Era 300 vs Five | Sonos Community

BOL74 · 2024-01-23T20:09:46+00:00

Hello To All Of You I’m planning to get The Era 300 soon for my Arc&dual Gen 3’s home cinema-system…as surrounds. I got the Beam Gen 2,Era 100&Sub Mini in my bedroom and i have the opertunety to purcase two pair of surrounds…BUT…i never heard a pair of Five’s play(or the Era 300). So i ask a simple question here. Do i leave my Beam-system as is and add a pair of Five’s in front to use for music or do i purcase two pairs of Era 300 and replace the two pairs of Era 100 in my Arc&Beam-surrounds?. For the Beam-system i only use it for Youtube…so not much of movies.What does the audience(you guys’n girls) think? Thanx….

Userlevel 7

HI

@BOL74

First I’m going to describe my setup in my Main Media Room, next in my Master Bedroom and finally in a Guest Bedroom.

Main Media Room (Video)

LG 65 inch TV
Arc plus Sub x 2 and Era 300 surrounds
ATV 4K
Panasonic Ultra HD Disc player

Main Media Room (Music)

Five x 2 with Sub (Music Streaming)
Project Debut Turntable (Sonos Edition) > Cambridge Pre-amp > Sonos Amp > Definitive D3 Speakers (Vinyl)

Master Bedroom (Video & Music) *

LG 55 inch TV
Arc plus Sub and Era 300 surrounds
ATV 4K
Sony Ultra HD Disc player

Guest Bedroom (Video & Music) *

Sony Bravia 46 inch TV (circa 2014)
Beam 2 plus Sub-Mini and Era 100 surrounds
ATV 4K

* Music is listed only because it’s possible when and if desired. At the end of the day video is the primary use.

The reason I provided the above information is to illustrate the versatility of Sonos. As you can see the Main Media room has multiple Sonos sub-rooms located in the same area; each with a specific purpose. The other rooms while primarily for video can also be used for music.

Sonos’ versatility is its Achilles Heel in that it's assumed one can do whatever they want (as a configuration) and still expect Sonos to perform as intended. Not True!!

Ask yourself...would Sonos not market setting additional speakers upfront left and right of an Arc, Beam2 or Ray (if it were doable) to enhance the listening experience? I believe you are an intelligent person and the answer is therefore obvious.

The videos espousing non-conventional Sonos setups for Home Theater (HT) are IMO hacks and rubbish. On second thought remove the “IMO” from the previous sentence as I believe others will agree that the videos are hacks and rubbish.

The human ear is a complex listening organ. Sonos HT setups reproduce the soundtrack of a movie as close to what the sound engineer intended using a single box that contains left, center and right channels. Now with the Arc and Beam2 reflected side channels for both and height channels with the Arc. Nothing less and most certainly not more (i.e. adding additional front left and right speakers).

However, if you want to spend your money on a Charlatan’s alchemy video (for Sonos HT) then by all means do so. On the other hand if you’d like keep your hard earned money for more practical use(s); then take mine and the advice of others in this thread. Stick with the intended setup for Sonos HT.

Final notes regarding the shape of your room.

If you have (or have access to) an iOS device you can use Trueplay to adjust the sound to your environment. Also know that Trueplay is not a silver bullet. In some rare cases it can make the sound worst.
Also, having dual subs does not necessarily improve the low-end. Placement of a single sub and/or dual subs is critical. I would start with a single sub in various spots to determine the best location. Trueplay to determine if it helps. When you are satisfied introduce the second sub placing it in different locations to determine if it improves the overall low-end or not. A second sub in some instances can make the room too boomy.

Note: You can Trueplay each sub during the above process

Oh please stop believing that stupid video that places Era 300’s as “fronts” in a Sonos home theater! Those “fronts” are not fronts at all. They are grouped, and as such they will play all channels - fronts, center, surrounds and Atmos heights - as a stereo downmix. So the front left/center/right channels and any surround or Atmos effects are repeated in the “front” Era 300s as stereo only. This adds nothing, it merely muddies up the original intent of the sound mix. The front is spread out and dispersed, the directional surround effects are ruined, and any Atmos effects are now coming from in front of you instead of above.

