Sonos contributing to electronic waste

Show first post
This topic has been closed for further comments. You can use the search bar to find a similar topic, or create a new one by clicking Create Topic at the top of the page.

114 replies

airforceteacher
Userlevel 6
Badge +15

@Kumar If what you say is true, why are so many people concerned about Sonos not upgrading to SMB v2?

Speaking as a security professional: the problem is SMBv1 is that it has known vulnerabilities that will not be fixed.  If you wish to use the advertised capability of playing from a network share, you have to either use only network shares on Windows or Macs, using the Sonos App’s http sharing, or leave your SMB share server using the vulnerable SMBv1, whether it’s a Windows, Mac, or Linux computer or a NAS device.  This doesn’t present a danger to your Sonos devices, but to those sharing systems should another machine in your network become infected with malware that attacks SMBv1.  This is the problem that concerns people.  

melvimbe

 

 

 

 

I suppose it may make sense to get these if you’re looking at a Connect as something you use for 3-4 years and upgrade later on to whatever currently meets your needs.  Seems like that would be a rather tiny market though.

@melvimbe thanks for your comments. I contacted Sonos support on Social media and they confirmed that a brand new Connect bought from them today would be eligible for recycling right away. They also said it won't be getting updates for much longer. They would not respond when asked why the website description is so inaccurate.

 

So thank you to everyone for stopping me from buying a POS. A Port would be logical but I would like optical. 

 

 

I wold take that bold statement with a grain of salt.  It’s vague, and contradicts what’s been said by staff here on these forums...that being that Sonos does not have plans to end updates to the Connect.

 

Regardless, I don’t think it makes much sense to spend $350 on a Connect, instead of $400 on a Port.

Danny
U

 

 

 

 

I suppose it may make sense to get these if you’re looking at a Connect as something you use for 3-4 years and upgrade later on to whatever currently meets your needs.  Seems like that would be a rather tiny market though.

@melvimbe thanks for your comments. I contacted Sonos support on Social media and they confirmed that a brand new Connect bought from them today would be eligible for recycling right away. They also said it won't be getting updates for much longer. They would not respond when asked why the website description is so inaccurate.

 

So thank you to everyone for stopping me from buying a POS. A Port would be logical but I would like optical. 

 

 

I wold take that bold statement with a grain of salt.  It’s vague, and contradicts what’s been said by staff here on these forums...that being that Sonos does not have plans to end updates to the Connect.

 

Regardless, I don’t think it makes much sense to spend $350 on a Connect, instead of $400 on a Port.

But after next week will it make sense to spend $450 on a Port instead of $350 on a connect? A lot of folks will have trouble finding $100 worth of extra value in the Port.

Local music library with carefully constructed playlists - no shuffling!, Integration with Homeseer Automation, No touch screen devices, No streaming services, No Apple products ever
melvimbe

 

 

 

 

I suppose it may make sense to get these if you’re looking at a Connect as something you use for 3-4 years and upgrade later on to whatever currently meets your needs.  Seems like that would be a rather tiny market though.

@melvimbe thanks for your comments. I contacted Sonos support on Social media and they confirmed that a brand new Connect bought from them today would be eligible for recycling right away. They also said it won't be getting updates for much longer. They would not respond when asked why the website description is so inaccurate.

 

So thank you to everyone for stopping me from buying a POS. A Port would be logical but I would like optical. 

 

 

I wold take that bold statement with a grain of salt.  It’s vague, and contradicts what’s been said by staff here on these forums...that being that Sonos does not have plans to end updates to the Connect.

 

Regardless, I don’t think it makes much sense to spend $350 on a Connect, instead of $400 on a Port.

But after next week will it make sense to spend $450 on a Port instead of $350 on a connect? A lot of folks will have trouble finding $100 worth of extra value in the Port.

The Port is missing features that I would like. I think I would have been happy with the Connect. But since it will be bricked in a couple of years not so much...If Sonos was upfront about when updates will stop it would be an easier decision especially since buying used now is way more risky than it was before the Recycle program. 

There are other options and I'm very still happy with my Amp.

