was reading about your new IPO and in the article it said you would no longer be supporting some of your older speakers in the near future, what speakers do they anticipate no longer supporting?
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“We expect that in the near to intermediate term, this backward compatibility will no longer be practical or cost-effective, and we may decrease or discontinue service for our older products,” says Sonos in a recent SEC filing.
I doubt you will get a definitive answer from Sonos. I imagine the older products would be sundowned first. Sonos products in order of release are:
ZP100
ZP80
Bridge
ZP120/Connect:Amp
ZP90/Connect
Play:5 1st gen (aka S5)
Play:3
Playbar
Play:1
Play:5 2nd gen
Boost
Playbase
One
Beam
ZP100
ZP80
Bridge
ZP120/Connect:Amp
ZP90/Connect
Play:5 1st gen (aka S5)
Play:3
Playbar
Play:1
Play:5 2nd gen
Boost
Playbase
One
Beam
Certain capabilities of the very oldest products have already been compromised, presumably to free up space for newer, more important, functionality.
For example ZP100/ZP80 are no longer able to perform an incremental library index update themselves. If there are newer, more capable, devices in the system the controller will automatically use one of those to execute an incremental library scan. If there are no such devices present, ZP100/ZP80 will make a time-consuming full scan instead.
Obviously Airplay support can only be offered in the most recent devices (Playbase, One, Beam) due to its hardware platform requirements. The solution is to group older players with one of the Airplay targets.
I think we could see more of this 'load-sharing' going on within a heterogeneous Sonos system.
For example ZP100/ZP80 are no longer able to perform an incremental library index update themselves. If there are newer, more capable, devices in the system the controller will automatically use one of those to execute an incremental library scan. If there are no such devices present, ZP100/ZP80 will make a time-consuming full scan instead.
Obviously Airplay support can only be offered in the most recent devices (Playbase, One, Beam) due to its hardware platform requirements. The solution is to group older players with one of the Airplay targets.
I think we could see more of this 'load-sharing' going on within a heterogeneous Sonos system.
so all one would need to do is purchase a newer generation for updates and the existing equipment would still be functional within the system? I am sort of old school and do not use the Sonos with Alexa and or google, but just use my i phone and ipad to stream mostly amazon and pandora
That's the way it is now. It is not out of the question that there will come a tipping point where the oldest devices just cannot keep up and they will be retired (as was done with the CR100). We are not there yet, and Sonos does its best to avoid it, but one cannot really expect 13+ year old electronics to stay viable forever.
[quote=jgatie]one cannot really expect 13+ year old electronics to stay viable
Why not? If someone knocked on my door and explained that Sony had decided I had gotten enough value out of my plasma TV and they were here to take it" I'd feel 'robbed'. That TV's picture is every bit as good as my OLED. For a company to decide that I no longer get to use a product is wrong. And, please don't start the the 'A Sonos speaker is too complex to maintain' spew. They've introduced the complexity out of desire to change the nature of the product. Nor is the "That's the way modern products work" a defense. Intentionally obsoleting products is wrong.
Why not? If someone knocked on my door and explained that Sony had decided I had gotten enough value out of my plasma TV and they were here to take it" I'd feel 'robbed'. That TV's picture is every bit as good as my OLED. For a company to decide that I no longer get to use a product is wrong. And, please don't start the the 'A Sonos speaker is too complex to maintain' spew. They've introduced the complexity out of desire to change the nature of the product. Nor is the "That's the way modern products work" a defense. Intentionally obsoleting products is wrong.
Mr. Flowerpot, you are obviously here trying to stir up an argument. I'll not be participating, so enjoy screaming at the wind.
Sonos is an integrated system that is constantly developing. Your TV is neither of those things. A worthless comparison. But then you know that.
I would like to know which gear I should dump now while it still has some value. Guessing the ZP80/ZP100's should go ASAP.
It's anyone's guess really. You could be pre-emptive and replace your zp's with comparable connects. However, Sonos could announced updated versions of the Connect tomorrow. It's a gamble either way.
I'd not dump anything but CR-100s, keep the rest of it until they offer a newer version with some new function that you really need.
I stocked up on Play 1s in anticipation of them going away but they haven't so far. My two ZP-80 still do everything I want and I'd sure hate to replace them with a Connect only to find they had a newer version in the works. Unless of course the new version has a mike, then I'd likely grab the newer Connects for insurance as my ZPs are really old.
