End of Software Support - Clarifications

End of Software Support - Clarifications
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S
Userlevel 3
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I bought Sonos in 2004 and have been buying ever since...I bought it as an easy solution to put music in rooms where I wanted.  I bought it as an easy connectivity solution….I bought it as hardware; just like my 20 year B & W’s I have connected to my tv.  The TV has changed many times in the past 20 years and not once did I have to update my speakers with some sort software update.

 

Again I bought Sonos as a hardware solution and they have turned into a software solution and frankly I’m pissed.  Just like I was pissed spending $400 on the CR100 and whatever on the CR200 only to have them discontinued as well...but at least they gave you a free app that did the job.

 

In 2004 Sonos wasn’t cheap….it’s still not.  I thought I was paying for a premium product (hardware) like my B&W’s but as we learned yesterday...it is not.

 

Will I be buying future Sonos products?  No never again.  Because they just set precedence that any future products are not guaranteed to be obsolete in the future, even that Move you just bought yesterday.  I wanted a hardware solution to my music...I didn’t ask for a software solution.  So I’ll run wires to my rooms and buy some speakers...you know like in the old days and never have to worry about an update ever again...because you know, they’ll just work.

 

L
Userlevel 5
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Does anyone remember seeing a little sticker on the bottom of the Sonos box when they saw it on the shelf at Dixons, Richer Sounds, Bestbuy or B&H ?

If so, did the label say, in the tiniest of fonts say: 

“Warning: This product will only work for 5 years then be deactivated by Sonos” ?

I guess I should have read the small print...

S
Userlevel 3
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Interesting that with all the furore ongoing there’s no hint of crisis management PR getting involved. Leaves the impression that this reaction has been factored in and doesn’t require any additional handling.

So I think that it’s just a case of  them being fully prepared to lose a few legacy customers - who are no longer buying much anyway….

what about the new customers who see this….would you now buy into a solution that might be obsolete within a few years.  I think Sonos doesn’t realize is most people see them as a hardware company.  Would you go out and buy hardwired speakers for your entertainment system knowing in 5 years they might not work with your existing setup?  

U

This is only the beginning of the end of Sonos, I really loved my Treo phone too, but it had to die, as well as Sonos with their “hundry” decisions.

 

When a brand, such as this, decides to “kidnap” ans expect a ransom from their loyal customers,specially when such brand may not be the only one, it is only asking to be in the back drawers of innovators. GREAT JOB Sonos, my money will go somewhere else

 

 

S
Userlevel 2

I see the smart speaker thing as just a fad… but they feel they need to chase that carrot instead of concentrate on the customers that made them grow.  They would have done better just getting the other smart speaker products to work WITH Sonos, instead of trying to compete.  But google has their own expensive less capable speaker, so who knows *shrug*

T
Userlevel 1

I USED to be a huge advocate of Sonos. I’ve gotten numerous friends into the Sonos family and now this?!?!?!??  Absolutely pathetic!!!! The 30% discount is like a slap in the face to existing loyal customers. 

pwt
Userlevel 7
Badge +20

Interesting that with all the furore ongoing there’s no hint of crisis management PR getting involved. Leaves the impression that this reaction has been factored in and doesn’t require any additional handling.

So I think that it’s just a case of  them being fully prepared to lose a few legacy customers - who are no longer buying much anyway….

what about the new customers who see this….would you now buy into a solution that might be obsolete within a few years.  I think Sonos doesn’t realize is most people see them as a hardware company.  Would you go out and buy hardwired speakers for your entertainment system knowing in 5 years they might not work with your existing setup?  

Exactly this. The Sonos brand will be fundamentally repositioned in consumers’ minds.

Also breaks two of the key value propositions Sonos asserts: ‘whole house music’ (not if you have to create separate groups of devices), and ‘add to your system over time’ (not if the newer equipment does not interoperate with the older).

4 x P:5 | Sub | 4 x P:1 | 3 x Connect | 2 x Boost | Connect:Amp | 2 x One | Amp | Move | Port
L
Userlevel 5
Badge +1

I USED to be a huge advocate of Sonos. I’ve gotten numerous friends into the Sonos family and now this?!?!?!??  Absolutely pathetic!!!! The 30% discount is like a slap in the face to existing loyal customers. 

Same here, I feel guilty for recommending this to friends and family, they will lose money because of my bad advice. I have huge regret.

A

Interesting that with all the furore ongoing there’s no hint of crisis management PR getting involved. Leaves the impression that this reaction has been factored in and doesn’t require any additional handling.

