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We announced yesterday that some of our oldest Sonos products will be moving into a legacy mode in May of 2020. Our commitment is to support products with regular software updates for a minimum of five years after we stop selling them, and we have a track record of supporting products far longer. 

Here is some public information we’ve shared, gathered into one place to respond to some of your questions in one easy thread, so that people can find the correct information easily.

Beginning in May, software updates and new features from Sonos will only be delivered to systems with only modern products.

After May, systems that include legacy products will continue to work as before - but they will no longer receive software updates or new features. 

Sonos will work to maintain the existing experience and conduct bug fixes, but our efforts will ultimately be limited by the lack of memory and processing power of these legacy products.

We don’t expect any immediate impact to your experience, but access to services and overall functionality will eventually be disrupted, particularly as partners evolve their own services and features. 

 

Customers with both legacy and modern products have time to decide what option is best for them. You can continue to use your whole system in legacy mode - in this case, it will stop receiving updates and new features. 

You will also be able to separate your legacy products from your modern products, so that the modern products can still receive updates and new features, and legacy products can still be used separately. We’ll have more information on how to do this in May when you can take that action.

Another option available to all customers with legacy products is to take advantage of the Trade Up program, which allows you to upgrade older Sonos products to modern ones with a 30% discount. Trade Up will be open to customers at any time should they decide to upgrade. 

We recognize this is new for Sonos owners, just as it is for Sonos. We are committed to help you by making options available to you to support the best decision for your home.
 

If you have any further questions, please don’t hesitate with asking.

Update 2/22: A message from our CEO

We heard you. We did not get this right from the start. My apologies for that and I wanted to personally assure you of the path forward:

First, rest assured that come May, when we end new software updates for our legacy products, they will continue to work as they do today. We are not bricking them, we are not forcing them into obsolescence, and we are not taking anything away. Many of you have invested heavily in your Sonos systems, and we intend to honor that investment for as long as possible. While legacy Sonos products won’t get new software features, we pledge to keep them updated with bug fixes and security patches for as long as possible. If we run into something core to the experience that can’t be addressed, we’ll work to offer an alternative solution and let you know about any changes you’ll see in your experience.

Secondly, we heard you on the issue of legacy products and modern products not being able to coexist in your home. We are working on a way to split your system so that modern products work together and get the latest features, while legacy products work together and remain in their current state. We’re finalizing details on this plan and will share more in the coming weeks.

While we have a lot of great products and features in the pipeline, we want our customers to upgrade to our latest and greatest products when they’re excited by what the new products offer, not because they feel forced to do so. That’s the intent of the trade up program we launched for our loyal customers.

Thank you for being a Sonos customer. Thank you for taking the time to give us your feedback. I hope that you’ll forgive our misstep, and let us earn back your trust. Without you, Sonos wouldn’t exist and we’ll work harder than ever to earn your loyalty every single day.

If you have any further questions please don’t hesitate to contact us.

 

Patrick Spence
CEO, Sonos

These speakers work perfectly.  A local issue that you could resolve fairly easily if you tried rather than rant on here.

I have tried for 3 days to work around this problem, and it isn’t the first time it has happened. I even had Bestbuy Geek Squad out. They couldn’t figure it out either, other than to say the new App isn’t compatible. So, think before you try to make someone look bad.


OK. I apologise for that. But the Best Buy Geek squad are talking rubbish.  Are you willing to give it another  half an hour?


The first point to note is that your speakers are not 'legacy' but are still fully supported.


OK. I apologise for that. But the Best Buy Geek squad are talking rubbish.  Are you willing to give it another  half an hour?

I appreciate your apology.  I am 67 years old and not at all tech savy, but when the Geek Squad couldn’t even find the problem, I lost it. These speakers, as you know, weren’t cheap. Just a senior-citizen who wanted to enjoy Christmas music. Lord knows there hasn’t been much to enjoy of this year.


I am happy to try to help. Let's give it a go. What is the current situation? Are you currently using the S1 or S2 Sonos system and app?


I am happy to try to help. Let's give it a go. What is the current situation? Are you currently using the S1 or S2 Sonos system and app?

