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Sonos S2


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So it is 4pm on the 8th June here and still no Sonos S2 update. Hmmmmm.

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Best answer by larsvdberg 8 June 2020, 11:26

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I’ve successfully completed the S2 upgrade to my system - have the S2 logo on my iPad desktop right along side the S1 controller icon - how do i safely remove the S1 controller icon from my desktop thereby only leaving the S2 logo icon?

Delete it, as you would any other app. 

I’ve successfully completed the S2 upgrade to my system - have the S2 logo on my iPad desktop right along side the S1 controller icon - how do i safely remove the S1 controller icon from my desktop thereby only leaving the S2 logo icon?

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Thanks guys, for your thoughts.:musical_note:

The trade-up offer probably won’t last forever, but I doubt it’s going to disappear this year, and I can’t imagine Sonos won’t give customers at least 30 days notice before it ends.  To me, if you plan on selling your old units, then the question of what the used value of play:5 gen 1’s is the bigger factor from a cost perspective.

My thoughts are slightly different and to take the current trade-up offer of 30% and use the vouchers to buy the new Play 5 (gen 3’s) and also sell on the Play 5 (gen 1’s) as they are still a sought after device by some. That way, your overall outlay should be less now, than it maybe further down the line. The trade-up offer is probably not going to be around forever.

I agree with @Kumar that a run on Fives at some future point is not worth worrying about.

The only thing i would add is that, IMO, the gen 2 Play:5 was/is a vast improvement on the gen 1 (and by all accounts the Five is similar acoustically to the gen 2).  If the budget is there, i would consider getting them now and enjoying them.  If you order from Sonos and don’t share my view on the difference in audio quality, you could return them.

The latter. Your 5 units will suffer hardware failure that will stop them from working. All the units out there will suffer this at different times.

And there will be some like me that will buy other alternatives to Sonos when legacy S1 kit dies, so there is that factor as well.

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Hi. I’m happy and content staying with S1 so that I can use my 2 legacy 5’s with my 2 Play 3’s  and 2 play 1’s. When the 5’s become incompatible I’m ready to buy 2 Gen 3 Fives and move the whole thing up to S2. My only concern is that at that time everybody else with legacy 5’s will be doing the same thing, which may cause a run on new Fives and a waiting period to get them. For that reason it has crossed my mind to buy the new Fives now and beat the rush.

Any of you smart guys think that’s a legitimate concern or am I crazy?

 Sonos playlists can have content from sources from more than just a NAS - mine include tracks from other sources, including Spotify, too.

I gave up on mixed source playlists when the lack of volume normalisation across sources came in the way. But yes, in that case, I suppose these too would need rebuilding. 

Trouble in this context just means costs, I suppose, to answer that question you raised. Sonos has to have felt that these were not justified by how many users need this facility, also with S2 being the chosen path forward for the company. Or, perhaps this requirement simply did not come to their mind, seeing the present focus of the company.

 

@ratty, you know more about this than many/all.  I do think most who were aware of the forthcoming split (but maybe not part of a beta where it may have been known) were expecting to be left with a set of speakers on S1 and a set on S2, both controlled by a separate App but behaving as they previously did - but no longer able to be grouped.

How could Sonos have achieved this?

You know what they say: a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

One can conceive of a way a system (household) could be divided in two whilst leaving such things as playlists intact. It’s just software after all.

Putting it into practice in a supportable fashion is of course a different matter, with policy and resource implications.

FWIW I’d also hoped Sonos would have provided a household splitting tool.

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How could Sonos have achieved this?

I expect the Sonos response to be that 95 percent of the user base does not use NAS anymore, and of the diminishing by the day percentage of those that do, a very small number will be interested in split systems. Of which an even smaller number will have large playlists. And are therefore not worth the trouble.


What ‘trouble’ though?  It’s extra work for the users to attempt to get their system back where it was.  I’m trying to understand if it’s ‘technical’ or just a decision they’ve made.  Sonos playlists can have content from sources from more than just a NAS - mine include tracks from other sources, including Spotify, too.

 

How could Sonos have achieved this?

I expect the Sonos response to be that 95 percent of the user base does not use NAS anymore, and of the diminishing by the day percentage of those that do, a very small number will be interested in split systems. Of which an even smaller number will have large playlists. And are therefore not worth the trouble.

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@ratty, you know more about this than many/all.  I do think most who were aware of the forthcoming split (but maybe not part of a beta where it may have been known) were expecting to be left with a set of speakers on S1 and a set on S2, both controlled by a separate App but behaving as they previously did - but no longer able to be grouped.

How could Sonos have achieved this?

Split S1 - S2.

Did anyone try to upgrade part of the speakers while keeping the ones to be retained in S1 unplugged from power?

Maybe in that case after upgrade powering them up again allows them to keep the settings and playlists….

This doesn’t work. You end up with an S1 controller that complains that the S2 units are “incompatible”, and an S2 controller that complains that the S1 units “need update”.

Split S1 - S2.

Did anyone try to upgrade part of the speakers while keeping the ones to be retained in S1 unplugged from power?

Maybe in that case after upgrade powering them up again allows them to keep the settings and playlists….

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Yes, it sounds like you have done a simple upgrade from S1 to S2?