It seems clear from the SEC filing that they were expecting considerable flak about this announcement, and have factored it in to their business plan. So I think that it’s just a case of  them being fully prepared to lose a few legacy customers - who are no longer buying much anyway….


it may have been factored in but I’m fairly sure not at this level, and now the media outlets are starting to show interest this is rather embarrassing for sonos

So far, maybe a couple of thousand disgruntled people - but how many customers do they actually have?

A

…..I could have bought decent 'dumb' gear and used cheaper network gear to provide the 'smart' connectivity. I will never buy sonos gear again.

A very sensible approach, IMHO….

J
Userlevel 3
Badge +3

 

 

I use my system to play my own music, set alarms and to listen to Radio using TuneIn and have little interest in music streaming services. If I’m honest I find the Play 1s to be virtually as good as the Play 5s in terms of the sound quality but the best thing about the 5s is the line-in function and headphone socket, features that I’ve found very useful but which were not incorporated into the less expensive speakers.

 

Yesterday’s e mail from Sonos has now basically informed me that the bulk of my system will no longer be supported from May 2020 and that if I continue to use it in combination with my Play 1s and Beam they too will be unable to receive updates meaning that over time the entire system will lose some functionality.

 

I simply cannot afford to replace my entire Sonos system so my knee-jerk reaction is to list the Beam on Ebay whilst it’s still new enough to achieve a sale price roughly equal to what I paid for it and to then allow my system to run until it fails and, in the meantime research what alternatives are available for someone, like me, who simply wants to listen to my CD collection.

 

I will however wait until May to see what the as yet unannounced work-around to run legacy speakers on a separate Sonos system involves.

 

My faith in Sonos right now is shattered. Whilst I understand that nothing lasts forever I don’t think it unreasonable to expect very, very expensive equipment that can still work as it was initially intended to should no longer be updatable purely because the developers want their customers to alter their listening habits. So Sonos please tell me why I should even consider buying more of your products or recommend them to others.

 

In comparison to many other concerned Sonos owners I am quite fortunate as my only legacy products are 3 x Play 5s + Bridge,  all now over 7 years old.  Unlike later models these (Gen1) 5s have “line in” functionality through which they can be hooked up to any device with a headphone socket and then used as standalone speakers for TVs, mp3 players, CD players, Tablets etc. I occasionally deliver music presentations to small groups of people and take one of my Play 5s to the venue where I connect it to my iPad from where I can then play the appropriate music.

 

Now I’m not too technically minded so can anyone say whether or not they think that function will or will not require further updates?  If they will continue to work indefinitely in that capacity then, although far from fulfilling the entire range of functions for which they were designed and sold to me, there will still be a use to which they can be put. This in itself might be sufficient reason for some owners to hesitate before considering the dreaded ‘recycle mode’. I have ‘retired’ TVs in 3 bedrooms that would benefit from better sound - just a thought.

 

I said in my earlier post that to me the difference in sound quality between my Play 5s and Play 1s is barely discernible but I know that as an ‘older’ person that is more likely to be down to my hearing. However, that being the case if, and at the moment it’s a big ‘if’, I do eventually decide to replace my Play 5s with Sonos equipment it will be with the significantly cheaper “1s” and they will be bought from where (and when) the price is right - Black Friday, or Jan sales (maybe even cheaper than a 30% trade up discount). By their latest proposal Sonos now seem to be suggesting to their customers that their products are no longer investments in a system that can be built upon but disposables with an anticipated lifespan of just 5 years or so, in which case why buy the expensive speakers if the cheaper ones do the job just as well? Maybe even the IKEA Symfonisk speakers will suffice, they have been getting quite good reviews.

 

Of course Sonos, I would prefer a solution that would allow me to continue using my legacy speakers, until they reach their natural end, for the purpose I bought them, streaming my locally stored music collection and Radio stations throughout my home, nothing more, nothing less.

A
Userlevel 5
Badge +3

Robert Scoble has lost his mind over this announcement. It’s always good for a company like SONOS to lose an influencer like Scoble.

https://twitter.com/Scobleizer/status/1219799408973213697

O
Userlevel 3

Sonos have removed any incentive for the many of us with ‘legacy’ setups to buy new Sonos speakers. Even if you have no anger towards them for their decisions, there’s no brand loyalty to fall back on when you’re starting again. I think most people would look at what else is out there, which is what I will be doing. I was so close to snapping up some more Play:1s or Ones, but I don’t think I will anymore, there’s no point. Sonos is a legacy brand for me now.

 

(30% isn’t an incentive).

A
Userlevel 5
Badge +3

Interesting that with all the furore ongoing there’s no hint of crisis management PR getting involved. Leaves the impression that this reaction has been factored in and doesn’t require any additional handling.

