Has any posting here EVER produced anything ?



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Userlevel 3
Badge +5
Back to the original request 'Has anything posted here ever resulted in a change to the product?' and the follow up posts about the fact that individuals feel their personal requests have been ignored, let me add my 2 cents.

I am the product manager of a software company. No matter how many new features, enhancements and fixes we turn out it is the nature of the beast that a successful product will have users who can make suggestions faster than we can accommodate them. If we were able to have as many developers as we needed to keep up with the demand the price of the product would have to reflect it. If you think as I do that the Sonos kit is pretty expensive, you'd be alarmed at how much more expensive it would get.

So we are forced to make compromises and prioritize to use a scarce resource as best we can - and that inevitably disappoints.

There's also an issue with what's known as 'crossing the chasm' when your typical user moves from the early adopter to the early majority. These two audiences have very different expectations. The early adopters became used to the idea of their ideas tending to make it into the product, and to make it quickly. So they tend to be disappointed as the product matures.

The early majority expect it to work and to bea part of the fabric of life, which unfotunately means developing services to appeal to the masses. Like several who have posted here I too am only interested in my music library and radio. That's it for me but not for gen 'yy' I suspect.

All the ideas I have seen are individually brilliant but for me there is one overrriding consideration which trumps all else. Stability, stability, stability. The telecoms industry works to a principal of 99.999% uptime. In other word in a typical year a user will accept no more than 5 minutes of downtime. That when they pick up the handset they get dial tone.

That's what I want out of my music system and I would forego anything for that.

OK, I lied. There is another thing. Quality. I can hear the difference between flac and mpcrap sorry mp3. 🙂
Userlevel 2
LOL are you a lawyer?


That's different from them claiming it works in the region though.

I'm not sure what the advertising laws are in Australia, but if you (or moondy) really believe it is false advertising then you to take it to whatever advertising authority there is in Australia.

I can tell you that if you approached the ASA in the UK they wouldn't consider this as false advertising.

I will also point out that there are also civil laws that protect companies and individuals against false accusations being made against them in public. As such I suggest that people, in general, need to be more careful about what they accuse companies and others of in public. Unless they can prove those accusations to be true, they risk being sued by the company they are accusing.

I doubt that Sonos would take such a hard line, but making false accusations against companies is a dangerous pastime as some of them can overreact.

Cheers,

Keith
Userlevel 4
Badge +1
Hello,

Pandora is now available in Australia and New Zealand and can be added through the More Music menu.
Back to the original request 'Has anything posted here ever resulted in a change to the product?' and the follow up posts about the fact that individuals feel their personal requests have been ignored, let me add my 2 cents.

I am the product manager of a software company. No matter how many new features, enhancements and fixes we turn out it is the nature of the beast that a successful product will have users who can make suggestions faster than we can accommodate them. If we were able to have as many developers as we needed to keep up with the demand the price of the product would have to reflect it. If you think as I do that the Sonos kit is pretty expensive, you'd be alarmed at how much more expensive it would get.

So we are forced to make compromises and prioritize to use a scarce resource as best we can - and that inevitably disappoints.

There's also an issue with what's known as 'crossing the chasm' when your typical user moves from the early adopter to the early majority. These two audiences have very different expectations. The early adopters became used to the idea of their ideas tending to make it into the product, and to make it quickly. So they tend to be disappointed as the product matures.

The early majority expect it to work and to bea part of the fabric of life, which unfotunately means developing services to appeal to the masses. Like several who have posted here I too am only interested in my music library and radio. That's it for me but not for gen 'yy' I suspect.

All the ideas I have seen are individually brilliant but for me there is one overrriding consideration which trumps all else. Stability, stability, stability. The telecoms industry works to a principal of 99.999% uptime. In other word in a typical year a user will accept no more than 5 minutes of downtime. That when they pick up the handset they get dial tone.

That's what I want out of my music system and I would forego anything for that.

OK, I lied. There is another thing. Quality. I can hear the difference between flac and mpcrap sorry mp3. :)


I loved your post.

It was a perfect explanation of what has become of the product..(and my feelings towards it)

As an early adopter I am now moving on to other things like 24/192 streaming, DSD playback off SD cards and other such ventures..

I'll still keep my Sonos system, but alas, it seems to me the product's focus has definitely moved onto pleasing the masses (look at all the different speaker options coming out etc) and away from hifi quality and an absolute obsession with 100% stability.

Some of us old timers of the product like me bob up now and again on this forum and try to stere the focus back to where the product all began: As a hi end piece of hifi (in those days it was one of the first redbook streamers to compete with the old CD transort way of doing things) Sonos in those days could only be purchased at a Hi fi (ie high street) retailer.