You are very kind.  The S2, but it isn’t able to locate my speakers. Even on the rare few minutes that it located them earlier today, it showed that music was playing, but no music was coming out. No, my mute wasn’t on. The Geek Squad did a reset, and that seemed to work for a while, but after about 10 minutes, the speakers lost connection again.


If you mean the little bars going up and down was an indication that music was playing  it doesn't indicate that 

Do you know what they reset? Just the app or also the speakers?

If necessary, do you have an Ethernet cable that would allow you to wire one of your speakers to your router?

Do you have the S1 controller installed as well as the S2?

Sorry for all the questions. 


No problem with all the questions. I don’t have an ethernet cable. The router is a Nighthawk. I can’t reach it because it is setting on top of a large bookcase in my husband’s library. He isn’t home to help. I appreciate you trying to help, but as I said, I’m not at all tech savvy, so I will let you get back to your evening. Thank you for trying.


OK I have to respect that.  I have to say that 'Best Buy' and 'Sonos expertise ' are not concepts that sit well with each other.

Your speakers are still fully supported and capable of functioning perfectly.  I would urge you to call Sonos Support for help.

The transition from 'old Sonos' to S1/S2 has not gone smoothly for some users but is resolvable

I am sure it must be very frustrating. 

If you haven't tried it already, try powering off the router and your Sonos speakers. Then power the router fully on, then power up the speakers. 

Good luck. 


Thanks again for trying to help me. One quick question before I sign off. You asked if I have S1 or S2.  I only have S2. Am I supposed to have both apps.


No. I was wondering about just making absolutely sure you weren't still on S1 but it doesn't seem like you are. 


If you haven't at any stage powered off the router and Sonos you should try that. If you can reach the router!


I will try that tomorrow. Thanks again for your kindness. Have a wonderful evening.


If you haven't at any stage powered off the router and Sonos you should try that. If you can reach the router!

John, just wanted to let you know that DH restarted the router this morning. First we unplugged all the speakers, then restarted the router. Once the router was back up, we went around and plugged the speakers in and let them come back online one by one.  My Christmas music is playing as I write this. Thanks again for your help last night. Have yourself a very Merry Christmas or whatever holiday you celebrate. 


I am delighted all is well again. You were very poorly served by the Best Buy Geek Squad and their lazy and incompetent advice.  The symptoms simply did not fit their diagnosis. 

The problem was in the way your router was identifying and communicating with the Sonos speakers.  A fresh start was all that was needed.

Anyway all's well that ends well. Happy Christmas. 


John B, may I commend you for your patience, calm and helpfullness towards ToniD, it is a pleasure to see.


Not that this will do me any good other than expressing myself, but I am really steamed about the S1/S2 situation.  I live in a large, 3-story post-Civil War victorian house in which wiring was not an option.  I’ve been a Sonos  customer for over 10 years, expanding my system over time to function throughout the house, inside and outside. I had to build this system incrementally over time because  Sonos products are not cheap and in most areas, but not all, it was used with receivers and multi-channel speaker systems.  I used Sonos speakers outdoors and in a couple of other places where a complete system was not appropriate.

We recently expanded the house to add a family type room off of the kitchen and I wanted to get a Sonos sound bar and satellite speakers for that space.  Coincidentally, I opened the controller on one of my computers and got the messages about the new controller software.  Unfortunately, it informed me that ALL 17 of my Sonos devices are incompatible….

I don’t mind using two different controllers, but I REALLY mind not being able to play the same music in that room as in all the others.  To me, that is inexcusable and unbelievably inconsiderate of Sonos. Having been in the software development business no one can convince me that Sonos could not have found a way to incorporate at least a minimal capacity to play content from an S1 or S2 device on the others.

There are multiple ways Sonos could have done it--and still could--including a modification of existing units, an add-on device or dongle for one or both of the S1 and S2 products, a firmware upgrade to one or the other, etc.  Any of those would be substantially less expensive.  I would be happy to pay something to make that happen, but certainly not 70% of the retail cost for an entire new system.  

The fact that they have not done any of those, and made no effort to do so in the initial design of the new products or in response to the outcry from customers, makes it clear this is nothing more than a very ugly effort to boost sales by victimizing the loyal customers who made a major commitment to this company.

Shame on you, Sonos.


kennybroh,

17 old Sonos devices on S1 - that’s amazing. That appears to demonstrate just how long these Sonos devices can last, I guess, and still they keep going, eh 🤔?