It seems clear from the SEC filing that they were expecting considerable flak about this announcement, and have factored it in to their business plan. So I think that it’s just a case of  them being fully prepared to lose a few legacy customers - who are no longer buying much anyway….


it may have been factored in but I’m fairly sure not at this level, and now the media outlets are starting to show interest this is rather embarrassing for sonos

So far, maybe a couple of thousand disgruntled people - but how many customers do they actually have?

People are still finding out. The email I got went to my spam folder. Friends I have with gear didnt know until I told them

M
Userlevel 2

Sonos, we all hate you. And apparently you don't care about that. Eventually you will.

 

I was angry enough about bricking the CR100 - that turned me from loving your products and recommending them to everyone, to telling anyone who will listen to avoid them at all costs. My young sons could use those old controllers to play bedtime stories in their rooms. The only way to do that now would be to give them tablets or phones to use in their rooms, and that is out of the question. You have also effectively bricked several older iPods and iPhones which were being used as controllers, when new updates suddenly refused to run on them. 

 

Now you are telling me that the 4 ZPs I have connected to B&W and Mission speakers are going the same way. I don't believe for a second that you will allow the legacy zones to be grouped with the ‘not obsolete quite yet’ zones. If I can't play music across all zones, then the system is no longer of any use to me. Why on earth would I ever consider swapping for newer Sonos equipment, when that will clearly be bricked in another year or two? I am building an extension which would require 3 new zones, but I would have to be a complete fool to consider another Sonos product at this point. 

 

Maybe this attitude is acceptable in the US (though I doubt it), but forcing customers to throw away perfectly good equipment and buy more is completely against the current eco-considerations in the U.K. I am not an eco evangelist, but this is completely the wrong direction to take, and your customers will not back you.

 

 

J
Userlevel 3
Badge +1

Sonos.

Your products should last for 100 years. Just like a record and record player or a compact disc and amp, etc. As long as there is electricity and WiFi around. 

It is fine if the so called legacy products don't get smarter, but they need to continue to work as they do, with the services they currently support, including to support those services as they evolve. Maybe you can sell a little affordable at cost device, that people can add to their system, that can make that happen, since you apparently didn't think ahead when you designed the so called legacy products. This add on or dongle or whatever you want to make, to make it work should cost no more than 50$.

Also, it should be possible to get upgrades on the newer products, as promised, without affecting functionality with the so called legacy products. Basically meaning they should all still work together as one system, where you are able to control them together in the app, group them, etc. 

This should be the announcement you plan for May, but should have given now, instead of this vague end of life announcement, leaving everybody confused, speculsting and full of distain for Sonos" business practices. 

J
Userlevel 3
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Patrick are you sure this is not a Money Grab…  Look at Q3 EPS  

 

 

Mmmmmm…  Also all you Loyal Sonos customers it’s all about the stockholders…  But shouldn’t the Stockholders be worried that Patrick Spence is running the show…  Or did everyone forget and I quote from the Proxy statement.

“ Mr. Spence spent 14 years at Research In Motion Limited, a consumer electronics company and the developer of the BlackBerry device, in a variety of senior roles, including most recently serving as the SeniorVice President and the Managing Director of Global Sales and Regional Marketing from August 2011 until June 2012.”  

Where’s blackberry today?  Is Sonos starting down this same path?  

J

I do wonder how and why this is legal. 

 

Setting aside the costs associated with being forced, at some point in the near future, to replace the equipment surely the environmental impact alone should make someone act.

Basically throwing away perfectly good equipment for no reason other than greed.

 

We won't be 'upgrading' we will use our existing systems until they stop then try a different system....but I suspect this will.be a common approach by many manufacturers,  Apply, Samsung.....…

I wonder if Sonos will acknowledge this thread???

I also wonder how much damage this will do.

 

 

L
Userlevel 1

-First bought a just released Symfonisk, like it very much😃

-Then last month a Beam, perfect TV sound!

-End of December: Found a second hand Connect Amp (still expensive, "few years old"), loved it with my Mini Pods.…

Now my Connect Amp is a legacy product, how disappointing...... 

Trading up is a farce, 30 % discount only at Sonos online... The new Amp €700, has become €100 more expensive this month. So online trading up discount is 15 % without a retailer in between...... That's pure profit for Sonos!!!

Sorry but I'm not going support this deplorable company ☹️

So, my plan: sending back the Beam (still possible 😁), selling the connect amp with some loss and only keeping the € 100 Ikea Symfonisk. 

GOOD LUCK SONOS....... 

 

 

K
Userlevel 2

Sonos no longer has a place in my home. Such a bad business decision. 