In short, it’s sonic mess, and that’s not even counting the echo from the delay, never mind the fact you are paying a premium for two Atmos capable speakers that aren’t even playing Atmos.

This is my home cinema-room so you can get an idea of how it looks like. Pay attention that it is deep-windows in the sealing on both sides. Both Gen 3’s are placed in the corner of the sofa.

What does the shape of your room have to do with using the correct number of speakers as they were designed?

Userlevel 7

+16

Schlumpf
Prodigy I
784 replies
3 months ago
26 January 2024

I’m going to have to make an effort to find and listen to some Atmos music.

I’m a big Play 5 / Five fan but the 300s do open up something I’ve not really considered.

I find it interesting to compare stereo and atmos music. For me it’s like with food… different tastes like italian or asian food but both can be great. 😉

Stereo still is my favorite but sometimes it’s a great change to listen to atmos music. But the quality of atmos tracks imho differs a lot. Some tracks sound horrible and others are such a pleasure.

#jgatie

Good evening to you too…

So…what are your suggestion for me when i’m not happy with my setup(just missing the Era300’s surround) and to be honest i dubt it will “make me happy”…so you suggest i build a new room in my one year old house? Yeah,you know the anserw to that: Not Honna Happen‼️ Or you suggest i go for two pairs of round in cealing Sonance+ Sonos Amp? Or you suggest i go for another brand?

I don’t know how you came to any of those conclusions based on what @jgatie stated. Simply put, grouping in a stereo pair in the front of your home theatre space isn’t going to be an improvement to the audio quality.

I might have a thing in my head of how sound should be and what to expect.

Sure. And there’s nothing wrong with wanting more for your home theatre, specifically a wider stage from the front speakers, but Sonos simply doesn’t offer that currently. Well, they do if you use an Amp up front, but you lose atmost capablity. The point is that ‘forcing’ extra speakers in the front isn’t a solution.

Like i’m now just purcased a nib Ikea Symfonisk Lamp Gen2 and need to buy a brand new one down the way to replace the Era 100’s in my bedroom-setup. Good idea…probobly not,but there is a lack of placement for a tablelamp AND the Era100’s as for now they are on top of eachother. Soulution would be a kit of Sonos Stands for $300 and that’s basicly the price of 1 ½ Ikea Lamp’s. The Era 100 sounds great,but it’s not ideal placement as for now. If only Sonos could sell the top-piece for their stands to switch between the 100’ & 300’s it could make life a bit easier.

There are bit more difference in the physical design of the ikea lamp and the Era speakers that plopping a lamp on top. Especially considering the upfiring speakers on the 300s, which would obviously not work as well with a lamp shade mounted on top. Instead, I wouldn’t be too surprised if the next gen ikea lamp has dual woofers like the Era 100s. Perhaps bluetooth and aux in as well.

Thanx for reading my “things” anyway….

PS: looking forward to see what Daniel(N.E.T.) coming up for in is next videoes…cause i will watch them🙃

Nothing wrong with a little creativity, but I wouldn’t kid yourself into thinking that more is always better, and every idea is a good one.

#jgatie

I’m not a rocket-scientist but i do belive the Atmos effect got something to do with how the room is shaped and how it reflect back…don’t you agree. So what i’m thinking that this is a big part of my problem why i’m not “happy” with the performance…and that is for the Gen3’s as well.

That’s why i wonder if i should try add that Era 300’s stereopair up front that it might solve something rather as some of the communety say it will just create a mess. This setup is btw not happy with music. For that i prefere the bedroom with Beam Gen2/Era100/Sub Mini and soon either Era 300’s or Five’s.

Once again, there will be zero Atmos effects from Era 300s grouped as Fronts. None at all. They will play in stereo and stereo only. The Atmos upfiring channels will be completely silent. This was proven by another poster who believed the nonsense in that silly video, until we challenged them to try a video of Atmos test tones. To their surprise, every channel, front left/right, center, surrounds and Atmos, all came out of the front drivers of the 300s. The other drivers, including the upfiring Atmos drivers, were silent. The youtube video was wrong, the "front" Era 300s "effect" was purely a placebo.

