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Group wifi settings - problems with streaming hi-res music

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Hello all - new to the community, and relatively new to Sonos, and I am looking for assistance. 

I have a group set-up in my living room consisting of a Playbase (connected by ethernet to a TP-Link powerline wifi adapter), a Sub (Gen 2) and two One SLs. All works perfectly with TV and streaming music Apple/Spotify etc) in standard resolution. 

I wish to stream hi-res music on this group - either Amazon HD or Quobuz - as I am impressed by the difference in audio clarity. I find that when I stream either of these services (through Sonos app), the first song plays, and then skips the last 8 seconds of the song and jumps to the next. Then, by the second or third song of the playlist, the music just comes through the Playbase (which has the ethernet connection) and the other speakers no longer play. If I skip back to the start of that particular track, then I get full surround again, but the whole problem happens again by the time of the next song.

Having read a bit on the web and in this forum, the indication is that this is due to wifi speed or settings, but I dont know what I need to change or optimise. If I check my wifi speed in the living room I get 90 Mbps download speed - which I reckon should be Ok - I also have no problem streaming Netflix HD from the same TP-Link Powerline). 

 

I have seen there are network settings to be made on the Sonos app that could help - but I am not sure what and how to change and would welcome any guidance on that. I also notice that if I group my living set-up with the Play:3 I have in my kitchen (which is older and therefore not S2 compatible) then the problem stops, but I am assuming that this is because the stream quality is reduced for all devices (??). 

If I stream music direct from either the Quobuz or Amazon Music HD apps (i.e. not through Sonos) then the experience is even worse with drops outs and skips on every song. Same if I download the songs. 

Sorry for the long, rambling post but I hope to have described the issue accurately. As said, I am no technophile and would welcome any simple guidance on things I can try to optimise my setup and enjoy the hi-res providers. 

Thanks

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Best answer by DerkleineEnglaender 21 April 2021, 19:59

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87 replies

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Right - just established that :sweat_smile:

 

ratty

To be honest, from here I can’t see anything immediately obvious which would explain the behaviour you report. Something is choking somewhere, causing packets to be dropped. 

I suggest you do in fact submit a diagnostic after a dropout incident. Note the number and post it here.

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How do I submit/generate a diagnostic?

ratty

How do I submit/generate a diagnostic?

https://support.sonos.com/s/article/141

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Thanks - did that and it has given me a number 1226270626. How do I associate that to the problem I am experiencing? What happens next?

ratty

Someone should pick it up anyway but I’ll flag the post for official attention.

 

By the way, the reason the audio gets interrupted as a track is ending is that the next track is trying to download into the player buffer. The bandwidth required for a CD quality track is clearly much greater than for Apple/Spotify. For some reason this traffic burst is causing grief somewhere. Hopefully a look at the system internals may shed some light.

Smilja

You’d be better off getting in touch with German Support by phone, since the staff there have experience with Vodafone and the routers provided by them. In case you’re a native speaker, there is English speaking staff too.

https://support.sonos.com/s/contact?language=de

»And the world is like an apple whirling silently in space, Like the circles that you find in the windmills of your mind.« (›Windmills Of Your Mind‹ [1967]. Music by Michel Legrand ; English lyrics written by Alan & Marilyn Bergman)
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Thanks again for your assistance on this (both of you). Overall really pleased with Sonos and the Quobuz stream is very impressive (in case anyone hasnt tried it yet). Missing a couple of my favourite groups, but listening to music through it is impressive. I will keep everyone update on this and hope that this thread may be of use to others. Kudos to @ratty and @Smilja  for investing their time on helping me. Thumbs up to Community life. Enjoy the rest of the weekend.

Corry P
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Hi @DerkleineEnglaender 

Welcome to the Sonos Community!

Sorry for the delay. I’ve looked at the diagnostics and the Playbase is reporting issues with getting the stream from the source fast enough. As the Playbase is ethernet-wired, I would put this down to the extender it’s connected to. It doesn’t explain why grouping-in the Play:3 resolves it, however.