I don’t see why you don’t choose to add one of these HT devices to the new room:

  • Sonos Amp
  • Sonos Playbar
  • Sonos PlayBase 
  • Sonos Beam

They are all S1 compatible and still available for sale perhaps ‘new’ and/or ‘used’ if you shop around - Judging by your other 17 devices, whichever one you choose, it’s likely to last you many many years, from the perceived longevity of your existing Sonos products. It appears your music sources can still play together happily ever after, so that sounds like a very good option to me.


Ken--

FYI, of the 17 devices listed in my system, 3 or 4 are no longer used--a few docks and a hand-held controller.  But the rest are used regularly for casual music listening.  For serious listening or theatre we also have high-quality receivers and speakers.  

Thanks for your suggestions.  I thought of some of them already but don’t think they solve the problem.   Maybe you or others can think of something that will work, but first I need to subject you to a long description of the physical constraints.

The catalyst for all of this was the addition of a new room extending the side of the house adjacent to the kitchen and sitting area in front of a fireplace.  We tore out the walls and large windows on either side of the fireplace, leaving a free-standing fireplace/ chimney, opening to the new room on either side.  The plan was to mount a large flat screen on the exposed brick on the back of the chimney which used to be part of the exterior wall.  I am a surround sound addict and the question was what to use for a sound system.  

We didn’t want a cabinet, shelf or any other furniture above or below the TV and my AV guy highly recommended a Yamaha YSP-5600 soundbar with wireless sub-woofer.  He said it created as good a surround sound environment as my multi-speaker setups. That was ideal because it eliminated the need for a receiver or any extensive wiring.    

We needed to accommodate smaller items like the cable box, AppleTV, network switch etc., so we mounted the TV on an arm and removed several courses of brick behind it creating a recessed area to conceal those components. We ran power and network cables up the sides of the chimney in small floor-to ceiling wooden channels and ran the wires through holes drilled in the side of the chimney to the space behind the TV.  The arm folds into the open space so the TV appears to be flush-mounted on the wall, but can be extended if needed.

My standards for speakers are different from my AV installer and a soundbar would not ordinarily be something I would think I’d want. He’s far more current on products than I, however, and the Yamaha is a pretty fancy piece of gear.  Many of my friends said they love their soundbars so I figured it would be fine in this room.  The lack of integration with Sonos was a factor but there’s a 6.1 system in the kitchen so I didn’t think it was a major issue.  I was wrong on both counts.

As highly rated (and expensive) as the Yamaha may be, for me it simply doesn’t come close to providing the detail and spacial image of a multi-speaker system.  I’m getting a little older too, so clarity--especially dialog--is more of a factor than it was.  Without raising the volume, voice enhancing capability in a soundbar doesn’t cut it for me and I’ve seen lots of people say the same thing.

At this point I need to be very clear:  all of this is a rarified first-world problem which I dearly hope is the worst thing that ever happens to me. Iin light of what’s going on in the rest of the world I feel a little stupid even talking about it, but this room transformed where we congregate in our house and we spend a lot of time together watching and listening to things to a much greater extent than ever before.  If something is a constant irritant you either have to do something about it or shut up.  As you can probably tell, I’m not a shut up kind of guy.

Timing is everything. We bought the Yamaha shortly before an upgraded model was released supporting MusicCast wireless surround speakers. If this unit had that capability I’m sure that would have been the end of it but it doesn’t.  As an experiment I tried a low latency bluetooth speaker but it was too kludgy.  I’ve gone to great lengths to synchronize picture and sound between the adjoining spaces and introducing another element inevitably causes lag somewhere.

So, after 2 ½ years I finally decided to ditch the Yamaha and replace it with a soundbar supporting wireless surround speakers.  If I were to do that, it only made sense to use a Sonos product and integrate with everything else.  The Arc was the obvious choice.  

I haven’t added Sonos gear for a while so I wasn’t aware of the issues about S1/S2 and older products until I was about to order the Arc and discovered it couldn’t co-exist with my other units and my entire system was on a  path to extinction.  That set off the rant you saw above.  Admittedly, I may have been a little harsh, but I’m far from alone in expressing those complaints and I felt justified saying what I did.  