See this thread from this point on:

If you do like the video you watched and add Era 300s grouped with your Arc as front speakers, they will add zero, zilch, nothing, nada to the Atmos effects. Matter of fact, the only thing they can do to the Atmos effects is ruin them by taking the Atmos channels which are supposed to bounce off the ceiling as height channels and mixing them into the fronts (along with all surround and front channels) which are aimed straight ahead. That's just not how a surround sound track is meant to be heard no matter what a silly video says.

IMO is In My Opinion.

Userlevel 7

Hi @BOL74

Here’s your answer to IMO and another...IMHO

IMO = In My Opinion
IMHO = In My Humble/Honest Opinion

Per Sonos marketing (and I agree; as I have a stereo pair of both) the Five’s are still the choice for traditional Hi-Fi Stereo listening (Click here).

Userlevel 7

+16

Schlumpf
Prodigy I
784 replies
3 months ago
25 January 2024

@BOL74

And to answer your last question… YES, you are loosing the strictly channel separation of any (not just Atmos) multichannel setup, because (as explained before) a grouped stereo setup in the front includes ALL channel information of the multichannel signal in a downmix. As a result you would hear rear channel information from the rear speakers but also as part of the stereo downmix in the front. Same with the center channel… from the middle out of the center speaker as part of the soundbar and also as part of the stereo downmix from the left and right.

Userlevel 7

@BOL74

To say that the Five’s are waaaaay better than the Era 300’s for music is a stretch that can only be qualified by the listener. If you want to be convinced (one way or the other) I suggest you visit a retailer that sells both products and listen for yourself.

I’m done here as I can’t continue this back and forth to try and help/advise someone that appears to want answers bent to their pre-conceived notions/perspective. Good luck and I wish you well in your quest to achieve the Sonos setup that meets your expectations.

Cheers!

@BOL74

To say that the Five’s are waaaaay better than the Era 300’s for music is a stretch that can only be qualified by the listener. If you want to be convinced (one way or the other) I suggest you visit a retailer that sells both products and listen for yourself.

I’m done here as I can’t continue this back and forth to try and help/advise someone that appears to want answers bent to their pre-conceived notions/perspective. Good luck and I wish you well in your quest to achieve the Sonos setup that meets your expectations.

Cheers!

It’s going off into the weeds a bit, but I think, but the question of what’s better for music sources got more complicated with atmos music factored in. For stereo sources, Fives are definitely better, but that gap is closed if you are in a smaller room and/or add in a sub or mini sub.

The Fives don’t do atmos music though, so for atmos sources, era 300s are better. obviously. Another drawback is when you group rooms for music. If you group a room of Fives with an room with Arc (or Beam G2, or 300s) for music sources, every room will play stereo only. the lowest common denominator wins in this case, pretty much by necessity as stereo and atmos tracks are typically completely different tracks. If you group a room of 300s with a room with Arc, then you get atmos music in both rooms.

That said, if you are thinking of putting 2 Sonos rooms in the same physical room, one for music sources, and one for TV sources, using Era 300s for the music rooms doesn’t make any sense, IMO. An Arc + surrounds is a better atmos music player than a pair of Era 300s at this point, mostly due to the additional surrounds. It makes more sense to use Fives just for stereo music sources in that physical room, or when you intend to group with other rooms in the house that are only stereo capable (because Fives sounds better for stereo than Arc).

Yes, it gets complicated now with so many different options with different capabilities. I’d say one of the biggest gaps in what Sonos offers right now is the ability to have an atmos capable home theatre with separate front left and right speakers, so that you get the best experience for atmos and stereo sources.

As well, I think I’d like to see Sonos allow grouping of stereo and atmos capable rooms with each playing at their highest level. I say ‘think’ because I’m not sure I’d want to get a downgraded mix of stereo rather than original recording of stereo. Ideally, a music source track would contain both stereo and atmos versions that can be played together in sync...but I don’t know that even that would make sense as it would add a restriction and complication in the production of these tracks...for what is ultimately a minimal requirement.

#melvimbe

About my setup in my bedroom i think perhaps you misunderstand…Right now i had to put the Era100 on top of a lamp in order to have the speaker a little higher. But this is why i’m gonna replace this with the Ikea Symfonisk Lamp Gen2…i’ll let you see in a picture.