We try and suggest ways' of doing this, (how to return the focus of the product development back to where the fundamental goals were) but invariably get shot down..

We try to drum up some of the 'ol excitement but alas...

Anyway. Loved your post. It was eloquently put. It sums up my opinion of where Sonos is now as well. Certainly in my eyes anyway. Cheers.
Userlevel 1
We try and suggest ways' of doing this, (how to return the focus of the product development back to where the fundamental goals were) but invariably get shot down..

The fundamental goal of Sonos is to make money and grow the business, you don't do that by targeting 1% of the market.
The fundamental goal of Sonos is to make money and grow the business, you don't do that by targeting 1% of the market.

That's OK, I'm pretty sure it was not noticed that the "I loved your post" was in reply to a poster who values overall the current functionality and "Stability, stability, stability", and isn't interested in stuff for "gen 'yy'". 😃
Back to the original request 'Has anything posted here ever resulted in a change to the product?' and the follow up posts about the fact that individuals feel their personal requests have been ignored, let me add my 2 cents.

I am the product manager of a software company. No matter how many new features, enhancements and fixes we turn out it is the nature of the beast that a successful product will have users who can make suggestions faster than we can accommodate them. If we were able to have as many developers as we needed to keep up with the demand the price of the product would have to reflect it. If you think as I do that the Sonos kit is pretty expensive, you'd be alarmed at how much more expensive it would get.

So we are forced to make compromises and prioritize to use a scarce resource as best we can - and that inevitably disappoints.

There's also an issue with what's known as 'crossing the chasm' when your typical user moves from the early adopter to the early majority. These two audiences have very different expectations. The early adopters became used to the idea of their ideas tending to make it into the product, and to make it quickly. So they tend to be disappointed as the product matures.

The early majority expect it to work and to bea part of the fabric of life, which unfotunately means developing services to appeal to the masses. Like several who have posted here I too am only interested in my music library and radio. That's it for me but not for gen 'yy' I suspect.

All the ideas I have seen are individually brilliant but for me there is one overrriding consideration which trumps all else. Stability, stability, stability. The telecoms industry works to a principal of 99.999% uptime. In other word in a typical year a user will accept no more than 5 minutes of downtime. That when they pick up the handset they get dial tone.

That's what I want out of my music system and I would forego anything for that.

OK, I lied. There is another thing. Quality. I can hear the difference between flac and mpcrap sorry mp3. :)

Well said Sir! Agree with EVERYTHING in your post.


OK, I lied. There is another thing. Quality. I can hear the difference between flac and mpcrap sorry mp3. :)


Me too. I'm getting on in years (:() but I have no difficulty in telling the difference between a well encoded 256 mp3 and a lossless rip, or the original CD. At 320 I don't get it right 100% but the large majority of the time.

There are one or two websites* which will serve tracks in a random blind way which are quite fun to try. One of my kids was astounded recently that I was able to get so many right where he could hear no difference :D

*[SIZE="1"]I have a very high end soundcard/speaker combo on my PC by the way.[/size]
Userlevel 2
Interesting thread and one that people who grew up with early 'Hi-Fi' might well smile with wry amusement.
When I was much younger with a Garrard sp25 with SME arm, a Cambridge p40 a couple of AR speakers and a stack of black vinyl, the way to improve was to buy something else on the upgrade path to Neverland.

Now it seems that although people don't expect their hardware to be upgraded for nothing, they do expect all software upgrades and enhancements (which does carry hefty development costs) must be free and the cost of development is paid for by future customers irrespective of the shoot for the moon wish list.
Sonos could take a leaf out if Microsoft's book, although please Sonos i'm not advocating this, and charge when they release an upgrade or improved desktop controller.
If you don't want to pay for it then stick with what you bought originally.

If I build someone a house I don't expect to keep going back at no cost to add new bits to it just because the owner wants them.
But then just call me old fashioned
Userlevel 3
Badge +1
Interesting thread and one that people who grew up with early 'Hi-Fi' might well smile with wry amusement.
When I was much younger with a Garrard sp25 with SME arm, a Cambridge p40 a couple of AR speakers and a stack of black vinyl, the way to improve was to buy something else on the upgrade path to Neverland.

Now it seems that although people don't expect their hardware to be upgraded for nothing, they do expect all software upgrades and enhancements (which does carry hefty development costs) must be free and the cost of development is paid for by future customers irrespective of the shoot for the moon wish list.
Sonos could take a leaf out if Microsoft's book, although please Sonos i'm not advocating this, and charge when they release an upgrade or improved desktop controller.
If you don't want to pay for it then stick with what you bought originally.

