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Unable to add my Amp to the network ...

  • 22 October 2023
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R
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Hello,

Our Sonos system consist of 2 Boosts, 5 Connect Amp compatible with S2, 1 Amp and 1 Arc.  The Connect Amps are distributed in the home while the Arc and Amp are in the living room connected to our television.  Boosts are needed to extend the Sonos network.

I recently realized that a part of our home internet network was not working.  Some ethernet connections needed to be worked on.  I had to make changes in the wiring and the connections.

I suspect that part of my problems were created when adding a TP-Link Deco mesh system on my home network to have a better signal in all our home that is not ethernet wired entirely.

So I played around with all the wires and cables of our internet and Sonos networks.  When reconnecting everything, my Amp was not recognized anymore on my Sonos network and my Arc’s button were not responsive anymore.  I don’t know if the 2 problems are caused by the same problem.

So I tried very hard to have my Amp recognize by the network.  I also tried resetting it to factory settings many times with no success.  Later, it did recognize the Amp by was never able to add it to the Sonos system.  

This morning, I moved the Amp near my main Boost.  I reset it another time to it’s factory setting.  This time the Amp was recognized and added to the system, but Sonos said it was unable to add it to displayed configuration of the Sonos app.  I tried once more with no success.

Over the years, I never had problems configuring or making changes to my Sonos configuration with my older S2 compatible Connect Amp.  I never had any problem.  Everything was a breeze.  I was always surprised how simple the Sonos setup was taken care of.  

Since the newer Amp, configuration has been tricky, quite complicated and not straightforward anymore.  Is it my fault or caused by our more complicated internet network or is the new Amp more flaky, I don’t know.  One thing is sure, I have done a-lot of work and I am at the end of my personal options.

Can anyone help me going further fixing my 2 problems ?

Thanks in advance. 

 

 

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Best answer by rlesperance 27 October 2023, 03:03

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93 replies

R
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Hello glad helpers …. I just wanted to make a follow up on my case.  Calling Sonos helped to focus on the hardware problem.  

The Sonos Amp was not connecting because it was blocked from the TP-Link Deco system.  Sorry to say that.  I don’t know why and how it was blocked but once unblocked, it simply joined the network smoothly and simply as all Sonos devices always did.  I learned that the Sonos Amp can self diagnostic iitself by displaying different color signals.  

I I had 3 blocked devices.  Not sure what they all were yet.  But now that they are unblocked, everything got back to Sonos normal and simplicity.  Even the Apple TV (salle familliale) connected to the Deco system.

Ken …  I also called Videotron.  I was able to have my other Apple TV (not shown on the diagram) joined the Deco network through B2 and thus could disable the repeater like you suggested.  I did not convert my ISP’s router to a bridge … yet.

So thanks again for being supportive.

 

P.S.  The diagram has been updated.

ratty

Just a few comments:

  • Double NAT is not an issue per se. My system’s behind two routers. (I’ve also run systems in Triple NAT).
  • Being on the wrong side of a secondary router absolutely is an issue, as it would put the controller on the wrong subnet. Sonos controllers need to be on the same subnet as the players.
  • I’ve never ever seen a message telling me I couldn’t wire a Sonos device. And I’ve had a mix of wired and wireless devices for 15+ years.
  • Wiring the second Boost through the Deco satellite might not be a good idea. Some meshes use a flavour of STP (Spanning Tree Protocol) for loop avoidance which could potentially get into a fight with Sonos’ STP variant. If the switches have STP as well things could also get messy.
ratty

Would wiring B1 to my ISP’s modem (so before D1) and not wiring B2, leaving it to connect to B1 trough wifi be an answer to both of your comments ?

Don’t wire to the ISP box. It’s the wrong side of your primary Deco unit, which by default contains a router.

You could try unwiring B2. That would certainly simplify things somewhat.

Ken_Griffiths

I will always remain baffled by the Apple TV, wired to the 3rd switch and somehow using the Helix router subnet, but that’s perhaps one of life’s mysteries.🤷‍♂️ 

The TP-Link router block on the devices was never obvious from the things posted - so glad that Sonos Staff sorted it, otherwise we may have been left scratching our heads over this one.

R
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Please wait for the diagram.  It is really important to be sure what are the suggestions to be implemented.  There is to many «ifs and don’ts».  