As the others have suggested, I recommend you get in touch with our technical support team, who will be able to do some real-time troubleshooting with you.

Something easy to try first, however, would be to remove the ethernet connection to the Playbase and wire the Play:3 directly to the router instead. Put the Play:3 in charge of the group (select it first) and test. If that fixes the issue, you may want to keep the Play:3 there, have a new speaker there, or have a Boost permanently wired there instead. Having said that, I definitely recommend you get in touch with technical support before spending any money.

"Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen." - Albert Einstein
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Thanks @Corry P , impressed by the service. As an update from my side, I noticed that when leaving the 2 rooms playing over an evening (living room group with the wired Playbase and Kitchen Play:3), at some point the problem recurred and sound was only coming from the Playbase in the living room and the Play:3 in the kitchen. 

Assuming it is the connection to the extender (the Magic 2) that is the issue, how can it be resolved? I use the Magic 2 because the internet comes into our house on another floor, and I have no connection points on the floor where my Sonos set-up is. What would a Boost do and how would I connect it? Does that get connected to the Magic 2 on the floor with my set-up, or on the other floor where the router and internet source is? 

Seems strange that it is not receiving enough data, as the diagnostics for the Magic 2 shows a fairly strong data stream. 

In terms of the technical team - is that online or phone support that is best?

 

Thanks again

Smilja

In terms of the technical team - is that online or phone support that is best?

 

By phone in your case.

»And the world is like an apple whirling silently in space, Like the circles that you find in the windmills of your mind.« (›Windmills Of Your Mind‹ [1967]. Music by Michel Legrand ; English lyrics written by Alan & Marilyn Bergman)
Corry P
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I noticed that when leaving the 2 rooms playing over an evening (living room group with the wired Playbase and Kitchen Play:3), at some point the problem recurred and sound was only coming from the Playbase in the living room and the Play:3 in the kitchen.

Well, that makes a bit more sense (assuming there’s a “not” missing in that sentence, as I suspect).

Assuming it is the connection to the extender (the Magic 2) that is the issue, how can it be resolved? I use the Magic 2 because the internet comes into our house on another floor, and I have no connection points on the floor where my Sonos set-up is. What would a Boost do and how would I connect it? Does that get connected to the Magic 2 on the floor with my set-up, or on the other floor where the router and internet source is?

As with a speaker, we would prefer it if you wired a Boost directly to the router - it simplifies the connection, and reduces the number of “hops” incoming traffic makes (or at least keeps as many hops on Sonos as possible). When you wish to extend the reach of your WiFi signal, we recommend the use of a WiFi Mesh system as they back-haul on a separate connection and thus don’t half the available bandwidth. I don’t think powerline products half the bandwidth, but they are subject to external influences that other networking products aren’t. 

Seems strange that it is not receiving enough data, as the diagnostics for the Magic 2 shows a fairly strong data stream.

I can’t really comment on this - I only see Sonos performance statistics in the diagnostics, and they blame the source data path.

In terms of the technical team - is that online or phone support that is best?

I recommend a call - it’s much quicker for a troubleshooting session. Once a chat’s troubleshooting gets really involved the agent is expected to pass you on to the phone lines, so you may as well start there.

 

"Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen." - Albert Einstein
ratty

I’d suspected the source data was choking, but the behaviour of the other players in the household was odd.

FWIW I have experience of Devolo Magic 1. The Magic 2 is supposed to offer up to 2400 Mbps (raw), and the display of ‘only’ ~300 Mbps data rate is distinctly low. It suggests it could be struggling quite a bit.

Corry P
Userlevel 7
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FWIW I have experience of Devolo Magic 1. The Magic 2 is supposed to offer up to 2400 Mbps (raw), and the display of ‘only’ ~300 Mbps data rate is distinctly low. It suggests it could be struggling quite a bit.

