networks.  Three use S2 and one S1. Very recently, ALL apps (irrespective of S1/S2) are slow to respond to volume changes and to load search results - Amazon Music/ Hype Machine results returned seemingly instantly but Quobuz and Spotify(My go to choice) take twenty seconds or more to return results.  Using iPhone 13 iOS 16 generally but elsewhere iPads 6s or 9s using latest software.  Sonos software up to date.   Each system uses Boost for network and has 73 Mb/s BT internet.  Disconnected and reloaded S1/S2 Apps but issue remains.  Search results used to be returned almost instantly.   iMac controller still functions as it should with no delay.

Likely going to be WiFi interference from the Wireless networks and SonosNet channels in use. Can you perhaps outline the SSID’s/Wifi channels/Channel-widths in use by each network and state the SonosNet channels too. Maybe then some suggestions can be made to reduce the interference.

It would also help to describe how far away each Boost/Wired Sonos device, is from its nearest wireless AP.

Ken_Griffiths

If WiFi interference is the culprit, why wouldn’t the S2 Windows Desktop suffer the same lag issues? I have no similar issues on a Wireless Laptop or hardwired Desktop in the Windows world. When I spoke with Sonos support last week, I was told they are not experiencing this S2 issue with any customers which of course is nonsense. I am going to order the Apple IPad Air 5 and test my theory that when you have a large Sonos environment, the system bogs down and you need (at least in my case) a Tablet with a fast processor and lots of Ram.

I too would look closer at interference here, as the delay is bound to be down to Sonos ‘device discovery’ by the controller device itself. 

The Sonos controller uses SSDP to initially discover the players, multicasting via UDP to 239.255.255.250:1900 and, for good measure, broadcasting to 255.255.255.255:1900. 

Thereafter communication is unicast.

My thoughts are your controller device and it’s connection to a particular access point, are where to focus your efforts and of course how your devices are connecting to the LAN too.

I have an iPad Pro (Gen 3) controller and use a Plume mesh WiFi setup (6 AP’s), but have a Sonos system (25+ devices) running parallel on SonosNet and despite its 2.4Ghz band limitation, it takes less than 10s to discover all and become ready to control/operate .. If I move the devices over to my WiFi network and ‘bridge’ the Plume access points to my WiFi 6 AX router I can get the discovery down to less than 7 seconds as the plume network is much faster than SonosNet.

These things are down to the speed that your controller can discover your last Sonos device in your setup… moving that last device (if you can discover which one it is) will begin to lessen the lag… and then continue to lessen the discovery time as much as you can.

Check your controller device for ‘MAC spoofing’ in its WiFi connection properties, move any wired devices further away from nearby access points. Try different (fixed) ‘non-overlapping’ WiFi channels and reduce the 2.4ghz band channel-width to 20Mhz only and reserve the Sonos device IP addresses in your routers DHCP reservation table - and maybe get compatible sonos devices running on your 5Ghz band via blacklisting etc; and see if those type of things begin to reduce their discovery time.  

I
Userlevel 4
Badge +4

Hi thanks once more - the 73 Mb/s is a very solid download speed for most households in UK - must don’t yet have fibre to property - and it,or lower, has for many years been more than adequate for Sonos applications.   The key thing is that the fault is being experienced in four different regions of Uk with different routers whereas previously there was not an issue with the same set up.  The only variables before and after appear to be iOS and Sonos software updates 

Ken_Griffiths

Hi thanks once more - the 73 Mb/s is a very solid download speed for most households in UK - must don’t yet have fibre to property - and it,or lower, has for many years been more than adequate for Sonos applications.   The key thing is that the fault is being experienced in four different regions of Uk with different routers whereas previously there was not an issue with the same set up.  The only variables before and after appear to be iOS and Sonos software updates 

Whilst I’m also based in the UK and both an Apple iOS and an S2 Sonos system user, I don’t personally use BT as my ISP. So I can only suggest you perhaps go onto submit a Sonos diagnostic report from each (or some) of your Sonos systems, post search-return(s), and then speak direct with Sonos Support Staff about your matter.

The online link to contact Sonos Staff is HERE.