Ken_Griffiths

It’s 01.00am here where I am @rlesperance so will take a look first thing in the morning.👍

R
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(My global home network is not simple has I thought it was.  There is so many ifs or possibilities to tamper with, not knowing exactly what I am doing is painful.  Thanks you for helping.)

FYI, my internet home network begins with my ISP’s router (IR) connected to the Deco Primary hub (DPH), itself connected to a TP-LINK Gigabit Ethernet switch (GES).  My first Boost (FB) is connected to the GES.

In my previous post, I said that the FB was not wired to the network.  That’s a recent change because I thought it didn’t need to be.  I am not really sure to understand how Sonos manages it’s own network (Canal 6).  It has always been wired to GES.  I wired it back because disconnecting it seemed to cause me problems.  

You asked to connect the FB to the DPH.  The DPH has only 2 ethernet ports.  The first is used to connect to my IR ans the second, connects to the GES.  Is connecting it to the GES the same has connecting it to the DPH ?   

R
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FYI … My Sonos network has been working perfectly before I began making recent changes to bad ethernet connectors and cables and moving cables around.  

Does this answer your questions regarding the basic IR and the DPH setup … ‘router’ mode or ‘bridged AP’ mode ?

Ken_Griffiths

Having two routers, one embedded inside the other, or linked of the other is often referred to as ‘Double NAT’ it’s not a huge issue, if carefully managed - they each have a different subnet, but firewalls can sometimes get in the way for updates and the such like… rather than data ‘passing through’ the first router when in bridge mode or modem mode. Controllers devices can sometimes also connect to the wrong subnet/network.

My question is do you ‘really’ need the IR WiFi enabled for your TV? - the fact you have a repeater might also be problematic - can’t you just switch off the repeater and have the TV use your Deco mesh WiFi instead? - I suspect it’s these things : IR WiFi and Repeater, that has been causing the problems you were seeing with the Amp.

Anything that connects to the IR, or repeater WiFi signal, will have problems communicating with your Sonos products on SonosNet, linked back to the DPH.

Ken_Griffiths

The purpose of a mesh system is to really help do away with WiFi repeaters/extenders etc. which in fact are listed as ‘unsupported’ by Sonos in their system requirements. 

ratty

Does the Apple TV have the Helix WiFi details configured? It may be wired to S3 but if the connection is flaky it could be flipping over to the Helix WiFi if it knows about it. 

R
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On my mobile device, the Sonos app says that the Associated product’s IP address begins with 192.168.  That would mean that the B1 is connected trough D1.

Moderator edit: removed identifying information

R
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So Deco is using 192.168.68.0/24 - so what subnet is your IR using?

Also what is IR’s SSID (I don’t really need its full SSID) - just enough to know that its different to your Deco SSID, which you said is named LespeReeves?

 

My ISP told me that it’s network address would begin with 10.00.

R
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The Apple TV is a still mystery.  I checked the cables.  I also disconnected/connected the ATV and the connection to IR isn’t active anymore.   If I leave it disconnected it connects automatically to S1, where the signal is very good.  As of now, I will leave the ATV out of the problem.

Ken … Still looking for the 2 items you asked about.

I would like to concentrate on getting the AMP connected and to fix the problem with the sound control buttons on the ARC.

Here is working time, so I will not be available for a few hours.  I will give Sonos a call at 16H00 (4H00PM ET) and get back to you glad helpers.

Ken_Griffiths

I thank you very much for trying and doing your best.  I will give Sonos a call.

Before you do give up and walk away, is it possible that you have ALSO wired your GES switch to you IR - in addition to wiring IR to the PDH —my reason for asking is your Apple TV is using the IR wired subnet, rather than the Deco subnet… and that’s causing me some confusion🤔? It’s like something else is wired to your ISP router when in fact things should ALL be wired to your GES (switch).

ratty

Why on earth don’t you just wire the Amp to the second port of the Boost (B1)? It only needs to be a temporary connection. If even that doesn’t allow you to add it to the system there’s something really wrong. 

The OP has actually setup the Amp in the past when wired - it’s when they then try to run it wireless afterwards that he has had issues.. it seems quite clear now that the wired network (as can be seen from the Apple TV screenshot) is a different subnet to the WiFi network SSID "LespeReeves” being used by the iPhone mobile controller device - the user needs to switch their mobile controller devices to connect to the other WiFi  network - sadly it seems they do not know the ‘other’ SSID, or how to access it - I don’t even know myself (yet) if the Deco WiFi and IR WiFi (incorrectly) have the same SSID.

