End of Software Support - Clarifications

End of Software Support - Clarifications
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R
Userlevel 3
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SONOS ratings getting understandably trashed on major retail sites such as Amazon. 

Share price down another 2% so far today.

Derisory response from the CEO to peoples concerns - didn’t really address anything.

 

On a positive note I’ve discovered there are some real alternatives to SONOS that I’d simply never considered before as I was completely bought into the SONOS product set.  Most of them are much cheaper too … +++

B
Userlevel 5
Badge +5

SONOS ratings getting understandably trashed on major retail sites such as Amazon. 

Share price down another 2% so far today.

Derisory response from the CEO to peoples concerns - didn’t really address anything.

 

On a positive note I’ve discovered there are some real alternatives to SONOS that I’d simply never considered before as I was completely bought into the SONOS product set.  Most of them are much cheaper too … +++

 

Exactly, the bubble has burst.

Sonos from leader to loser in 2020.
J

and Patrick Spence

 

 

Stock symbol is SONO.  It’s falling as is predictable.  Would not buy that!

With so many competitors, one wonders about a strategy to cannabilize the current customer base rather than come up with a glide path approach, e.g., maintain the current feature set and integrate such that they continue to function in harmony with the release of new features for the “modern” products.

Potential issue: Perhaps there is something fundamentally wrong with their strategy to date with their software stack and its design to sit on their hardware?

Of our 16 SONOS products purchased in 2012, 9 are marked as Legacy.  This represents roughly $4,000-$4,500 product only excluding installation and dedicated wiring.  My previous stereos (retired but still functional) were used for roughly 20 or so years.  My turntable (1973) still works like a charm.

 

P

I cannot believe this, how to destroy customer confidence in a single decision. I feel as many do, that my / our early adoption of Sonos has significantly contributed to the brands success, and now you are turning your back on us. We trusted this brand.

And now I have been informed today that even products I purchased new in 2013, I am told will not receive updates as it was “introduced” between 2005 band 2011, regardless of when I bought it.

 

Come on Sonos, really !!

 

E
Userlevel 4
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Those are the two legacy versions of the Connect:Amp that I have seen.  Notice both have a mute symbol on the button, but the Sonos logo on the first one is older.  The newer Sonos logo was also later used with the play/pause button.  That’s the modern version.  So the modern one looks like this (sorry the photos keep rotating when I upload them):

 

And in 2015 both kinds were in the marketplace, without any description distinguishing the difference, so people like me bought a mix without knowledge or understanding of the difference……...until now. Does that seem right?? Same price, same name, different life and functionality…….

Have found on ebay an AMP with a serial starting 1412, indicating it was manufactured in 2014, but it has the new logo and play/pause button. Am assuming this is ‘modern’, but is that a gamble?

Hasn’t been confirmed by Sonos.  Just my observations based on the units I have access to.  But I would think that’s a modern unit.  However one person here posted that they have a legacy with a play/pause button (not sure if that was true or not).  So it’s a gamble.  At a minimum, these should be worth a little below $195 on eBay - or the coupon value to trade up to an Amp. 
 

Would be nice if Sonos could confirm though.  That way people could know how to visually identify the legacy and non legacy units. 
 

 

C
Userlevel 5
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Thanks Danny. No I did not get an email telling me my Connect:Amp is a legacy product. I read the Sonos announcement which included the Connect: Amp in the legacy list. I’m confused - how do I tell?

This changes things.  If you have a play/pause button on the front it’s a post-2015 connect:amp with 256mb of memory (8x the pre-2015 Connect:amp).  You are still modern/will get software updates.  They were selling these through 2018 or early 2019, so under their policy, you’ll be supported until at least 2023. 


Not true.  My connect Amps have a play pause button, but are all listed as legacy.

 

They look like this?  With that symbol on the play/pause button?  Are you in the US?
 

 


Am in the UK - Im sure I have a mix of those with a mute button and those with a play/pause button.  Will check when I get home.  All five listed as legacy, so Im looking at £somewhere in the region of £2,100 to keep my whole home working together (I also have anothr 12 devices mixture of play1 and play:one).

I
Userlevel 4
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Here’s an extract from today’s Evening Standard:

 

Spence said the company is working on a way for customers to split these systems so the speakers still work together but receive the appropriate updates for each device. 

 

This reiterates my earlier speculation from a BBC article that it’s the legacy units’ inability to handle greater memory requirement updates which necessitates creating two populations of Sonos units - legacy and modern.  The ES article goes further by saying that the speakers still work together but receive the appropriate updates for each device. 

 

If the storm (hopefully in a tea cup) is ONLY about handling software updates and they can indeed work together after having been updated, I’m HAPPY again.