 

 

I actually was going to say that I’d consider the used market as an option when deciding between a $350 Connect that may go away in a couple years and $450 new product.  If I don’t want to spend $100 now (to me, the $50 difference makes me decided on a new Port), then perhaps I can get get a used Connect for $250 or $200 (that can turn in to 30% off later)  makes the most sense.  As far as depending on the used market, I wouldn’t buy from an unrelated market where you have no guarantees.  I haven’t looked at ebay policy in a while, but I believe they allow returns of products that are not functioning for a full refund, regardless of what the seller is willing to do.

 

This is all hypothetical to me though, as I don’t have a need for a Connect/Port right now.  I actually have 2 Connects that I’m not using.  Ultimately what I’m going to do is going to depend on need and how I intend to use it.  If I intend to display the device, then the Port is favored for it’s black color, but hidden device makes that irrelevant to me….for example.  Depends too on whether the 12V trigger is useful to me,whether I want airplay etc.

Danny
Ryan S
Userlevel 7
Badge +26

That bold part above regarding support is incorrect. I’ll make sure the team has the right information going out. 

A new Connect purchased today from our website will continue to get updates and support, though it will be eligible for trade up, since all Connects are. That said, for people making the choice between a Connect and a Port, they’re still deciding between the new technology and the old generation. On paper, the two have mostly the same functionality today, no optical on the Port, and it supports AirPlay 2 which the Connect doesn’t. However, Port has far better components in regards to networking, computing, and processing audio. It’s a brand new product that has been fully upgraded, which does make it more future proof than the older hardware of the Connect.

Mark good posts by pressing the like button, and select the best answer on questions you've asked to help others find solutions.
Ryan S
Userlevel 7
Badge +26

I understand wanting a guaranty here, but it's just not something that can be promised right now. I’ll let you know if there’s any update to share in that regard. Currently, there aren't any Sonos players so far that have reached the end of support, and that includes 15+ year old Sonos players. Ultimately, capabilities and longevity are determined by hardware limits, so if you want something that you know won't have issues for a long time, the Port is what you're looking for. We can't promise a specific amount of years a new Connect will keep getting updates, but we do plan to continue to support all of these old devices for as long as we're able to.

 

Regarding the message on our “Last Chance” page, it says “Enjoy incredible sound and performance with earlier versioned speakers, soundbars, and components.” The sound and performance of the Connect is incredible, that hasn’t changed. The fact that the older devices can’t support the modern Sonos experience doesn’t change their sound or performance from being incredible. The modern experience is about new features, such as AirPlay 2, which older devices can’t support. But we don’t need to go down the rabbit hole of arguing semantics or marketing messages here. I’ll pass along your thoughts to the web team though so they can look it over.

Mark good posts by pressing the like button, and select the best answer on questions you've asked to help others find solutions.
Stanley_4
Userlevel 7
Badge +22

Buying used is more risky as folks are now selling traded gear as fully functional. You might be able to get a refund but the scammers are likely to try to avoid that. There were folks selling broken gear before so it is just additional risk, not something new.

lewisc
Userlevel 4
Badge +9

Interesting article by The Verge here about Sonos' sustainability. Seems like it's an even split between the public caring / not

 

https://www.theverge.com/2019/12/30/21042871/sonos-recycle-mode-trade-up-program-controversy

Authorised Sonos Installer
Stanley_4
Userlevel 7
Badge +22

A seller that gets ripped off by a buyer recycling and returning a device for credit has an option of working with Sonos BUT everything I have seen is that Sonos requires a copy of a formal police report before they will act.

One more reason I’m glad I recycled rather than trying to sell my old gear. That is of course on top of the more than I paid for it new rebate credit. :-)

K

Does anyone know what exactly these recyclers do other than making for one large landfill instead of many small ones? After all, this isn't like recycling plastic bags or aluminium cans that can be brought back to some intermediate stage to be then again turned into a useable product.

Given the above, if the buying of Sonos gear in the used market has now become riskier as explained by Stanley and Mike above, then it can be said that Sonos is contributing to electronic waste via this program, by facilitating a reduction in the usable life of its products. How much that contribution is in absolute terms no one can say; it may be insignificant - or not so.

In the big picture of how much energy/resources are consumed for products that are directly trashed before consumption like food, or via not using them for their available service life like what happens with so many consumer durables, this can’t be significant for sure, but it may not be good messaging in the present environment.

