In short, they don’t.    Turn off auto udates and reminders for both the hardware and  the app and you won’t even know there is an update.

I have auto updates turned off for every single piece of gear I own. Watches, phones, computers, Apple TV, and Sonos. If you re-read my original post, I’m saying the reason I know there’s an update is that the Arc quits playing sound. Every single time. 

So auto updated are turned off  on whichever app store you use?  I don't think you can turn it off specifically on the Sonos app in the Google Play Store, for example.

Turning off auto updates in the app is not sufficient.

Yes you can, per App (I think this was discussed a few months back maybe):

That really sounds like something is updating. It seems strange that it’s only been happening for a couple of months rather than since you started using Sonos: there’s been more than 10 updates in that time. Do you get any error/warning messages? 

Hi

I know many individuals such as yourself are not comfortable with updating their electronics. Without going into another discussion as to why I’ll offer this fact.

Not all updates are for feature enhancement. The majority of updates are to correct flaws or bugs that are sometimes introduced by the previous update itself. Before you say “ah ha” know that all bugs found in a firmware are not pervasive to each device the manufacturer has on the market. Although every device maybe offered the update not all devices will utilize it to full extent. 

For example iOS 16.0.2 is offered for my iPhone 12 but there are specific bug fixes included that my iPhone 12 will ignore as they are intended for the iPhone 14. Also not accepting the update can cause devices to not function properly with apps. The app developer will also behind the scenes make adjustments to their app to work properly with the latest firmware. If the app cannot find the latest version on the device upon which it is installed it too may malfunction. 

Bottom-line…sometimes refusing to accept updates may cause device issues later on. Just food for thought and not offered as a solution to your issues. 

No warning messages or errors at all. The sound just quits one day and thats it. We have to check every single device for “needed” updates until we find the culprit. When we do, the Arc starts working again. 

I get that, really. But the plain text here is that on my previous Sonos system, which was a Playbar home theater, I skipped dozens of updates including those that forced firmware updates. If I was the customer who bought a couple of Play:1 speakers and set them up in different rooms and I listened to streaming services, then updates might be a thing to do.  After I set the Playbar up and ran the room configuration I never touched the controllers again, ever. There was just no need to.

Then one day I was “tricked” into an update, and once that happened the system was locked until I did all updates including firmware. For anyone who would object and say “No way, Sonos would never do that!” keep in mind that Apple themselves used to do that with iOS. If you skipped an update for any length of time more than what they considered reasonable, on random occasions it would bring up a screen that said something like “Remind Me Later or Enter PIN to Install Update” and then had the keypad underneath it so it looked like a PIN query. Most people were so accustomed to entering their PIN to use their iPhone that they automatically entered the number, and then the phone would go into the update regardless of what the customer wanted, and no way to stop it. 

I know these are different cases. The iPhone handles a lot of personal and sensitive info, and updates are generally a good thing. Generally. And Sonos is just a piece of consumer gear that offers services you may or may not need or want. So I think it makes no sense to force updates on people. And since updates always cure the dropped sound issue on my Arc - whereas nothing else will do that - Occam’s razor suggest that the dropped sound was initiated somewhere in the food chain to beckon me into an update. 

I don’t know about Google, but in iOS I believe automatic updates from the App Store are opt-in. I have all that stuff turned off for years now and my preferences follow me to my next iPhone, so maybe its changed now, but as far as I know its still opt-in. Nothing installs on my phone without my express approval. 

How do you “check every single device for “needed” updates until we find the culprit”? If you <Update System> it’s all automatic; I don’t know of a way to just update one speaker in my system. The whole point is that all apps and all speakers need to be running the same versions. And you say “The sound just quits one day”. Again, it’s very strange that you go to the app on your phone, select a music source to stream to a room, and it starts streaming but no sound comes out and there are no error messages to say what’s amiss.  

Have you tried submitting a Diagnostics report to Sonos? What did they tell you was happening? 

I meant to say “check every controller for needed updates” but in my head I was still thinking about individual devices like my phones, Apple TV, etc. My apologies if I added to the confusion. 

I haven’t done anything as far as Sonos support goes. The humorous side of my brain tells me that contacting them about this will get the response of “well turn on automatic updates, duh!” Right now I’m trying to find out if anyone else here is experiencing this before I approach them. 

It now seems all these replies from us are irrelevant since you now say, “Right now I’m trying to find out if anyone else here is experiencing this” despite your question in your first post being “So why the forced update gimmick?”