G
Userlevel 6
Badge +4

SONOS ratings getting understandably trashed on major retail sites such as Amazon. 

Share price down another 2% so far today.

Derisory response from the CEO to peoples concerns - didn’t really address anything.

 

On a positive note I’ve discovered there are some real alternatives to SONOS that I’d simply never considered before as I was completely bought into the SONOS product set.  Most of them are much cheaper too … +++

Yes, this has been an excellent way of encouraging me to look about too. I can fix this problem much cheaper by dropping Sonos than by upgrading. So like I say what fools gonna upgrade in this situation?

J

and Patrick Spence

 

 

Stock symbol is SONO.  It’s falling as is predictable.  Would not buy that!

With so many competitors, one wonders about a strategy to cannabilize the current customer base rather than come up with a glide path approach, e.g., maintain the current feature set and integrate such that they continue to function in harmony with the release of new features for the “modern” products.

Potential issue: Perhaps there is something fundamentally wrong with their strategy to date with their software stack and its design to sit on their hardware?

Of our 16 SONOS products purchased in 2012, 9 are marked as Legacy.  This represents roughly $4,000-$4,500 product only excluding installation and dedicated wiring.  My previous stereos (retired but still functional) were used for roughly 20 or so years.  My turntable (1973) still works like a charm.

 

 

Oh, and Q1 earnings are expected Feb 5.  Maybe these guys were going to miss their bonuses?

robinm0
Userlevel 4
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Another day, another thought. What’s really annoying is that, for me, Sonos’ kit has pretty well worked out of the box, with setting-up being straightforward. I know that hasn’t been the case for some. 

The system has also worked well. It still does and that’s what makes the probable demise of my Play:3 & last remaining Play:1 in the near future, as they’re the oldest components, so disappointing.

 

 

 

MB
Userlevel 1

"First, rest assured that come May, when we end new software updates for our legacy products, they will continue to work as they do today."

 

Everytime I read this I get more and more annoyed. They will not work as they do before, if I plan to keep my non-legacy products updated then I cannot group them with my legacy products. So my Connect, Connect amp and play 5 will no longer work in my SYSTEM. The whole ethos is that they group together and offer me seamless music throughout my house. My turntable is connected to the Connect Amp in my living room, but often have it on playing through my Beam Sub combo in the Kitchen. After May if I want my Beam and Sub up-to-date that won't be possible. 

J
Userlevel 4
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Split brain it is.. (sorry, computing cluster term from my work). From Sonos support on Twitter:

 

“Sonos Support Team

  @SonosSupport   Replying to @Breadmaker6 Understood, If the Legacy and Modern players are all running on the same software version, they can be on the same system and will still be able to group together as they do now. Modern players updated beyond Legacy software will not be able to group with Legacy players.”

 

So - no grouping. Sonos has decided to keep their “everything must run the same version of the OS/Application” mandate.   Let’s be clear - that’s to make it easier for Sonos, not for users. It cuts down on their test matrix and engineering costs.   I’m out. Exploring Bluesound to replace my Zoneplayers/Connects - will move to second hand Chromecast audio devices with powered monitor speakers for the Play:1’s and Play:5’s.   I’ll give away my current Sonos kit to relatives / friends I made the unfortunate decision of encouraging to buy Sonos as some small measure of apology, with the strong advice they don’t buy any more.

E
Userlevel 4
Badge +5

Thanks Danny. No I did not get an email telling me my Connect:Amp is a legacy product. I read the Sonos announcement which included the Connect: Amp in the legacy list. I’m confused - how do I tell?

This changes things.  If you have a play/pause button on the front it’s a post-2015 connect:amp with 256mb of memory (8x the pre-2015 Connect:amp).  You are still modern/will get software updates.  They were selling these through 2018 or early 2019, so under their policy, you’ll be supported until at least 2023. 


Not true.  My connect Amps have a play pause button, but are all listed as legacy.

 

They look like this?  With that symbol on the play/pause button?  Are you in the US?
 

 


Am in the UK - Im sure I have a mix of those with a mute button and those with a play/pause button.  Will check when I get home.  All five listed as legacy, so Im looking at £somewhere in the region of £2,100 to keep my whole home working together (I also have anothr 12 devices mixture of play1 and play:one).

Thanks.  Would be helpful to know if you have a legacy with a play/pause icon!  I’m in the US and had a wide mix of different aged models and all my play/pause ones were modern.  However, that could just be my experience, or it could be a distinction limited to the US market.  Would be nice to have a confirmation from Sonos as to the visual distinctions!