 

I would be wary of those claims - 2.4x faster than a dedicated, twisted-pair ethernet cable (or just as fast as 2.5Gb ethernet which has barely made it into the home market) seems unlikely. I assume this is in laboratory conditions with brand-new mains wiring and few other devices on the circuit. This is of course my personal opinion and not that of Sonos, and I have no experience with the device so I could be completely wrong.

Sonos is unlikely to saturate the network bandwidth with a single stream (even 24bit) to two devices so it may not even be down to bandwidth, but to something else (even 300Mbit is 3x faster than the ethernet sockets on Sonos devices) - the majority of the time (that I could see - about 20 min) the Playbase wasn’t reporting any problems. I think therefore that there may be something happening periodically that’s interrupting the stream - this could be something on the network, or something plugged into the mains power circuit (like a refrigerator, vacuum cleaner, LED ligh dimmers, etc.) which is exactly why we don’t support Powerline: there’s just too much scope for something to go wrong. 

 

"Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen." - Albert Einstein
ratty

A raw data rate of 300 Mbps would imply a usable throughput of maybe 120 Mbps. My point was that the OP’s 300 figure was distinctly low (I see twice that for the “up to 1200 Mbps” Magic 1), suggesting that the powerline technology could be fighting with the electrical cabling layout and/or interference, and hence be prone to spike interruptions. 

So, yes, EoP really is the luck of the draw. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

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I would prefer not to buy a mesh system having bought the Magic 2. I will try a Boost however- reading the information on it, it looks like it may provide enough of a “boost” to my system upstairs if I plug it downstairs to the router directly. Or am I being too optimistic?

Smilja

@DerkleineEnglaender, Sonos has a generous return policy (100 days in Germany), if you purchase the Boost at Sonos Shop. 

»And the world is like an apple whirling silently in space, Like the circles that you find in the windmills of your mind.« (›Windmills Of Your Mind‹ [1967]. Music by Michel Legrand ; English lyrics written by Alan & Marilyn Bergman)
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I saw that, so I guess nothing to lose

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Quick question to set up with the Boost: if I do set it up on the other floor, connected directly to the router, do I understand it correctly that I then disconnect the Playbase on this floor from the Magic adapter and the run it also over WiFi? 
 

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@ratty @Corry P  if you would be so kind to help on my last post re. Boost set up / Playbase connection. Thanks 

ratty

You'd disconnect the Playbase from the wired connection. 

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Thanks @ratty . I was reading through some forum posts about adding the Boost to an existing set up, and saw that you have previously provided advice. If I understand correctly:

- first I will  add the Boost unwired to the network, albeit on the other floor of the house and near the router.

  • when it has settled, then I will disconnect the Playbase from the Ethernet on the floor where my system is and go to the other floor and connect up the Boost.
  • is that right or any any particular order to follow? 

 

ratty

I think the controller now asks for the Boost to be wired in order to be added, so:

  1. Leave the Playbase wired to its powerline adapter
  2. Wire the Boost to the router
  3. Add the Boost
  4. Unwire the Playbase
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Morning all. Boost has arrived and set it up as @ratty describes above and per instructions. Group in the living room all working (including the now unwired Playbase) but problem appears to still be there. When streaming Quobuz through Sonos app it skips last 8 seconds. When streaming direct from Quobuz app via AirPlay it drops intermittently. 

How do i check that the Boost is integrated/working in the system and doing what it is mean to be doing? Do I need to give it time to “settle”? Apart from the Sonos app telling me that the Boost is set up, and listing it on my devices, I cannot determine anything. Do I need to restart anything?

Just want to make sure I try everything before deciding to return the Boost. Thanks 

ratty

If the Boost wasn’t working you wouldn’t be able to see the players. You can look in About My System and check that everything appears to be in order.

Now that you have an officially supported configuration, i.e. no longer dependent on the powerline connection, I suggest you take a fresh diagnostic within 10 mins of a dropout and post the number.

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