What to replace Sonos with
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I want to replace my Sonos system
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Ah, yes, well, there could be circumstances when adding the wired Boost that you'd need an 'out of band' connection to the router. Depending on SonosNet at the point where you're actually replacing the foundation to SonosNet could be a bit precarious...
As for the phone's not seeing SonosNet initially, there could simply be something specific about the way that phone reacts to hidden SSIDs.
As for the phone's not seeing SonosNet initially, there could simply be something specific about the way that phone reacts to hidden SSIDs.
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If the phone's already on SonosNet but is reluctant to 'roam' onto a nearer, stronger, signal that's because of the phone.
When installing the Boost, it seemed that we needed to go back to router wifi to get things organised. One phone then hooked to SonosNet OK, but the other couldn't even see the SonosNet SSID until I changed SonosNet channel. Even then (if I remember correctly) I had to tell the phone not to use SonosNet and then to use it again. Then forget the local wifi to use the SonosNet. Having got there, tho' the signal is excellent, as I said.
How do you mean? You'd typically need to manually select the SonosNet SSID anyway, unless of course the other WiFis were out of range or 'forgotten'.
If the phone's already on SonosNet but is reluctant to 'roam' onto a nearer, stronger, signal that's because of the phone.
If the phone's already on SonosNet but is reluctant to 'roam' onto a nearer, stronger, signal that's because of the phone.
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thanks ratty!
It's still difficult, though, to get the android phones both to hook to the sonosnet. Have to make them jump!
It's still difficult, though, to get the android phones both to hook to the sonosnet. Have to make them jump!
The matrix looks okay. The orange connections of Bedroom and Dining Room are a bit borderline. However they aren't cause for concern as those nodes have alternative, 2-hop, connections available back to the root Boost if needed. In a few days time you might find that the matrix looks a bit different if the topology gets recomputed. Basically SonosNet will sort itself out either way.
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Well, thanks again to all who helped (despite my unhelpful start...)
Update:
Boost arrived Friday, got that plugged in and sorted, put attic Play:5 back up in the attic.
Everything is rock solid, wifi with our two android phones is full signal pretty much everywhere (being on SonosNet, rather than wifi from the router trying to penetrate 45cm stone walls) and there is no hanging, no failure to find music, no "unable to play...". Everything is behaving itself perfectly.
I attach a network matrix fyi.
many thanks again
Dick
Update:
Boost arrived Friday, got that plugged in and sorted, put attic Play:5 back up in the attic.
Everything is rock solid, wifi with our two android phones is full signal pretty much everywhere (being on SonosNet, rather than wifi from the router trying to penetrate 45cm stone walls) and there is no hanging, no failure to find music, no "unable to play...". Everything is behaving itself perfectly.
I attach a network matrix fyi.
many thanks again
Dick
It will depend on the phone, but typically when using a SonosNet connection it ought to roam between Sonos nodes. Sometimes however it may lazily stick with a distant one for a time before flipping over. Simply toggling WiFi off and on again should shake the phone out of its complacency.
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Not any more! Long may it continue to be as good as it is now! I have ordered a Boost and then the attic player can go back to its own place.
All is still good, and the other phone is now using SonosNet too - but not without difficulty! In the end I had to change channels from 11 to 1, then they both picked up, having dis-enabled and re-enabled SonosNet on both of them several times and restarted the phones, turned wifi off and on etc....
The great thing about using SonosNet for the phones is that the signal is so much stronger everywhere in the house. But you knew that anyway.
thanks again
Yes that is great news.
Much of what I know has been learned from @ratty! Although he remains in a league of his own, especially on more general networking matters.
Well done to you for being open to have another go. When Sonos doesn't work reliably, it is nearly always network-related, occasionally a Sonos hardware fault, and only once in a blue moon a genuine, generic bug in Sonos.
I hope you enjoy your Sonos system without problems for a long time to come - there is a very good chance you will.
Much of what I know has been learned from @ratty! Although he remains in a league of his own, especially on more general networking matters.
Well done to you for being open to have another go. When Sonos doesn't work reliably, it is nearly always network-related, occasionally a Sonos hardware fault, and only once in a blue moon a genuine, generic bug in Sonos.
I hope you enjoy your Sonos system without problems for a long time to come - there is a very good chance you will.
Good to hear.
(how do you know so much?! - especially the matrix thingy). Originally because of a need to understand why my system wasn't behaving right (we're talking 2007/08), then out of interest as to what other goodies the diagnostics offered. The user-visible bits used to be far more comprehensive, but are now hidden away by Sonos on grounds of security. (Foolish people were forwarding port 1400 through their router, and thousands of players were visible on teh interweb.)
Those in the matrix are the MACs for the wireless interfaces, which are +1 with respect to the internal MAC (and +2 for a home theatre speaker's 5GHz interface).