R
Userlevel 3
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Pick a product and leave 1 star review: Product obsolete within 5 years. Sonos stop supporting their products after 5 years!

https://www.sonos.com/en-gb/reviews/consumer/form?pr_page_id=one&pr_merchant_id=411151&pr_api_key=cc48e875-2a83-4fb9-a513-164a041971fa&pr_merchant_group_id=14196


When i try to leave a 1 star review i get this

 

We're sorry, an error has occurred while loading necessary components. We are looking into the problem. Please try again later.

I wonder if this somehow broke down, by “accident”

 

Yep same error. They don’t like a mob with pitch forks and torches!

Absolutely done on purpose.

Works for me - just make sure you fill in all the boxes.  However, they vet comments they don’t get automatically published

P
Userlevel 3
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Stock is down nearly 10% this week.  Has dropped fairly heavily this morning.  How much more does it need to drop before the message hits home?  Breaking the whole home brand promise is a huge degradation of the user experience.  It’s not acceptable.  Sure, my speakers still work as speakers, but they don’t work as an integrated infrastructure - which is why I bought them in the first place.

 

CEO statement yesterday was basically flannel reiterating what we already knew.  I’m still not buying anything else at this point.

G
Userlevel 6
Badge +4

"First, rest assured that come May, when we end new software updates for our legacy products, they will continue to work as they do today."

 

Everytime I read this I get more and more annoyed. They will not work as they do before, if I plan to keep my non-legacy products updated then I cannot group them with my legacy products. So my Connect, Connect amp and play 5 will no longer work in my SYSTEM. The whole ethos is that they group together and offer me seamless music throughout my house. My turntable is connected to the Connect Amp in my living room, but often have it on playing through my Beam Sub combo in the Kitchen. After May if I want my Beam and Sub up-to-date that won't be possible. 

Yes this seems completely misleading

chickentender

People are funny….

There are a lot off used Connect:Amp's coming for sale now in  the Netherlands (40 x since yesterday) for around € 275,00 - 350,00 !!!!

“Hardly ever used, perfect condition, like new!”  But no word about legacy products…..

Wenn asked about it, they tell you it is working perfectly and critical updates will be available. So they all know but are trying to get rid of their legacy product for big money :rolling_eyes:  

This is also bad pr for the Sonos brand!  you have to be a  “specialist” before buying second hand Sonos products. It is becoming an even bigger risk now…..
 


Yeah, in Denmark, there were atleast 15 Play 5’s put up for sale as “Working fine”

One guy even has a package of 2 Play 5’s, one Play 3 and one Amp.


Poor sod that buys that package, only to find that he essentially bought a Play 3 and a bunch of landfill material.

 

Not to mention that there is a great risk that some of these play 5s will be “sold” to Sonos for a 30% off, right before being shipped to the poor buyer that will then have a paperweight, 3 weeks later.
 

Same is happening in my local area, but on the contrary… I actually made offer on a set of gen-1 Play5 speakers (for what would 2 weeks ago be considered an insulting lowball offer), noting in my offer what was going on with Sonos and reiterating that I’d need to see it powered on and connected to a controller to ensure it’d not been tagged for Recycle-mode. Judging from his response/reaction, he knew well the legacy situation announcements and he accepted my offer grudgingly. My aim is to simply expand my speaker network on the crazy-cheap, recognizing it will be legacy for the foreseeable future. 
Point being, there’ll likely be some poor sods out there, but there’s also now going to be giant opportunity for those that know exactly what they’re getting into.

MB
Userlevel 1

Here’s an extract from today’s Evening Standard:

 

Spence said the company is working on a way for customers to split these systems so the speakers still work together but receive the appropriate updates for each device. 

 

This reiterates my earlier speculation from a BBC article that its the legacy units’ inability to handle greater memory requirement updates which necessitates creating two populations of Sonos units - legacy and modern.  The ES article goes further by saying that the speakers still work together but receive the appropriate updates for each device. 

 

If the storm (hopefully in a train cup) is ONLY about handling software updates and they can indeed work together after having been updated, I’m HAPPY again.

The speakers WILL NOT work together if you choose to update. See reply that I got via Twitter today. 

 

K

Bad bad move!!!…. a long time Sonos customer and fan here but you lost my trust, Sonos. People are getting rid of their devices fast. Sales of new devices will hurt for sure as more people find out what’s going on and how greedy Sonos is. 

Regards….

P
Userlevel 5
Badge +1

Stock is down nearly 10% this week.  Has dropped fairly heavily this morning.  How much more does it need to drop before the message hits home?  Breaking the whole home brand promise is a huge degradation of the user experience.  It’s not acceptable.  Sure, my speakers still work as speakers, but they don’t work as an integrated infrastructure - which is why I bought them in the first place.

 

CEO statement yesterday was basically flannel reiterating what we already knew.  I’m still not buying anything else at this point.