Or i could use $300+ for Sonos Orginal Stands and place them in each corner(the Era100)

FYI, in these forums @BOL74 will flag a specific user, and notify them that they have been reference them in a post, if they have notifications turned on (I don’t).

Yea, I don’t think the picture really changes anything. You can’t just add a lamp module/feature to the top of Era 100s and 300s without changing the physical design, and features, of these products. The symfonisk lamps relocated the hard button controls to the bottom, rather than top, and lose the mic. Then there is a difference in woofers/tweeters in the device. I would not be too surprised if a gen 3 of the ikea lamp comes out this year with the dual woofers like Era 100 has, and possibly a mic for voice control, etc.

Regardless, I understand why you’re wanting to switch to the lamps. They are a good option to save space.

I’m going to have to make an effort to find and listen to some Atmos music.

I’m a big Play 5 / Five fan but the 300s do open up something I’ve not really considered.

I find it interesting to compare stereo and atmos music. For me it’s like with food… different tastes like italian or asian food but both can be great. 😉

Stereo still is my favorite but sometimes it’s a great change to listen to atmos music. But the quality of atmos tracks imho differs a lot. Some tracks sound horrible and others are such a pleasure.

It might be a decent analogy to compare stereo/atmos similar to comparing studio recording/live recording? I don’t know. I tend to like atmos and not like live recordings, so...I don’t know what that says. Also worth noting that atmos music, IMO, requires a distinct listening position more than stereo.

#jgatie

Good evening to you too…

So…what are your suggestion for me when i’m not happy with my setup(just missing the Era300’s surround) and to be honest i dubt it will “make me happy”…so you suggest i build a new room in my one year old house? Yeah,you know the anserw to that: Not Honna Happen‼️ Or you suggest i go for two pairs of round in cealing Sonance+ Sonos Amp? Or you suggest i go for another brand?

I might have a thing in my head of how sound should be and what to expect.

Like i’m now just purcased a nib Ikea Symfonisk Lamp Gen2 and need to buy a brand new one down the way to replace the Era 100’s in my bedroom-setup. Good idea…probobly not,but there is a lack of placement for a tablelamp AND the Era100’s as for now they are on top of eachother. Soulution would be a kit of Sonos Stands for $300 and that’s basicly the price of 1 ½ Ikea Lamp’s. The Era 100 sounds great,but it’s not ideal placement as for now. If only Sonos could sell the top-piece for their stands to switch between the 100’ & 300’s it could make life a bit easier.

Thanx for reading my “things” anyway….

PS: looking forward to see what Daniel(N.E.T.) coming up for in is next videoes…cause i will watch them🙃

Use the Era 300’s as rear surrounds, as designed. Use the Arc as the front left/center/right, as designed. Add a Sub, Subs, or Sub-Mini as needed. Then put any other speakers you have left over in another room, as designed.

If you aren’t happy with that? Well then realize all soundbars are a compromise. You either put up with the compromise in favor of the convenience of less space used, less wires, more streamlined look, etc. or you get a fully wired separates/receiver based Home Theater. What you don’t do is expect a soundbar to be what it is not, like a center speaker for separate left/right fronts.

As to that video, watch whatever you wish. If you don’t mind misinformation and incorrect facts, all the more power to you.

#jgatie

I’m not a rocket-scientist but i do belive the Atmos effect got something to do with how the room is shaped and how it reflect back…don’t you agree. So what i’m thinking that this is a big part of my problem why i’m not “happy” with the performance…and that is for the Gen3’s as well.

That’s why i wonder if i should try add that Era 300’s stereopair up front that it might solve something rather as some of the communety say it will just create a mess. This setup is btw not happy with music. For that i prefere the bedroom with Beam Gen2/Era100/Sub Mini and soon either Era 300’s or Five’s.

No, adding a stereo pair will not fix the “I’m not happy” problem. You are correct that the ceiling shape, and lack of full side walls, are not good for bouncing audio off of. I don’t know that I would bother with atmos at all for that room. Regardless, throwing 2 stereo channels at the front doesn’t fix that.

Have you done trueplay tuning on the room?

As far as Gen 3s (I assume you are referring to the sub), you may want to try moving one of them to the front of the room.