106rallye
Userlevel 7
Badge +17

And the best argument in the whole article is that “something (...) feels very off”: “But for those who do want to take advantage of the trade-up program, something still feels very off about having to render these products inoperable in exchange for a discount on the current Sonos lineup.” Wow, investigative journalism at its best. ;-)

Airgetlam

I’ve heard of several companies that will take electronics and pull them apart, and recycle piecemeal both the metals and the plastic casings. Apple is one company that certainly does this with their metals, if memory serves, they boast of a fairly high recovery rate on electronics from their phones. I’ve read of other startups and ongoing concerns that provide this service as well, in many tech blogs, news programs in the Silicon Valley area, and in other new sources. 

I suppose it all depends on where you recycle your product, and even if you choose to. I don’t see Sonos as any different than Dell, IBM, Samsung, LG, Apple, or any other electronics company that brings out “newer, faster, better” equipment, other than Sonos ha at least made the attempt to raise awareness by garnering a commitment to responsibly recycle the product, something I’ve not seen from many companies. 
 

And the fact that all of this is purely voluntary, and only if you choose to take advantage of the 30% discount and upgrade your device…It is entirely up to each individual to decide whether they want to do this or nit. There’s no forcing of the process, you choose to take advantage, or you don’t. You have the option of boxing up your product and sending it to Sonos, or finding a local recycler to give it to. There’s just options. You can make the choice as to whether you want to avail yourself if any of these choices, or not. 

Bruce
K

 they boast of a fairly high recovery rate on electronics from their phones.

This would be an interesting subject to pursue outside of this thread, starting with the question of how the recovery rate is computed - by value or by volume/weight.

In India, since we are a poor country, there is a significant business of recycling electronics that involves refurbishing to sell in markets that need lower price points for the goods. But that can't continue beyond a cycle or two of such use - I have no idea how the product is dealt with at true end of life. Seeing how many old abandoned cars I see on city streets, I shudder to even think of that subject.

melvimbe

Wouldn’t you need to make the same claim against any company that is selling audio equipment that could be considered an improvement over what consumer’s might currently have?    The fact that a piece of equipment is better than what you currently have, whether it’s because of features, price, or whatever, is going to tempt a person to get rid of their current speaker and upgrade to something more current.

 

Is your issue more around the fact that the Sonos program requires you to brick your speaker essentially, so that it can’t be resold or given to someone else for use?

 

 

 

Danny
lewisc
Userlevel 4
Badge +9

Wouldn’t you need to make the same claim against any company that is selling audio equipment that could be considered an improvement over what consumer’s might currently have?    The fact that a piece of equipment is better than what you currently have, whether it’s because of features, price, or whatever, is going to tempt a person to get rid of their current speaker and upgrade to something more current.

 

Is your issue more around the fact that the Sonos program requires you to brick your speaker essentially, so that it can’t be resold or given to someone else for use?

 

 

 

All companies play their role and need to up their game when it comes to recycling, reducing waste, being efficient with energy etc. But Sonos' trade in promo highlights the issue extremely well. Forcing the old speakers to become waste. Most of the products are in mint condition as new, still working. 

Authorised Sonos Installer
melvimbe

People would be better off selling their older gear on eBay, assuming it’s functional. They’ll get more than the discount offered by Sonos, and someone else will get to enjoy the older device.

 

 

That depends on what you’re selling and what you’re buying with discount.  If your selling an old ZP80 for example, I’m guessing $100 would be a great deal.  But if you wanted to apply the discount to a playbase for example, you’re getting a $210 discount.

 

 

Danny
lewisc
Userlevel 4
Badge +9

People would be better off selling their older gear on eBay, assuming it’s functional. They’ll get more than the discount offered by Sonos, and someone else will get to enjoy the older device.

 

 

That depends on what you’re selling and what you’re buying with discount.  If your selling an old ZP80 for example, I’m guessing $100 would be a great deal.  But if you wanted to apply the discount to a playbase for example, you’re getting a $210 discount.

 

 

Although the wording says 30% off any new Sonos product, I find it hard to believe that they would allow and make a profit from this scenario. The wording in the T&C is weird.