I’ve not (so far) seen others mention anything about the speed of the App search-results either, at least not in this user-community, but maybe others here will go onto chime in, that’s if they are experiencing similar issues.

The only other matters I can think of, are related to the following summary list, just in case you want to go onto explore those matters yourself too …

  • QoS or Airtime Fairness operating on the BT router
  • VPN and/or security based software running on the mobile device
  • Private WiFi Address (MAC Spoofing) enabled in the iOS Network connection properties
  • WiFi calling enabled on the iOS device

Admittedly 20+ seconds does seem rather a long time to return a search-result and I would have expected to see more reports about that sort of issue, particularly as both the iOS 16.2 release was mid-December and the S2 App update was released on December 6th, but maybe others here will go onto respond to this thread.

Personally I’m not seeing a problem at this moment in time, but as mentioned, my download speeds are much higher than the speed you mentioned, albeit my iPhone XR is older than your controller devices. 

Anyhow have a good New Year and I sincerely hope you get to find the answer to your search issue.

G
Userlevel 3
Badge +5

Another thread about this problem.

Link.

 

106rallye
Userlevel 7
Badge +17

@skilletP You’ve made two changes to your system:

  • You went from S1 to S2; and
  • You removed the Bridge that made your speakers use Sonosnet.

I’m wondering if your current problems aren’t more related to the removal of the Bridge. You could try cable connecting one of your speakers or buy a Boost to build a Sonosnet again.

 

I
Userlevel 4
Badge +4

Thank you…that seems like a possibility since all properties use the same BT Hub - I’ll see if there’s any discussion on BT community 

Stanley_4
Userlevel 7
Badge +22

That is different than my slowness issue, I’d sure send in a diagnostic and ask Sonos to look at it.

Airgetlam

Unfortunately, based on many years of frequenting this forum, I’ve noticed a rather large amount of issues with BT’s hardware. If I ever move to the UK, I’ll be certain not to choose them as my ISP. 

Bruce
B

Same problem - takes what feels ages to load just the app. Got significantly worse over the past month or two. FIX THIS PLEASE. Incredibly annoying

Ken_Griffiths

I don’t use an ISP provided router (other than as a modem), as you usually only get what don’t pay for with those ‘free’ devices anyway.😂

...and whilst BT routers are regularly complained about online, often in regards to SSDP multicasting ‘device discovery’ across it’s wired/wireless segments, with some firmware updates. I think we can be safe in the knowledge anyway here, that each Sonos system is running on SonosNet using a Boost as its (likely) root-bridge. Although I guess DNS/QoS issues etc; have not (yet) been ruled out.

I’m thinking it would be interesting to try an Android controller device with each Sonos system, as it might be something on the iOS devices, like ‘Private WiFi Address’ or even the recent Home(Kit) App upgrade, that Apple ’quickly’ withdrew because of it causing problems with various smart-home products, including their own HomePod speakers.

Next step might be to borrow an Android device to see if the Sonos App search provides much faster results. Then perhaps hone-in further on the Apple controller devices.

 

Airgetlam

I’ve always done the same, both with an AT&T connection, now with a Spectrum device. 

Bruce
K

Thanks Bruce,

Really this question is directed AT THE SONOS COMMUNITY - not support as you can probably tell from my postings. 

I’m asking if ANY other Sonos S2 users have experienced the Sonos applications reacting/launching/refreshing slowly compared to other iOS/Android apps and S1.

 

I do agree that it makes it tough when Sonos’ support has their hands tied with communicating broadly to the community. 

 

I find the lag time is most frustrating when you want to quickly stop or turn down the volume…

I'll quickly get the next offer for the latest speaker though!

Right now why would I buy another speaker, I'm more likely to o go elsewhere completely…

My net promotor score is 4/10 for recommending Sonia right now....

In the world of smart phones and computers the lag  is a big issue…

Come in Sonos give us some hope!

J

As Bruce has said, I am just a fellow user. Your network may be the best on the planet, but may just need a setting change to work fine with Sonos. I was not implying that your network is faulty.

But the Sonos app is not inherently slow. It is just a remote control. It cannot, itself,  be slow.

A
Badge

Same. Painfully slow load and lag with S2 on iOS. Super frustrating to open the app bad have to wait 30+ seconds at times for it to even load. HALP

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