I don't want to put a Play:1 on the half-landing by the router, so I shall fork out and get a Boost (expensive, aren't they!).Cheap at the price of a modest night out, if you ask me.
My wifi analyser is showing channel 6 as the home network and now channel 11 is carrying the SonosNet (I assume that's what the HHID_xfO ...... signals are (there are 5 showing).Those beacons are showing because you have Androids connecting to SonosNet.
I've tried to specify IP addresses for the individual Sonos devices but (a) I don't see them all and (b) the MAC addresses don't tally. The addresses that the router reports are usually one hex digit different to what the network matrix reported. Odd.The MACs you should use for reservation are the ones you see in the router's DHCP table. These are the internal (bridge) MAC address. They also tally with the serial number.
Those in the matrix are the MACs for the wireless interfaces, which are +1 with respect to the internal MAC (and +2 for a home theatre speaker's 5GHz interface).
And another question: should my wife's android phone be able to connect to the SonosNet too?Yes. Go into Advanced Settings on her phone's controller and enable it. The SSID will appear in the WiFi settings. You can't configure the SonosNet SSID manually.
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Just tried playing from diskstation - no problem
thanks all, let you know tomorrow when I'm back online. Out now till 10pm.
All - especially @ratty, John B and Ken_Griffiths
THANK YOU!
This morning, for the first time in months and months, I went to the kitchen to make tea for the beloved OH and lo and behold, Sonos just fired up and worked immediately. No "searching for Sonos", no messing about. This is amazing. Also, there was a large dead spot for wifi / Sonos control in the dining room which has now vanished (due to proximity to the connect:amp's SonosNet, I assume) - again, a great result!
Kudos and thanks to you guys (how do you know so much?! - especially the matrix thingy).
I don't want to put a Play:1 on the half-landing by the router, so I shall fork out and get a Boost (expensive, aren't they!).
A couple of points to note:
- my router was pretending to be on channel 11 according to the manager (it's a vodafone router) but clearly was operating on channel 6. My wifi analyser is showing channel 6 as the home network and now channel 11 is carrying the SonosNet (I assume that's what the HHID_xfO ...... signals are (there are 5 showing). Maybe that's why sonos support told me to use channel 6, although they should have seen that from the diagnostics.
- I've tried to specify IP addresses for the individual Sonos devices but (a) I don't see them all and (b) the MAC addresses don't tally. The addresses that the router reports are usually one hex digit different to what the network matrix reported. Odd.
And another question: should my wife's android phone be able to connect to the SonosNet too? It doesn't see the HHID_55.... SSID so I typed it in manually - and then it asked for a password. That's normal, I understand, and I've enabled / disenabled / enabled but it didn't seem to pick up.
The powerlines, by the way, do have wifi but it's turned off except one in the attic for guests and that's on a guest network.
many, many thanks again - I thought Sonos Support was the place to go - how wrong I was. You guys in the Community are amazing.
(BTW, I have been a community member before, but pressures of time meant I couldn't participate much and I have also changed email, so re-joined. Are there ways I can contribute / learn more?)
THANK YOU ALL!
Really cheap alternative. lol
replace it with bluesound.
Really cheap alternative. lol
Really cheap alternative. lol
Glad to know some experts are in our midst
This probably is still the big Sonos differentiator.
+7
And here I thought this was a bad April Fool's joke. Was I ever wrong.
Kudos to those IT ninjas out there helping the OP. This is some network magic happening right now.
Glad to know some experts are in our midst in the event I should ever encounter my own Sonos poltergeist.
Kudos to those IT ninjas out there helping the OP. This is some network magic happening right now.
Glad to know some experts are in our midst in the event I should ever encounter my own Sonos poltergeist.
revdv,
Connections don’t look too bad, I would recommend the Boost too (more powerful signal).. that would be my purchase priority and move it further away from the router... as far as practicable.
I would ensure the router 2.4ghz channel 6 is 'fixed' and not allowed to auto-select it’s channel and if your powerline adapters are wifi access points and you need them, then they too either need to be fixed to channel 6, ...or much better don't use them with Sonos and perhaps just use their 5ghz radio with your non-Sonos devices. As a very last resort, you could cable Sonos to the powerline adapter, but look to that as being the very last option open to you.
In summary, run all your Sonos devices on the the Boost SonosNet signal, or cable them to your network. Use either SonosNet channel 1 or 11 to keep the radio signal far apart from your router channel.
As @Ratty mentions, goto the Sonos App 'Advanced Settings/Wireless Setup' and reset/remove the WiFi credentials... not needed when all are on SonosNet.
Dedicated Android Controllers running direct on SonosNet are good too as they connect/control via the nearby speakers/devices
I will recommend one further thing too and that’s to add your Sonos IP addresses to your routers DHCP Reservation Table, so that they get the same address on reboot/restart of the device or network.