 

But anyway I'm more concerned with the by product

Authorised Sonos Installer
J

People would be better off selling their older gear on eBay, assuming it’s functional. They’ll get more than the discount offered by Sonos, and someone else will get to enjoy the older device.

But for how long?  The amount of memory in the ZP80 and ZP100 is so small it is inevitable that at some point Sonos will no longer be able to maintain compatibility with the current system.  I don’t know if that point will come in 6 months, 2 years. 5 years or whenever, but come it will.  A ZP80 would need to be a virtual giveaway for me to purchase one.

 

A

The only good way to make sustainable hardware is to open-source the required software and interfaces.

If Sonos is no longer willing to pay software maintenance, it should provide user community all required material to do it.

jgatie

Correct, it is voluntary. But retailers themselves don’t care about the state of the planet and only care about their personal profits. Sonos should take the responsibility of making sure that if there is going to be waste that it’s recycled correctly (or even better reused by people)

 

Would you partake in the program if they took half your discount and used it to recycle the item?  

lewisc
Userlevel 4
Badge +9

Correct, it is voluntary. But retailers themselves don’t care about the state of the planet and only care about their personal profits. Sonos should take the responsibility of making sure that if there is going to be waste that it’s recycled correctly (or even better reused by people)

 

Would you partake in the program if they took half your discount and used it to recycle the item?  

Are you speaking from a customer perspective or retailer?

 

The discount should be applied to the customer, the retailer makes enough margin as is so don't need to receive any more incentive IMO. The 'waste' products should be allowed to be reused or at very least be recycled responsibly (meaning that Sonos makes sure that it happening correctly) even better Sonos could collect the old products reusing the components if applicable. The products should be shipped back in the same lorries that are making the deliveries therefore not contributing or minimal to pollution.

Authorised Sonos Installer
jgatie

So the customer still receives the full discount and the burden of recycling is all on the retailer/manufacturer?

Great, now that we’ve established that it is just about the bottom line for all parties involved, let’s haggle price.

lewisc
Userlevel 4
Badge +9

So the customer still receives the full discount and the burden of recycling is all on the retailer/manufacturer?

Great, now that we’ve established that it is just about the bottom line for all parties involved, let’s haggle price.

Do you not agree that Sonos should make sure units are being recycled as should?

 

Sonos can set whatever discount they want but as the biggest party they need to be responsible (as much as possible) for the use of their products and correct disposal

Authorised Sonos Installer
melvimbe

think this old equipment you can trade in includes the likes of this:

https://www.johnlewis.com/sonos-connect-wireless-music-system/p230973910

Yes, you can still buy it.

Thank you, I hadn’t realised that. Man that’s so corrupt and morally wrong. Throwing away working products at the same time as manufacturing the exact same product. 

 

Waiting for an official Sonos reply...

 

Sonos isn’t manufacturing Connects anymore.  This are from previous runs that have not yet been sold at some retailers.    These units probably do have a lot of life left in them, and honestly it would be pretty silly buy one and  trade it in for a new Port.  I don’t imagine a lot of people would be doing that, or a Connect that was purchased in the last year or two. 

 

Danny
lewisc
Userlevel 4
Badge +9

So the customer still receives the full discount and the burden of recycling is all on the retailer/manufacturer?

Great, now that we’ve established that it is just about the bottom line for all parties involved, let’s haggle price.

Do you not agree that Sonos should make sure units are being recycled as should?

 

Sonos can set whatever discount they want but as the biggest party they need to be responsible (as much as possible) for the use of their products and correct disposal

 

In my humble opinion, manufacturers should be responsible for the waste they create, and the consumer should be responsible for the waste they create.  By whom this particular waste is created is where we probably should agree to disagree.

However, I find it slightly ironic that you claim the “retailers themselves don’t care about the state of the planet and only care about their personal profits”, yet you yourself are not willing to forego some of your discount in order to save that very same planet. 

I'm happy for forego discount. All of my Sonos products have been bought at retail price. If they were going to offer a 30% discount they could do a 15% discount and the remaining 'saving' in stead of it going to the customer they could use them funds to recycle.

 

I think I'm more bothered about that they're recycling perfectly working products. Why can't they do a trade in but retailers can sell the 'used and approved' products..

Authorised Sonos Installer
Terms & ConditionsCookie settings