Judging from the lack of responses echoing your experience, I’d speculate that: no, it’s just you! 

No, “all these replies” aren’t irrelevant. I could make an exception for your last one though. Your first paragraph there makes zero sense. 

I just re-read the thread from the top just so I could review “all these replies”, and I found that there was a green “ANSWERED” badge, with JGatie’s response receiving 1 ‘upvote’ indicating that this was solved, which I would assume has driven down interest in the thread. Interestingly, his response was completely irrelevant in the context of my question. I wasn’t asking how to prevent updates, I was asking if anyone had experienced service drops that were resolved by point updates to controllers, indicating that the updates were being forced. 

Let me restate it here for posterity:

My Sonos ARC home theater drops sound at random. We’ve discovered that it means one of our controllers “needs” updating. We have to check every controller in the house (multiple iPhones, two iMacs, an iPad) until we find which one(s) have pending updates. On rare occasions we have device updates pending. We do the update(s), the system starts working again. Sound comes through the home theater. At no point in the ownership of our Playbar home theater did this happen, and I was able to skip years of updates with no problem. This appears as if Sonos is stopping sound from playing in order to force controller and device updates.

Now that I have that re-established, please consider that there is a certain logic to gathering the experiences of others before making a service request. And now if no one else is replying due to an “answered” tag on this thread, then does that mean no one else is experiencing this issue? 

Nothing about pending updates can ever stop your Arc from playing sound.  There’s something else at work here.  I suggest you submit a diagnostic and post the reference number here the next time you experience the problem.  

You obviously misunderstood my question, and you probably didn’t see my response because I forgot to quote you. So here’s your quote, and here’s my (more detailed) response summarizing my responses to people misunderstanding the question:

The Arc system works. I have auto updates TURNED OFF on the Sonos. I have auto updates TURNED OFF on every single piece of software-driven technology in my home. I can use the Arc all day, several days in a row. Then one day I turn it on and there’s no sound. The first time it happened I messed with all of my display and Apple TV settings at length before trying different controllers (computers, iPhones, iPad) and discovering that some controller in the house had a pending update. I did the update and the Arc started working again. Occasionally its device firmware updates but more often than not its controller updates.

The Arc still drops at random, and its ALWAYS solved by a SONOS update, not an update for any other product in my house. Sometimes we’ll have drops two or three days in a row, and I’ll find that some controller needs an x.point.point update. My prior Playbar home theater never suffered from service interruptions. Even when the controllers were disabled by my refusal to update the devices, I was still able to use the Playbar without a problem. 

On the surface it appears to me that Sonos is using service interruptions to force device updates, which might frustrate a person into turning on auto-updates. 

Now, do you have a response to this? Can you withdraw the ‘answered’ tag so maybe more people would stop in? Should I create a new thread? 

Hi @Forstal 

Due to this topic having had no activity for several days, it was flagged in my workflow as needing a Best Answer.

As you posted in the Ask a Question section, and the only question you asked was “So why the forced update gimmick?”, I marked @jgatie’s response as the Best Answer because it was the best answer to your actual question. Perhaps I was being too literal - apologies.

@jgatie’s latest reply is also accurate - if the TV audio is cutting out, it has absolutely nothing to do with an update being required by a controller, regardless of what you have noticed. Correlation is not causation. I recommend you unplug your TV from power for at least 2 minutes - this usually solves the issue you describe. If it doesn’t, please check that your HDMI cable(s) is/are well-seated.

I hope this helps.

A - HT drops sound at random

B - Controller devices need updates on rare occasions.

I don’t know how you conclude that ‘need for updates’ are causing the drop outs.  The updates are obviously not random but specific events.   And if the controllers rarely need updates, that would mean your HT drop sounds would have to be rare as well.

It does make some sense that doing an update would resolve drop out issues, at least temporarily, The new software may include a bug fix for an issue you’re experiencing.  More likely, updates to firmware will always reboot the device, and get a new IP address from your router. 

But, the idea that some of your controller devices need software updates implies that it’s not a firmware update, just controller update that’s missing.  Your devices would not redo an update every time you bring an app up to date.

Also worth clarifying if the drop outs happen with streaming audio, TV audio, or both.  Either way, the diagnistic and talk to support is the way to go.

Yes, I have a response.  Sonos is not “using service interruptions to force device updates”.  I know this because my brother owns an Arc that he uses solely as a soundbar, and he’s never updated it, aside from when it was first installed over a year ago.  He doesn’t even have the Sonos app on his phone and his Arc works perfectly for TV sound.  

