This is offered for your system management and senior development staff, please forward
I have had SONOS installed in our home (a $15K system) for 4+ years and it works and sounds great, but.... You keep updating your app to add features and "correct bugs". You are driving users nuts, it's a sound system, not a critical heart monitor or sophisticated pc. We have 2 i-phones, 2-ipads and a Mac. Everytime you update, we can't turn the system on or off. and the update takes some time. First, if you are going to update, advise the user that an update is available and leave system control capability available until the update is complete. Organize your updates so they are made periodically, like every 3-4 months rather than as some developer gets a wild hair. Test your systems before released, this last round had 3, 4,... who knows how many updates to fix bugs.
If you are not a teenager, are gainfully employed, have kids, are not independently wealthy, are over 60 or only moderately technically sophisticated, a smooth and reliable update process with cool new features that are better described would be a giant step toward better customer satisfaction. Apple does it pretty well, so can SONOS.
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F!@# me. Everytime I turn Sonos on I get the threat upgrade or lose functionality. I just want to listen to music and not have to do system admin.
Userlevel 7
+22
Because Sonos does not have a list of every feature offered by the current version of each piece of software to use as a checklist for any new version?
We used to have a LONG printout of every feature/screen of our software on 13" green bar paper that we looped over a flip-chart stand (yes I am old) and we would go down it line by line making sure each feature was either present and unchanged or there was a darned good reason it was gone or modified. The changes were then presented to our customer for approval before the first Alpha release.
I'm sure there is some fancy computerized way to do this today but if we had a problem with our printout it could be fixed in 30 seconds with a bit of Scotch tape.
We used to have a LONG printout of every feature/screen of our software on 13" green bar paper that we looped over a flip-chart stand (yes I am old) and we would go down it line by line making sure each feature was either present and unchanged or there was a darned good reason it was gone or modified. The changes were then presented to our customer for approval before the first Alpha release.
I'm sure there is some fancy computerized way to do this today but if we had a problem with our printout it could be fixed in 30 seconds with a bit of Scotch tape.
And warn everyone who may use the system not to choose to update their apps, and don't install any new devices or controllers.
Excellent point. The present state of affairs points squarely to an inadequate process discipline.
I also agree that Sonos is just something as mundane as a home audio system; they are not launching spacecraft or performing mission critical tasks of important missions. Nor are these responses needed as for virus attacks.
Of course you can win, by doing the right thing. If both approaches draw the same whining, isn't it the better approach to be disciplined? Besides, there is a lot of whining to which Sonos does not respond by either actions or words for much more than 3 months, so what's the problem in being disciplined?
This is actually extremely disciplined (it's a technique called "Continuous Delivery"). Pushing regular, small, incremental updates - with a short timeframe from design to development to testing to release - is a sign of a software development team with excellent process.
+20
You can turn updates off, then just update when you are ready.
+20
Yes :D
Watch out for automatic uodates of the controller apps.
Also, turn off auto update on your mobile devices app store(s).
... and don’t buy any new products if you are switching off the updates as it will force you to upgrade.
The ability to be able to release tested software in small, frequent batches is pretty much essential these days. No one wants to wait up to three months for a bug fix. That said, it's important to have stability in the user experience, and not constantly move things around. Sonos have probably got things about right (regular bug fixes, quarterly major changes) with their release schedule.
I do wish they'd prioritise different issues (eg. UI/UX consistency across screens / platforms) though...
I do wish they'd prioritise different issues (eg. UI/UX consistency across screens / platforms) though...
If people are going to complain either way, my approach would be to do the disciplined thing and not let people drive me away from that. Unless I am too lazy and justifying this by saying: people complain either way. And it isn't as if there are monthly updates either - they seem to be released whenever Sonos feels like releasing them, which points to the lack of discipline in Sonos process management.
But I am repeating myself; if Sonos sees value in the feedback, that has been extracted.
But I am repeating myself; if Sonos sees value in the feedback, that has been extracted.
Userlevel 7
+20
Exactly that.
Why exactly? For what is just a home audio system? And where do you draw the line? Is daily at midnight the ideal to aim for then?
Imagine for a second that Sonos actually fix an issue that affects you. Or they add a cool new feature. Now imagine that Sonos have an update process that involves user action to receive those updates (assuming you don't have auto-update enabled). Would you want to wait up to three months for the opportunity to get the new code? Having a system that's always evolving is one of the cool things about Sonos (or it was until they messed up the queue / My Sonos / insert own hated change here).
Look, with software that users have to download, there are practical limits to how frequently you can release (unlike, say Amazon pushing hundreds of changes every week). Unreleased code has no value. Fast turnaround from idea / bug fix to a tested release is way better than the nasty old software lifecycles of the past.
Userlevel 7
+22
I'd be happy with optional updates that aren't essential to Sonos operation and mandatory updates that are essential.
Having the "No update" option that might leave a system with no access to on-line services might make some folks happy too.
Having the "No update" option that might leave a system with no access to on-line services might make some folks happy too.
"Modern agile rapid release schedules" - that is an impressive phrase indeed, though I still question if it applies to a very slowly evolving home audio system. I do see the word "schedules" in it, still defined I find as "a plan for carrying out a process or procedure, giving lists of intended events and times." Not quite how Sonos releases its updates, is it?
And if doing this in the manner it is done by Sonos is needed to attract new customers, Sonos is in more trouble than we think.
I believe I read here about Amazon as some one that also does this. I have no clue - because Amazon does not ask me to do what Sonos does, for every release. Updates happen on my Echo/Dot devices in the background and in six months of use, I have never had to do anything or even notice that happening. So if Sonos is said to follow the Amazon lead in these modern practices, they need to provide all of the Amazon delivery mechanism as well.
Userlevel 1
Cool Breeze I assume I do that through Advanced Settings and turn off Auto Check for Updates?
Userlevel 1
Thank you all
That was my downfall, adding an extra Play1 for upstairs forced me onto updating to 8..
Userlevel 7
+22
turn off auto updates in sonos. There have been more updates recently because of additions people have been asking for.
Userlevel 7
+22
That is exactly what Sonos used to do ... then you would have 3 month long complaint threads asking why Sonos was so slow to add feature or make an improvement. You can’t win.
Userlevel 7
+22
Because some people will be upset you don't update but every 3 to 4 months and others will be upset if you update every month. Your going to have someone complain either way.
Userlevel 7
+22
That means frequent updates and frequent reboots. The reboots are what cause all the problems. People’s networks them get messed up and everyone cry’s that it’s a bad update (when it’s been a highly tested update and the reboot exposed a network issue). So smaller updates more frequently would cause more problems.
When was the last time we had to take an update? Other than the hassle of a few minutes without music while the Sonos and controllers reboot themselves, I can't remember the last time I had a problem after updating (although it is a risk that Sonos mess something up). Better (ie. "some") release notes would help us make an informed decision.
When the user is involved in the update process, there is a limit to how frequently you can push out updates. And any change introduces risk. But with software, you want to get new code out there, rather than stockpiling release candidates.
Userlevel 7
+22
The complaint of the original poster was to many updates. And your right. You can tdo now off auto updates and not take them all if you don’t want. I’m all for frequent updates but fact is many aren’t and they like to vocally complain about it.
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