If I build someone a house I don't expect to keep going back at no cost to add new bits to it just because the owner wants them.
But then just call me old fashioned


+1
Strange some people take it for granted that a product needs feature updates all the time after purchage and at no costs.
I'm happy Sonos focus on reliability improvements and I see each new feature that comes along as a bonus.
Userlevel 2
While I do understand your points. I don't particularly agree since things are constantly evolving. The world changes as our customs.

What was true 10y ago might not be true today. Consumer expectations are evolving as companies set new standards when delivering new products. Nowadays, lots of things are getting "softwarized" and most companies ship regularly new software free/paid updates.

While Sonos ships free updates. It just feels like, for some, while it is highly requested, it takes ages for them to take something under consideration and Sonos rep do not communicate much on some user requests whatever they are.

Lately, they've made a move on the ask.sonos.com and I appreciated this because it feels like they are trying to organize people requests in a more effective way to focus their development efforts in a quick-win manner. After all, their business is about keeping customer's satisfaction high while staying true to their core ideas of their line of products.

And moreover, they start to communicate towards the user with post getting status such as "Under consideration"
This is a real improvement and if they do take advantage of this new approach, maybe we won't see anyone posting on this thread again.
If we use Apple as a very profitable example company, they are evolving their products at a rapid pace. Legacy products are supported for a relatively short period. I have an iTouch that I think is about three years old that I cannot update to the latest software. I bought the iTouch as a control device, not a music player. It is becoming difficult to use the iTouch in this context because the control apps are assuming that I have the latest iOS.

We don't yet know what the ultimate SONOS legacy support time frame will be, but it is already longer than Apple. I reluctantly bought that iTouch.

Last year SONOS invested considerable energy updating the internals of all of the controllers to reflect current practice, operating systems, and user interface expectations. This did not result in a long list of new features, but it built the platform for future feature additions at a more rapid pace. This was a lot of very expensive work.

If you observe the past rhythm of SONOS developments, a cycle of feature updates usually follows a major hardware release. In the coming months I think that we'll see some new features.
Userlevel 2
i am having same problem. can not post new thread.
The major issue on this forum (as on many other support forums out there) is that it is mostly one-way, community talk. Very rarely someone from the company addresses concerns and issues. It looks like a black box, that has little to none dialog with its community.
sebekz,

Here it is users helping users and minimal interaction with SONOS staff. Go to ask.sonos if you want interaction.
Userlevel 1
The major issue on this forum (as on many other support forums out there) is that it is mostly one-way, community talk. Very rarely someone from the company addresses concerns and issues. It looks like a black box, that has little to none dialog with its community.

That's because this isn't the official Sonos forum, if you want to talk to Sonos try ask.sonos.com.
I won't be placing them on the master list until they are released, but the following have been recently marked as "Planned" at ask.sonos:

Add SoundCloud Support to Sonos

Add the Amazon Cloud music service for EU users please.

Play Full Stereo Through PLAY:3 Satellites Bonded with PLAYBAR

Pause/stop streaming when a zone or group is muted

Allow controllers to pair with multiple home systems

Ability to star songs in Sonos

CONNECT:AMP for surround channels from the PLAYBAR.
I won't be placing them on the master list.... [snip]
ROTFL. You can put your feet up, as this is automated by Sonos now.
https://ask.sonos.com/sonos/ideas/completed

I wonder how they are going to persist the star/unstar ratings? I suppose that it is just a "special" Sonos playlist.
ROTFL. You can put your feet up, as this is automated by Sonos now.
https://ask.sonos.com/sonos/ideas/completed

I wonder how they are going to persist the star/unstar ratings? I suppose that it is just a "special" Sonos playlist.


The "star/unstar" request is specific to Spotify.
The "star/unstar" request is specific to Spotify.
You sure?
There's nothing in John's post mentioning Spotify.
It could have general applicability, ie. being able to mark a currently playing track for some action.
You sure?
There's nothing in John's post mentioning Spotify.
It could have general applicability, ie. being able to mark a currently playing track for some action.


After re-reading, the OP is unclear. They state they want it to "star songs when using Sonos similar to how this works in Spotify where you can star songs" which led me to believe they wanted Sonos' Spotify to mimic the browser Spotify, but the rest of the post is unclear. I guess we'll find out soon.
After re-reading, the OP is unclear. They state they want it to "star songs when using Sonos similar to how this works in Spotify where you can star songs" which led me to believe they wanted Sonos' Spotify to mimic the browser Spotify, but the rest of the post is unclear. I guess we'll find out soon.

Actually, if it's spotify based, it sounds like the thumbs up/down that's available with slacker.... so that seems possible, provided spotify exposes the right calls.....
Userlevel 2
Hi,

Did not read the whole thread but just to let you know SONOS do take time to help people with problems.
Just pick up your phone and ask the guy on the phone to look into your system. I did and I found out there are some skillful people out there working with SONOS.
Oh yes, and its free of charge...