Even when the Amp is setup here and working, it seems to me that the OP’s local network setup will still need looking at in detail, as it seems like it’s in a bit of a mess and certainly split across two subnets.

Well, yes, there’s definitely some uncertainty about how the network is configured, and there are obviously two subnets with different SSIDs. 

I was simply reacting to the fact that the Sonos controller could evidently see the system via a Boost (#1) wired to the primary mesh node. Ergo the Amp ought to be easily addable wired, or even wireless.

On reflection there could also be something odd as a result of the daisy-chain through several switches  and Deco node #2. 

ratty

I have one quick question though - might the class 4C subnet mask (255.255.252.0) - 1k addresses possibly cause Sonos any issues - I appreciate it’s the same subnet, but was just wondering?

Deco evidently chooses to issue /22 addresses, presumably to allow for a plethora of IoT devices. I don’t see how it ought to matter. 

 

Ken_Griffiths

Thanks all for being helpful.

In all my set ups, the only thing I did is connect items together, and let the system arrange itself. I never modified any SSI ID, or IP addresses.

 

As for being unable to have wired and unwired Sonos devices on the network, why is that ?  Do I read in your comments that's it is possible but for some reason in my network it is not or is it impossible to have both at the same time ?

I’ve never seen a message where a wired device is not allowed - In larger Sonos systems in fact, at one stage, it was sometimes helpful to wire several products to the LAN (just not to Mesh satellite hubs) and it’s not always good practice to wire a Home Theatre Surround, or Sub, to the LAN either where the ‘main’ player is wireless.

I think the issue in your case @rlesperance is the different routers/subnets you have setup and what appears to be a double NAT configuration. I’m guessing you have more than the Deco Primary Hub wired to your ISP provided router too. Sonos Support will hopefully be able to sort it with you a little easier over the phone.🤞

Anyhow… 

@ratty - thanks re the /22 address reply.👍

Ken_Griffiths

The Boost 2 was initially off a wired Deco Satellite DS-1 from what was mentioned. I did suggest moving it to GES-2, but leaving it uncabled seems sensible. This is what I was seeing from the things mentioned… (if it perhaps helps to clarify things🤔?)… it would be helpful to know if I have the diagram incorrect in any way?

 

R
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You are preceding me.  I was in the way of making one.  I don’t have time this morning but I will get back to you.  It will be helpful for everybody.

ratty

The WiFi’s standards/security aren’t especially relevant as the system’s in SonosNet mode.

 

This however raises a flag.

As for the fact that my Apple TV (ATV) connects to the ISP router (10.0.0.1) instead of the Deco network, I have to add that the ethernet cable in which the ATV is connected originates from D1 before connecting to GES3 in which the ATV connects to (D1 → GES3 → ATV ).  To me that seems to confirm that the ATV is able to decipher what are the available networks and that it is able to choose my ISP’s network instead of Deco’s.

The ATV doesn’t get to ‘choose’. And if the topology is D1 → GES3 → ATV with GES3 on the LAN side of D1 why is it getting a 10.x.x.x IP instead of 192.168.x.x??

It’s beginning to sound as though there are two DHCP servers on the same segment. As if D1 is either being bridged past or is wired incorrectly? 

The topology needs to be documented and thoroughly verified. 

Ken_Griffiths

Ah glad to hear that you and Sonos Staff have got things sorted @rlesperance, that’s the main thing and always happy to try to help. Thanks for letting us know the outcome too. 👍 

Ken_Griffiths

It has made me wonder if the wiring/setup mentioned by the OP is perhaps described incorrectly and that the wired Boost 1 is somehow using the IR subnet too alongside the Apple TV - it’s still a bit of a confused picture, but hopefully a clear ‘detailed’ diagram from @rlesperance later will quickly throw some light on where the problems may lie.

ratty

What is this"block" of which you speak? A MAC blacklist or whitelist? The lack of an accessible 2.4GHz SSID? What steps were taken to "unblock" things?

R
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Ratty ... I had 3 blocked devices from within my Deco app .. not the Sonos app.  Since the Deco acts as a router, the blocks prevented the signals flow through.

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