I stocked up on Play 1s in anticipation of them going away but they haven't so far. My two ZP-80 still do everything I want and I'd sure hate to replace them with a Connect only to find they had a newer version in the works. Unless of course the new version has a mike, then I'd likely grab the newer Connects for insurance as my ZPs are really old.
I would guess all future products for Sonos are going to have mics built in. The Connect is a little different though since it has no speaker or connected speakers (Connect:amp). Therefore it needs it's own small built in speaker the same way that an Fire TV cube does, so that you're guaranteed to hear Alexa's response. It also feels like it would need some other additional functionality added to it to make it more integrated and useful for the receiver it's attached to.
In my case microphones on the connects would be pretty useless. Almost all of them are on racks down in the basement connected to amps. I am probably an edge case but I would imagine any custom home installation would also be in the same boat. I have 4-5 of the CR-100's but don't use them and trying to sell them has proven to be a waste of time.
@augustwest. I don't think you're on the edge at all with your use case. I wouldn't really have much use for mics on the connects either. However, I think there would be enough customers who would want to use the connect with a HT, out in the open, to warrant putting the mic in. It probably also sells well from a PR persepective, even if it's not useful for all. Since they already have the tech and the connect is due for a hardware upgrade, seems like it'd be a relatively easy thing to do.
augustwest, I'm surprised you didn't take advantage of the Sonos rebate for the CR-100 when Sonos dropped support for them. While there are a lot of the CR-100s for sale on ebay it looks like a lot of them are "no refund" offers, probably because buyers will be unhappy to discover they won't work with Sonos gear running current firmware.
But why disable a still working product? Give me a controller (app) that still works with my old gear and let me stay obsolete instead of killing my device entirely.
Sonos is facing severe resource constraints in some of their older gear, they seem to be willing to offer cut-back versions of their software for older devices but they have also given up on really old and constrained stuff like the CR-100.
I won't be happy to see my ZP-80s drop out of support but they have given me a lot of years already and if Sonos has a rebate program similar to the one for the CR-100 I won't be really unhappy unless they have a mike in the new version.
I won't be happy to see my ZP-80s drop out of support but they have given me a lot of years already and if Sonos has a rebate program similar to the one for the CR-100 I won't be really unhappy unless they have a mike in the new version.
I wasn't notified of the rebate by Sonos and I don't hang out on these forums very frequently.
The rebate is long over but if you didn't get notified it might be worth a call to Sonos support to see if there is anything they can do for you.
I'm a little sad at the idea that my speakers/connects could some day be put down due to old age. I have hifi that is many decades old and still works fine. I get that technology is moving but that doesn't mean I have to embrace losing equipment that I love before it naturally fails.
From a microphone in a connect perspective, I have two connects and a connect:amp and none of them would benefit from a microphone - they are all hidden away. My answer for this is an Echo Dot. That can be placed conveniently and gives all required functionality for me.
From a microphone in a connect perspective, I have two connects and a connect:amp and none of them would benefit from a microphone - they are all hidden away. My answer for this is an Echo Dot. That can be placed conveniently and gives all required functionality for me.
Any computer, and let's face it, the basis of the Sonos ecosystem is a computer in every speaker, can and will eventually be out of date. Memory, processing power, networking abilities all can become dated. I commend Sonos for doing all they can over the years for maintaining the software in such a way that there's been only one device that's been deemed as "not good enough".
Yes, I'll be unhappy when my old PLAY:5 gen 1 or PLAY:1s go out of date, much as I was when my iPhone originally went out of date. But Sonos continues to keep the longevity of their speakers much beyond what Apple does with their iPhones, so there's not a bunch I can complain about. They certainly don't force me to buy new speakers every other year (well, maybe slightly longer, but still).
Not looking forward to spending more money at some point, on the other hand, think of the features that might be part of a new software release that forces an older speaker out of the ecosystem. Might be interesting.
Yes, I'll be unhappy when my old PLAY:5 gen 1 or PLAY:1s go out of date, much as I was when my iPhone originally went out of date. But Sonos continues to keep the longevity of their speakers much beyond what Apple does with their iPhones, so there's not a bunch I can complain about. They certainly don't force me to buy new speakers every other year (well, maybe slightly longer, but still).