So stop whining and pick up your phones..!

Chris
Userlevel 1
Badge +1
Hi,

Did not read the whole thread but just to let you know SONOS do take time to help people with problems.
Just pick up your phone and ask the guy on the phone to look into your system. I did and I found out there are some skillful people out there working with SONOS.
Oh yes, and its free of charge...

So stop whining and pick up your phones..!

Chris


I will second that, their phone service is fantastic, even when its my router problems they have gone out of their way to fix it. Without phone support i would be stuffed.
Dozens:

User submitted suggestions that have come to fruition:

Rhapsody client for ZP
Song/artist display in queue
"Are you sure you..." messages
Search Mode in the Controller
That 50K limit...
iTunes Integration with Sonos
"Replace Queue" Button/Menu option
Selective queue clearing.
Lower Cost Controller
Podcasts...
More information on Internet Radio screen
Sonos approved wireless range extender (Bridge)
ZP100 / ZP80 bundle
Feature request: Play Now "OR" Add to Queue
Clock - LED - Bedroom
PETITION - "Rhapsody Search" - Please Sign
PETITION - "Replace Queue" - Please Sign
Ability to remove multiple tracks from the queue
Support Last.FM
Deeper Rhapsody integration, please?
Rhapsody - Search current artist
FEATURE SUGGESTION: Artwork for Internet Radio Stations
Please “Play Next!!!”…
Isn't it about time for a new Controller..
New controller feature with Rhapsody?
Radio Logos
Ditching my Sonos Controllers for iPod Touch
Request to Add Last FM capability
Controller software for wifi enabled iPhone / iPod
Countdown Timer for iPod Application?
Timer and Alarm with iPod
Address book of main URL Internet radios
Can I see the TIME somewhere always?
Smaller, lighter controller
iphone - album and tracks view to show artist and album/track title
Touch screen controller?
S5
S5 pairing
Easy Zone Switching
Individual Daily Alarms
Color options for Sonos hardware (Black)
Crossfade
i button
Android controller
MOG support
Alarm/Timer Support (Android)
Spotify
Airplay
Auto line-in
Smaller version of S5
Slacker support
Sirius Canada support
Color options for Sonos hardware (Partially implemented)
Android support for Amazon Kindle Fire
Deezer support in AUS and NZ
New Desktop Controller
Better search in Desktop Controller
Ctrl-click select in Desktop Controller
Drag and drop in Desktop Controller
Better Link/Unlink in Desktop Controller
Mini-Player
See Album Art Without Hovering
Consistent Look/Feel With Handhelds
Android connect to Sonosnet
Transport bar (at the top of the app) has been brightened to make it easier to read (Desktop Controller)
Mini Controller can now be resized (Desktop Controller)
Better support for small-screen desktop and laptop computers (Desktop Controller)
Queue pane size can now be expanded or collapsed (Desktop Controller)
Folder-level music share support allows you to point Sonos to a specific music folder on your computer
Sonos brand subwoofer
Songza support
Android user interface has been optimized for both 7” and 10” tablets, including full landscape mode support.
Supports Retina display for the new iPad, iPhone 4 and iPhone 4S.
Hardware button volume support is available for Apple devices running iOS 4.3 or higher.
DAR.fm Support
Amazon Cloud support
Ask.sonos cutomer feedback site.
Stream music content straight from your iOS device to your Sonos system
7Digital Music Service now available on Sonos
Pandora support in AU, NZ
Sonos Favorites
Pandora Radio Genre stations
3rd Party App Integration
Sonos Controller for Android Widget
Sonos Controller for Android Notifications
Sonos Controller for Android Omnipresent Search
Sonos Controller for iPhone now optimized for iPhone 5
More Alarm Sources - All Sonos Music Services are now available as selections for Sonos Alarms
New Playbar
Create playlists without using the queue—simply select Sonos Playlists and choose New Playlist
Add tracks to a playlist from any available source by choosing a track and selecting Add to… Sonos Playlist
Easily edit playlists by selecting a Sonos playlist and choosing Edit to delete or move tracks within the playlist
Create and edit Spotify playlists using a Sonos controller
Access and play music from Spotify playlist folders directly using a Sonos controller.
When setting an alarm, now you can select a music service you’re subscribed to in addition to the music choices you already have
The Android notification feature has been improved
Demo video. Select Show Demo from the Sonos app when you’re away from your Sonos system
Stream music content straight from your Android device to your Sonos system.


How on earth did you compile such a voluminous list like this? Do you work for Sonos or is the info scattered throughout the forum?