K
Userlevel 6
Badge +3

For 10 years I’ve been accumulating Sonos Audio equipment while expanding wireless audio throughout my home. I did this because Sonos advertised and marketed their Whole Home Audio System as a way to hear music/audio throughout your home without running speaker wires.  The products were marketed and sold in hi-end Stereo/Audio stores as well as the HiFi/audio departments of better electronics stores.  The sales staff were trained by Sonos to push the quality of the sound, the beauty of the speakers, and the flexibility of the whole home audio solution.  This BS about Sonos products being outmoded/throw away computer products is just that... BS!  It’s a pivot to get all of us to shift our view of Sonos as just another piece of electronics that is outdated by updates and eventually abandoned ever after a very short 4-5 years after purchase.  This is AUDIO gear!  It’s sold and marketed as AUDIO gear, it’s not sold in as a computer, a phone, a throw-away junked chunk of electronics.  It’s marketed as a way to distribute SOUND (sonos) throughout your home and/or office/business. 

Don’t let the clowns at Sonos or some of their shills online get you to believe it’s time to further degrade our planet while pilfering our purse because they don’t want to keep your expensive investment in AUDIO equipment going (like you can with Amps, Speakers, Turntables, Mixers, and on).   This is clearly just a ploy and it’s a cynical and heartless money grab.  Don’t buy it and don’t buy anything from a once great company that is this dishonest!

Back to listening to music! 

H
Userlevel 2

NEW SONOS PRODUCTS LAST FOR FIVE YEARS

 

That is the message to your customers. 

But wait, it is even worse:

IF YOU BUY A BRAND NEW PRODUCT TO EXTEND YOUR EXISTING SYSTEM, THE UPCOMING KILL-DATE MAY BE MUCH CLOSER, E.G. FIVE YEARS FROM DATE OF PURCHASE OF YOUR FIRST SONOS PRODUCT. 

If you are planning to buy a new SONOS product and e.g. have a 4 year old speaker, your resulting system MAY HAVE ONLY 1 YEAR LEFT before updates stop. WHO WOULD IN THEIR RIGHT MIND THEN BUY IT, if they know this? A lot of your customers have had exactly this experience, buying a new product in 2019 and adding it to an existing system which is becoming outdated in May 2020. 

 

You can respond with all the 30% bullshit you want, the above is the message. YOU HAVE LOST ALL YOUR TRUST WITH THIS MOVE. When people buy expensive quality products like SONOS instead of cheeper options it is because they typically argue with themselves that quality pays off, also considering the environment. The exact opposite is true with SONOS. It even seems to be your company policy when you discontinue sonos connect as it was “introduced” in 2011, but - magically - does not discontinue 100% identical sonos connect sold after 2015? Proof right there, you are not forced to do it this way due to “ageing tech”, the connect pre-2015 is only not supported since you have decided on a crappy policy.   

 

The major lack of understanding you show for this topic now in 2020 is simply astonishing, considering the focus on re-use and reduced waste. IT IS A DISGRACE. 

 

Fix this mess, CEO Patric Spence. It is not too late. Then you can sleep well instead of your current sweat over loosing all what your employees have helped to build over many years simply due to your horrible decision.   

 

If you don't fix it, you should know that most of us have lost any possible motivation to extend our SONOS systems since we FORESEE YOUR NEXT KILL-MAIL. 

P
Userlevel 5
Badge +1

Interesting that with all the furore ongoing there’s no hint of crisis management PR getting involved. Leaves the impression that this reaction has been factored in and doesn’t require any additional handling.

It seems clear from the SEC filing that they were expecting considerable flak about this announcement, and have factored it in to their business plan. So I think that it’s just a case of  them being fully prepared to lose a few legacy customers - who are no longer buying much anyway….


it may have been factored in but I’m fairly sure not at this level, and now the media outlets are starting to show interest this is rather embarrassing for sonos

So far, maybe a couple of thousand disgruntled people - but how many customers do they actually have?

True they have millions of customers but it’s usually only a small minority who go on discussion boards. Sonos say that 37% of their sales are to repeat customers. Can’t see that being maintained. 

Perhaps more significantly, although Sonos spend millions on advertising, I would guess that the revenue generated by word of mouth recommendations (the best sort of advertising) is worth even more.

I think the current modest drop in share price reflects the fact that most investors haven’t cottoned on yet to the unfolding disaster. Big drop in repeat customers, and word of mouth going negative.

Next quarter’s results should make interesting reading!

N
Userlevel 1

Amstrad

AOL

Blackberry 

Betamax

Alta Vista

Pebble

Napster

MySpace

Dream Cast

Tivo etc etc! 
In business, customer support is an ethos. It seems more and more difficult now to find a market leader who has an ethos that is compatible with the digital world of scrutiny and vocal freedom that they actually operate in.

 

T

Looks like I'll be another looking for an alternative.  Not a great move Sonos, how to alienate your customer in one quick step.

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