Not looking forward to spending more money at some point, on the other hand, think of the features that might be part of a new software release that forces an older speaker out of the ecosystem. Might be interesting.
Yes, but they only go out of date more quickly because Sonos keep changing the software... If they didn't change anything then it should keep going until the hardware fails. They also do nothing to help you keep it static at a particular version. If Sonos made it easier to run at a particular build - and to stay there - then it wouldn't be as bad. It's worse for some of us because other than Trueplay nothing worthwhile has been added to the software for some time - and the quality of the IF has gone sadly down hill.
My phone is a computer and works fine - and will continue to work fine using the same software until something dies. If I try and run more memory/processor intensive software on it, then understandably it might have problems - but the phone manufacturer doesn't force me to run them. Whilst some would say that Sonos doesn't force you either, the fact that you can't add a new device to an old software build is the killer - eventually you'll be in trouble.
So far sonos have been happy to keep everybody on latest release of software, only killing the cr100 and several customers iOS or android controllers. This guarantees future sales to ALL customers.
Since airplay2 has split the product line into ones that can handle it & those that can't, this is the first real time as voice could be overcome with Alexa devices.There may come a time when they will have to freeze old products on a classic version. They could still sell the matching version products from their website, but support would be a nightmare and need funding.
Or they could bring out a room device with a microphone and more processing power to "push" airplay2 and other coming developments to older stereo paired devices, priced a lot cheaper than a sonos one.
Since airplay2 has split the product line into ones that can handle it & those that can't, this is the first real time as voice could be overcome with Alexa devices.There may come a time when they will have to freeze old products on a classic version. They could still sell the matching version products from their website, but support would be a nightmare and need funding.
Or they could bring out a room device with a microphone and more processing power to "push" airplay2 and other coming developments to older stereo paired devices, priced a lot cheaper than a sonos one.
What one individual regards as an essential development is of no interest to someone else. We all have our own subset of use cases, and the suggestion in places on this thread that Sonos should make it easier to 'freeze' at a particular point is frankly barmy. They would have to support a multitude of legacy versions to keep a relatively small proportion of users happy.. They would be crazy to do this.
The other thing that gets overlooked is that Sonos is an integrated software and hardware environment in which speakers (old and new), controllers (on a variety of devices), networking and other third party devices have to work together. So please, no more 'my phone still works...' irrelevance.
The other thing that gets overlooked is that Sonos is an integrated software and hardware environment in which speakers (old and new), controllers (on a variety of devices), networking and other third party devices have to work together. So please, no more 'my phone still works...' irrelevance.
Also, if Sonos ever allowed you to stay at a particular version, the fact remains that the outside world keeps changing. You cannot tell me that the hue and cry from the "static at a particular version" folks would not be shaking the rafters the day the BBC changed their codec again and their frozen at version x.xx system suddenly loses the life's blood of Brits everywhere. Ditto for the Spotify changes, the AWS security changes, etc., etc.
Never mind those who want something shiny and new like Alexa and don't get it. Even the king of "static at a particular version", upstatemike seems to realize that the use case for someone who wants to stay static, and is willing to eventually lose all streaming capabilities, is slim to none, and slim left the building weeks ago.
Also, the very vocal CR100 thread had less than 500 unique posters (including those posting in the contrary), and I would guess the number of those who actually froze their system to be less than 200. With a couple million users out there, that's a use case of about 0.01%. No company is going to waste valuable resources on that kind of market, especially one which by giving them the option, they will never buy any more Sonos gear.
PS - And don't give me the disclaimer solution. The very notion that these folks want to remain where they are makes them the very first in line at the complaint desk when something doesn't work.
Never mind those who want something shiny and new like Alexa and don't get it. Even the king of "static at a particular version", upstatemike seems to realize that the use case for someone who wants to stay static, and is willing to eventually lose all streaming capabilities, is slim to none, and slim left the building weeks ago.
Also, the very vocal CR100 thread had less than 500 unique posters (including those posting in the contrary), and I would guess the number of those who actually froze their system to be less than 200. With a couple million users out there, that's a use case of about 0.01%. No company is going to waste valuable resources on that kind of market, especially one which by giving them the option, they will never buy any more Sonos gear.
PS - And don't give me the disclaimer solution. The very notion that these folks want to remain where they are makes them the very first in line at the complaint desk when something doesn't work.
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