Userlevel 7

+16

Schlumpf
Prodigy I
784 replies
3 months ago
24 January 2024

@BOL74

As your idea seems already to be manifested in your mind, I think you will try this anyway. 😉

Just be aware of the loose of real channel separation, but if it sounds satisfying to your ears in the end, that’s ok.
Otherwise you have tested it and can open your mind for other alternatives. 😎

Userlevel 7

+16

Schlumpf
Prodigy I
784 replies
3 months ago
25 January 2024

Imo or imho = in my opinion or in my humble/honest opinion

Userlevel 7

@melvimbe

Thanks a lot for pulling my post to start your novella.😊Can’t catch a break in this community. 😂😂😂

@melvimbe

Thanks a lot for pulling my post to start your novella.😊Can’t catch a break in this community. 😂😂😂

It was personal. /s

Userlevel 7

@melvimbe

Thanks a lot for pulling my post to start your novella.😊Can’t catch a break in this community. 😂😂😂

It was personal. /s

Hadn’t seen “/s” used in a millennia…how old are you? However the fact that remember it dates me also 😂😂😂

Userlevel 7

+22

Stanley_4
Lead Maestro
9127 replies
3 months ago
26 January 2024

I’m going to have to make an effort to find and listen to some Atmos music.

I’m a big Play 5 / Five fan but the 300s do open up something I’ve not really considered.

Userlevel 2

+7

BOL74
Author
Avid Contributor I
106 replies
3 months ago
26 January 2024

Hi folks….

Been a little buizy lately work on my grannys car change parts for an EU-control(MOT i belive it’s called in USA/England)…anyway.

Today i placed the order for……a pair of Era300 and a pair of Five. I did allso came across the Sonos orginal stads for the Era300 and i manage to get a pair of Flexson stands for the Five’s but one in seperate stores…let’s hope they’re the same.

I will probobly have the Five’s in my bedroom cause it’s the place i normally listen to music.

So i’m expecting my speakers next week i guess…and yes i ordered directly from Sonos. They are remarkable FAST in shipping.

Have a Great Weekend🙏

Userlevel 7

+16

Schlumpf
Prodigy I
784 replies
3 months ago
26 January 2024

@melvimbe

Of course you need need the optimized listening position for atmos music. And maybe even more as for stereo. But with home theater sound it‘s the same. More audio channels mean the need of a position where they meet each other. 😉

Btw I totally agree… live recordings don’t „touch“ me. But a live concert really does. 😎

Userlevel 2

+7

BOL74
Author
Avid Contributor I
106 replies
3 months ago
31 January 2024

Hello y’all👌

Today i got my package with the Era 300&the Five.

I only recive one Flexson-stand for the Five so i placed them in front becide the TV in my Home Cinema-setup in my livingroom upstairs. One on stand,one on a table.

I was not impressed by the sound. Both where placed horizontal(buttons on top).

Then i moved them to put them in the place i intended to have them…in my master-bedroom becide the TV. This time i place them on the TV-furniture in a vertical position with the buttons out to the side. The room is much smaller than the livingroom,but got those dropping sealing.

Here i really enjoy them. They play really well,but i did not crank up the volume since i assume they need time to break in(?) I don’t know what to do with the Flexson stands,cause honestly i think they become “too big” to be in my livingroom becide the TV. And probobly will be an issue with my Roborock Q7 robotvacuum-cleaner. Need to think bout it for a while.

The Era 300’s i set them up as surround in my livingroom(Arc/Dual Gen3). I had not so much time watch a movie so i need to listen a bit more. And my Sonos org.stands for them has not arrived yet. But i did watch a trailer(The Falcon and the winter solider) and i experience a bit of Atmos-effect.
Well,i will keep you updated…

Be Well🤜

Userlevel 7

+16

Schlumpf
Prodigy I
784 replies
3 months ago
23 January 2024

@BOL74

For your home cinema Sonos Arc system the pair of Era300 is a great choice and will bring it to its best.
But for your Beam2 Setup imho the Era300 pair would be an overkill if you don’t use Atmos there at all. So if music is more important to you for this room, I strongly recommend the pair of Sonos Five. They are an amazing stereo setup. 😎

Also as a stereo setup they will offer you two analogue inputs as an option to connect devices like a phono or something else.

Sign up

Login to the community

Scanning file for viruses.

This file cannot be downloaded