Q1 earnings report due shortly, obviously it won’t be affected by this lot - could even be quite healthy given the period it covers. Q2 (3 months to end March) should be fascinating.

G
Userlevel 6
Badge +4

Here’s an extract from today’s Evening Standard:

 

Spence said the company is working on a way for customers to split these systems so the speakers still work together but receive the appropriate updates for each device. 

 

This reiterates my earlier speculation from a BBC article that its the legacy units’ inability to handle greater memory requirement updates which necessitates creating two populations of Sonos units - legacy and modern.  The ES article goes further by saying that the speakers still work together but receive the appropriate updates for each device. 

 

If the storm (hopefully in a train cup) is ONLY about handling software updates and they can indeed work together after having been updated, I’m HAPPY again.

The speakers WILL NOT work together if you choose to update. See reply that I got via Twitter today. 

 

 

 

 

Confirmation of what we’ve been saying all along.

If you have old and new speakers you cannot group them anymore - so lose the key function of the sonos system.

MotleyMe
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I am with the crowd that is really upset with this announcement.  I too am an early adopter of Sonos.  This “change” means that thousands of dollars of investment in a great sound system was foolishly spent. 

In addition after spending over $2000 on Play:5s, you are telling me for another $1400 I can replace my Play:5s with lower quality Sonos Moves?!?!   How does that even make sense!   At least your upgrade program should be like for like!  And a discount for more the 30% would be better.

I am soooo mad that I am considering ditching my whole Sonos installations.

Sonos you really need to take better care of your early loyal customers as they are the ones who keep buying more speakers to expand their systems. (like me)

 

Best

...and remember … it says their new devices will now be supported with software updates for only 5 years …. Who would buy this price of product with such short-term built-in obsolescence.  That’s more like a mobile phone than a home speaker system! They’re trying to blackmail us into paying 70% of the cost we already paid for an updated version of something that is pristine, works fine and is nowhere near the end of it’s life. The new products of course need absolutely endless updates to point of the system being a complete pain in the nick-nacks!  This may suit Sonos but it doesn’t suit me and their customer base is all they have… Great eco credentials too Sonos! 

That’s not what it says. What it says is 5 years after they stop selling the product.  So if you buy a Beam, which has been on the market for a year and will likely be sold for at least 5 years, you then get 5 years minimum after that.  So 10 years.   Note that 10 years for tech is a really long time.  The original iPhone came out 13 years ago, for instance.  There was no Samsung Galaxy or tablets or anything.  Totally different universe.  Who even knows if we’ll still be using iPhones in 10 years or what the next devices will require to interface with Sonos.  


Yep, but if you buy something that’s about to be (unbeknowst to yoursefl) withdrawn… it’s 5 years. Altho’ this may be considered “tech” and therfore like a mobile phone to some, to me it was always been speakers fro my sound system and my previous, though still functioning ones, are over 40 years old!  I don’t believe many people expect a premium home sound system to have such a short life. [Oh … and just out of interest I had a Nokia N800 “Internet Tablet” in 2006, with touch screen, multi-app capability and things like Shazam on (so 3 years before the iPad). It was a rather small but not exactly attractive looking, hence the success of the iphone that I believe infringed many it’s patents according to media replorts.]

W

Agree totally with Mike886, totally disappointed in Sonos. Can’t trust any product you buy  from them to work for a long time in the future. I have a stereo system  from the ‘70 ies that cost less and still works perfecly. 
Shame om Sonos. I’ll never spend another penny on their products!!!

 

Wim SK

Rotterdam, NL

P

I’ll chime in here and also say I was a big SONOS brand booster. This is a huge misstep and the “mea culpa” really doesn’t do much to solve it without some guarantees. I’d expect them to say “your system will continue to work for at least 20 years. It won’t necessarily be able to handle unforeseen technology but will work as it works today.”  That’s what any receiver/speaker set would for for 20 years or longer. If they think this is like an iPhone or MacBook, they better think again. There are just too many other options out there, including Onkyo and other receivers that perform all the same functions.

I was regretting missing out on the in-wall speakers for our kitchen renovation, but now I’m really happy I installed Polk Audio wired in-wall speakes for maximum flexibility. SONOS is only a solution if you want to hide wires. All the new receivers support music services and are far cheaper to replace if you had to to get new features. 

 

 

C
Userlevel 5
Badge +3

Yet on the chart showing memory per sonos unit, there is only one lising for the connect:amp.

Smells like sonos just deciding that anything over 5 years old is legacy, regardless of its specification and thats their model.  You’ve had it five years, buy another one.

That may be acceptable with a single phone, or even a TV.  But almost 20 connected speakers at almost £6,000 you don’t replace every five years.

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