The issue is that if you need to split your system because some of your devices are not compatible with S2, you first of all update everything to the new S1 software, then decide which ones are not going to be a part of S2 and they are then all removed and Factory reset - losing all of their settings, Playlists etc.  You are not left with quite the split system with them behaving as before but not able to be linked - you need to make a decision on which is more important and reset the other.

My Play 5 Gen 1 is in a room where Grouping is not that important anymore - but listening to all the music  and Sonos Playlists, Favourites etc, that I currently do still is.

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Reading about the issues with playlists, I have to admit I am confused. All mine were retained.

Yesterday I updated my system ( Playbar, Sub (2nd Gen), Connect:AMP (2nd Gen) ) to S2 before my Arc and Gen 3 Sub arrive this week.

I didn’t uninstall the existing Sonos apps, but downloaded and installed the new S2 app on my Windows PC, Android Phones, MacBook and iPad.

In the S2 app, all the Preferences, Sonos Playlists and Sonos Favorites remain as before.

NOTHING has changed - it was a flawless upgrade.

 

 

But both are just as important.  Just because I can no longer group the speakers post-S1, it seems reasonable to assume I'd still want to listen to the same things I used to when in the room the speaker is in.

I agree; one system needing a rebuilding of local playlists is a downer and it does not make sense to users to have to choose between systems for this information to be retained. And even if this is some strategy to discourage split systems, there should be clear warning of this tripwire before it explodes.

Other setting losses are probably not of great consequence - but many of my Sonos playlists have over 2000 tracks in them and I would not happy if I had to rebuild these. I would be even less happy if I discovered this after a wipe out.

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But both are just as important.  Just because I can no longer group the speakers post-S1, it seems reasonable to assume I'd still want to listen to the same things I used to when in the room the speaker is in.

It just seems bizarre to me that it needs a reset when it is already running the new S1 software and it couldn't have been split properly and kept ruining as it is now (new App/household, whatever..)

The assumption is that users will want to move forward with S2, but they can if they want split off any S1-only units and set up a fresh system for those.

There’s nothing to stop a user doing it the other way round: manually factory reset a few S2-compatible units, make a new system of those, and update it to S2. 

Either way, a clean new system gets created, empty of playlists, service accounts, etc. It’s a question of which system is more important in terms of the retention of playlists etc.

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And yes, it's local Sonos Playlists (the ones we have no proper way of backing up) that are lost.

 

… It would have been simpler to be able to move compatible speakers to S2, without affecting what remains behind as S1, for sure.

PS: and do people get warned of this, or does it pop up after the event as a nasty surprise? And does this occur even if the entire system is compatible with S2 and is being moved there?

I'm pretty sure that what what most were reasonable expecting.  Because it was all so secretive and Sonos didn't release the process until yesterday we didn't know how it was going to work.  In the many pages on the site there is mention of settings being lost - I'm not sure of how the warnings are worded when doing the process as I have not done it as I want to keep using my S1 speaker as I did beforehand.

It just seems bizarre to me that it needs a reset when it is already running the new S1 software and it couldn't have been split properly and kept ruining as it is now (new App/household, whatever..)

Hi. I’m just wondering if I can update 2 of my S2 compatible speakers (Play 1’s) to S2 for use in a bedroom and keep my 2 Play 3’s on S1 to group with with my 2 gen 1 Play 5’s in a bigger room?

 Although it’s moot because I’m not going to do it, I don’t think I successfully communicated my point of concern, which was that the product removal tool only provides the option to remove incompatible products to be reserved for S1, with the remaining 4 compatible speakers going to S2. What I was considering was keeping  2 of the compatible speakers in S1 with the Gen 1 Play 5’s, and moving the other 2 to S2.   But there doesn’t seem to be a way to do that.

Or am I missing something?                                                         

The removal tools just resets the legacy players to factory settings. There’s nothing to stop you doing a manual factory reset on some S2-compatible players in addition. Do this before updating them to S2.

You can then set them all up together as a separate S1 system.

 

And yes, it's local Sonos Playlists (the ones we have no proper way of backing up) that are lost.

 

For various reasons my mixed system will remain in unified S1 mode forever, but if I did want to split, the above issue would be another deterrent, given my extensive Sonos playlists curated over the years. It would have been simpler to be able to move compatible speakers to S2, without affecting what remains behind as S1, for sure.

PS: and do people get warned of this, or does it pop up after the event as a nasty surprise? And does this occur even if the entire system is compatible with S2 and is being moved there?

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It does indeed seem as if the main change has been an interface designed by the brand police of the marketing department.

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Hi. I’m just wondering if I can update 2 of my S2 compatible speakers (Play 1’s) to S2 for use in a bedroom and keep my 2 Play 3’s on S1 to group with with my 2 gen 1 Play 5’s in a bigger room?

 Although it’s moot because I’m not going to do it, I don’t think I successfully communicated my point of concern, which was that the product removal tool only provides the option to remove incompatible products to be reserved for S1, with the remaining 4 compatible speakers going to S2. What I was considering was keeping  2 of the compatible speakers in S1 with the Gen 1 Play 5’s, and moving the other 2 to S2.   But there doesn’t seem to be a way to do that.

Or am I missing something?