Nevertheless, with all that background, here’s where I am: 

  • Can’t use an Amp.  No place to put it and running wires to or from somewhere else is not practical at this point.  I presume the Amp would drive a non-wireless soundbar so I’d still need to solve the surround problem, perhaps with another Amp, but I’m not sure what I’d do about a sub-woofer.  
  • Can’t use a PlayBase because it’s not designed to be wall mounted and there’s no place to put it.  
  • The Beam is primarily for smaller rooms--which this is not--and I can’t imagine it sounds as good as the Yamaha which costs 4 times as much.  Also, I’ve seen quite a bit of discussion about sync issues with LG TVs, which is what I have, and that’s an issue I’ve spent hours overcoming as it is.
  • A PlayBar is the only possible contender, but it’s a 7-8 year-old product, costing almost as much as the Arc, lacking many capabilities commonplace in virtually every current product on the market, including those costing far less. It’s one thing to deal with issues about components I already own, but if I’ve learned anything from this episode, it’s don’t buy a discontinued product.   

I’ve been wracking my brain to come up with a solution. One idea is to integrate a small Sonos device between the HDMI source and the soundbar--like a Connect but with a digital line-in capability. Is there a comparable S1 device with digital line-in?  

Otherwise, I’m out of ideas, and it does continue to irk me that I’ve hit a wall with expansion of a system in which I’ve invested so much time, money and energy. I still firmly believe the company could have figured out a solution if they really wanted to, and still can. They could almost certainly produce a small adapter for legacy products allowing them to communicate with the S2 controller.   

But what do I know?


I’ve been wracking my brain to come up with a solution. One idea is to integrate a small Sonos device between the HDMI source and the soundbar--like a Connect but with a digital line-in capability. Is there a comparable S1 device with digital line-in?  

Otherwise, I’m out of ideas, and it does continue to irk me that I’ve hit a wall with expansion of a system in which I’ve invested so much time, money and energy. I still firmly believe the company could have figured out a solution if they really wanted to, and still can. They could almost certainly produce a small adapter for legacy products allowing them to communicate with the S2 controller.   

But what do I know?

I’m mostly ‘S2’ with my home setup now, but I still have a separate small S1 Household and I can play to both, because the Arc is Airplay capable. So I have just put a Sonos One SL in my S1 setup, as that too incorporates Airplay. Airplay is not bothered about the S1/S2 Household separation, so I can ‘group’ and still play across both systems as they are on the same subnet - so that’s helped me, but my S1 setup is quite considerably smaller than yours. 


So you are grouping and playing all devices with Airplay and don’t use either Sonos controller?

And what do you think of the Arc?  Do you have surrounds?

So I just looked at some of the new products.  Are you suggesting I could do a line-in to a Port from my existing soundbar and group 2 Sonos One SLs as the surrounds via AirPlay?  And conversely I could send the digital out to a different input on the soundbar to play whatever is streaming elsewhere?


If you use Airplay you aren't using the Sonos system, just a collection of Airplay compatible speakers.

The Sonos app is a remote control not a music player.  It is completely impossible to use the Sonos app for Airplay. 


I understand that, but the implication from Ken_Griffiths was I could use Airplay to run my entire Sonos system, both S1 and S2 devices if I incorporated a Sonos Play One SL with the S1 devices.


I understand that, but the implication from Ken_Griffiths was I could use Airplay to run my entire Sonos system, both S1 and S2 devices if I incorporated a Sonos Play One SL with the S1 devices.

You can use any Airplay enabled App to play to a Sonos compatible product - those products can be in an S1/S2 Household and they can be grouped with any other Sonos devices.

Airplay sees the devices ‘per subnet’, rather than ‘per Household’ - so you could, just as an example, play music from the Spotify App (using Airplay) to say the Sonos Arc in the S2 Household and play the same track (in sync) to a Sonos One SL in an S1 Household ...and group either of those devices with other Sonos products within their own Households… it’s one way to play music in sync to products across both the S1 and S2 Systems.

In regards to your question about the Arc.. yes the Wife & I love it ..we have it setup with surrounds and sub on an LG C9 TV (calibrated using the rtings recommended settings). It works and sounds great.


So what about my question regarding hooking my existing Yamaha soundbar to the line-in on a port, and then adding a couple of Play One SLs as the surrounds?