1. “I don’t know how you conclude that ‘need for updates’ are causing the drop outs.” I conclude this because restarting various components, unplugging things, checking for aTV updates, etc, doesn’t resolve the issue. Only checking every SONOS component and controller in the house - and inevitably finding a pending update - solves the issue. 
2.  “But, the idea that some of your controller devices need software updates implies that it’s not a firmware update, just controller update that’s missing.  Your devices would not redo an update every time you bring an app up to date.” Please clarify this because I don’t get what you’re saying. 
3. “Also worth clarifying if the drop outs happen with streaming audio, TV audio, or both.  Either way, the diagnistic and talk to support is the way to go.” The updates happen with any source that applies sound to the Arc, which includes every app on the aTV. 

You have identified a solution to the problem.  Not the cause.  As I stated, if your pending update is a firmware update, you’re bouncing the system.

Your phone and your speakers are two different physical devices that can be updated.  When the software on the speakers need to be updated, that’s generally referred to as a fimware update.  When the app on your phone needs to be updated, that’s an app updated.  Sonos will usually schedule updates so that both the app and the devices getted updated at the same general time, however, there are cases where just one or the other needs an update.    And obviously, if you do an update on one phone or tablet in your home, the apps in your other devices will need to be updated...when firmware is already updated.

Your answer makes me thinking that you don’t play any streaming sources directly to the Arc, all the audio comes from the TV.

JGatie’s initial response was based on his complete misunderstanding of my question. I didn’t ask how to prevent updates. I asked why service interruptions appeared to be a way to force me to update. He was congratulated by someone for this, and then you marked the thread as answered. 

I call him on this and I don’t even get an “oops” out of him. Instead, JGatie’s last two answers boil down to “you’re wrong it can’t happen that way” and “it didn’t happen to my brother so you’re wrong”. Yet remarkably, every time there’s a sound drop out, it is always solved by checking controllers for updates. Applying the updates brings the sound back right away. Occasionally, but rarely, its a device update. Applying that brings the sound back, right away. So to me, it appears that pending updates cause my system to drop sound. 

Finally, the tv isn’t the issue, please note above where I said that I dealt with the display and AppleTV and other devices first. Everything else outside this Arc has been rebooted multiple times while I tried to figure out the Arc dropout the first time. Since then I haven’t had to restart anything including Sonos devices - unless there was a Sonos firmware update - all I needed to do was update one or more controllers.  But just to be certain the next time this happens I’ll restart the tv and report back to you. 

1. And as I’ve said numerous times, most of the pending updates are controller software updates. Firmware updates are rare, but they also solve the problem. What does “bouncing the system mean”?
2. I don’t have automatic updates turned on. And on numerous occasions we've found one single controller out of our many, that had an update pending, but none of the others. 
3. My wife uses the TunedIn radio portion of the Sonos controller to play a single local FM station. The Arc drops out with that as well. We’ve also run into an unrelated problem with TunedIn where it will not work unless we update the controller, but the tv is still passing sound to the Arc. That kind of deflates the whole “your TV is causing this” scenario so I’m glad you brought this point up. I have no use for the rest of the streaming stuff so I can’t comment on that. 

So, if I understand you right, Sonos actively forces you (or all users) to update your system by using the controller to cause drop outs on the system? How? Why? And why has nobody noticed this before?

Thats the summary of it. There’s only really three pieces to this chain: Sonos, Arc, and the controller(s). 

How? I don’t know. But if I had to guess, I would say its a simple flag that is set by an inbound update notification, and that flag shuts off the sound. Updating resets the flag. But I’m not a coder so this is just a guess. 

Why? Again I’m just guessing, but I’d say its to frustrate the user into turning on automatic updates. I did some reading on Sonos updates when I got into this Arc and I found out they did some really heavy-handed stuff at one point in the past to force updates. I don’t exactly recall what it was but it was either a firmware update that broke the controllers to force people into a newer version of the controller that they didn’t like, or vice versa. I’ve already spent too much time on this topic today or I’d go look into it for you. 

Why has nobody noticed this before?  I’ve spent no small amount of time reading threads here about software issues, and one of the most common pieces of advice is “you should have auto updates turned on”. So perhaps nearly everyone here has auto-updates turned on, and since my problem relates to unperformed updates, those customers don’t run into a forced controller update issue? Once again, I’m just guessing, but that seems like the simplest answer. 

Dear @Forstal 

Please just submit a Diagnostics report, contact Sonos support, and then let us know what they say. 
 

Many thanks in anticipation.