Connections don’t look too bad, I would recommend the Boost too (more powerful signal).. that would be my purchase priority and move it further away from the router... as far as practicable.
I would ensure the router 2.4ghz channel 6 is 'fixed' and not allowed to auto-select it’s channel and if your powerline adapters are wifi access points and you need them, then they too either need to be fixed to channel 6, ...or much better don't use them with Sonos and perhaps just use their 5ghz radio with your non-Sonos devices. As a very last resort, you could cable Sonos to the powerline adapter, but look to that as being the very last option open to you.
In summary, run all your Sonos devices on the the Boost SonosNet signal, or cable them to your network. Use either SonosNet channel 1 or 11 to keep the radio signal far apart from your router channel.
As @Ratty mentions, goto the Sonos App 'Advanced Settings/Wireless Setup' and reset/remove the WiFi credentials... not needed when all are on SonosNet.
Dedicated Android Controllers running direct on SonosNet are good too as they connect/control via the nearby speakers/devices
I will recommend one further thing too and that’s to add your Sonos IP addresses to your routers DHCP Reservation Table, so that they get the same address on reboot/restart of the device or network.
Router and Sonos both on channel 6? They should be different, at least 5 channels apart.
Portable to Attic (as currently wired) has a rather borderline signal. Portable has the option of a two-hop route via Bedroom if things get sticky, though SonosNet tends to hang onto single-hop connections if it can.
I would ignore the amber 'OFDM Weak signal level: 3' boxes in the left column. The older radios seem prone to this now for some reason.
FWIW the Play:5 gen 1 has a somewhat weaker radio than the Play:1. But if everything stays stable I'd recommend getting a Boost to replace the Bridge anyway.
I would ignore the amber 'OFDM Weak signal level: 3' boxes in the left column. The older radios seem prone to this now for some reason.
FWIW the Play:5 gen 1 has a somewhat weaker radio than the Play:1. But if everything stays stable I'd recommend getting a Boost to replace the Bridge anyway.
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Initial results seem to be positive. Just tried grouping - no problem.
Just tried playing from diskstation - no problem
thanks all, let you know tomorrow when I'm back online. Out now till 10pm.
Just tried playing from diskstation - no problem
thanks all, let you know tomorrow when I'm back online. Out now till 10pm.
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Router is using channel 6
As is pretty much everything else - including what I assume to be the SonosNet, (HHID-55xf......etc)
Portable (RINCON_7828CA27FEB601400)
Kitchen (RINCON_B8E9378288AC01400)
Dining Room (RINCON_000E58DE629801400)
Bedroom (RINCON_000E583806A401400)
Living Room (RINCON_000E5826CEE801400)
Attic (RINCON_000E5880323201400)
Network Matrix
I've put the Attic Play:5 gen 1 in the place of the bridge (not the P:1) for domestic reasons.
thanks.
Gonna have to go off-line shortly.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think the Sonos is at all dependent on the powerlines.If the Bridge is/was the sole wired device then the Sonos units won't depend on EoP to interconnect. However a controller in a device using an EoP-based WiFi could encounter problems.
I would still swap out the Bridge as it uses SonosNet 1.0 not 2.0. Give the SonosNet phone connection a try. A screenshot of matrix, as suggested by @ratty, would definitely be worth it.
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My bridge power supply is showing 6.7V.
2/ Remove Sonos' dependency on the EoP (Ethernet over Powerline), even for the controllers. It's very variable, and any attempt to use it across the two consumer units is really asking for trouble.
The powerlines are separated because of the problems of two consumer units. Different hard-wires from router to different powerlines, with separate pairing to keep them apart. The Diskstation is hard-wired (via a switch) to the router. So I don't think I'm depending on powerline except to get catchup TV to the Humax (which mostly works flawlessy). Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think the Sonos is at all dependent on the powerlines.[/quote]
I am not connected to SonosNetThat's inconsistent with the fact that a Bridge is deployed. If you've ever been persuaded to configure WiFi details into the system then:
3/ Remove the WiFi credentials via the 'reset' button at Advanced Settings/Wireless Setup.[/quote]
No credentials there - I took that out previously at Support's suggestion. I get the "Set up Sonos on your Wi-Fi" screen, "Let's get Sonos running on your wireless network"
thanks all
After all the above, go to http://IP_address_of_Play1:1400/support/review (get the IP from About My Sonos System). Open Network Matrix and post a screenshot.
I'd also like to see confirmation of what the EoP is being used for. It can be a silver bullet, but at other times it can be hugely frustrating. Basically if one doesn't have a management app/console that reveals the state of the EoP connections one has only a rough idea about what it's doing.
I'd also like to see confirmation of what the EoP is being used for. It can be a silver bullet, but at other times it can be hugely frustrating. Basically if one doesn't have a management app/console that reveals the state of the EoP connections one has only a rough idea about what it's doing.
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