Thanks for posting this.  I’ve read the article and, while technical, it is VERY informative. It’s not a rant.  It’s thoughtful and even handed, and IMHO, not flattering to Sonos.  It describes the roles of key communication interfaces or protocols, notably for discovering and working with Sonos devices and for finding and playing music, whose bases have changed (by Sonos) radically from the old app version (still used by the desktop apps) to the new version.  When the Sonos app can’t find your gear, it’s tied up with one of these changes.  When it can’t find, let alone catalog, your local music, it’s tied up with another.

The bottom line we’ve repeated over and over in this forum remains:  The new design was launched without adequate testing.  It wasn’t courageous -- it was fool-hearty. The unwillingness to revert back to the old way of doing things for now, even though the desktop apps still use exactly these old well-tested methods and the devices (at least prior to headphones) still react to them properly and reliably, is infuriating.

Someone suggested earlier that my problems in dealing with my local music might be solved by using Plex.  This suggestion has come up before, but for a different reason, an important deficiency in the Sonos system:  How to handle the finite limit to library size.  For me, that limit is around 35,000 tracks.  My complete music library is much larger than this, too large for Sonos to handle.  Up until the recent disaster, I only accessed a portion of it with Sonos.  I experimented with Plex, but it’s a lot of work, it involves internet management and it opens up my files and network to the outside world which makes me very uncomfortable.  In the end, I solved the capacity problem by moving to BluOS and BlueSound and NAD products which handle my entire library and perform at full hi-res capability (up to 192 kbps 24 bit and beyond)..I don’t think this is the proper place to discuss or extol the virtues of a competing system.  I just mention this because, even when Sonos works, as it once did, it still has insurmountable limitations that other brand choices do not.

I called the support about multiple issues with new app and they blamed Orbi which is widely used. I did not have much problem with previous app under Orbi. The sluggish performance of new Sonos app, the difficulty in changing rooms and its unreliability make the Sonos very hard for me to use. I have lost faith and I don’t understand why your company has taken such a step that harms your reputation. 

If you have access to the desktop app try it. If it doesn’t work it’s probably your network. If it does it’s probably the new buggy AF app that’s the problem. 

This whole deal has become far too complex and arcane for those of us who have just one rather modest requirement: the ability to locate, save and play the music we want, the way we have been doing for years, without needing to understand or learn to manipulate the inner workings of the Sonos system. 

When I dipped my toe in the digital music ocean years ago, I bought a single Sonos play1, fully expecting to be as frustrated and ultimately disappointed as I have been since the new and improved controller was foisted upon us.  Instead, I was amazed how easy it was to use; how vast the universe of music I could choose from (although it would be years before the ECM catalog went digital).

The sound that came out of that reasonably priced little Play1 box far exceeded expectations. I’ll date myself: it was like the first time I played an LP on the KLH Model Eleven portable I bought in college. 

So I kept buying more Sonos. The play1 went stereo. Then I added a Sonos Sub. Then that became a pair of Fives to go with the Sub, the play1 pair went to the bedroom, another stereo pair of play1 and recently a pair of Era 100s in the kitchen.

I never imagined or bargained for what Sonos management has done now. I suppose I should have, given that planned obsolescence has been the way ‘high tech’ businesses have kept the dollars flowing since inception.

Nevertheless, it’s difficult not to be angry, or a bit depressed, or a bit of both about what has happened since May. As others have said, it makes a number of alternatives for streaming and storage, or a return to ‘old technology’ like vinyl and CDs, seem more and more attractive. Changing horses won’t be inexpensive, so some patience is in order. But patience only goes so far.

Sonos has fouled the nest, no question about it. I really don’t want to know precisely how things have been screwed up; I do really want to understand why Sonos seems to care so little for its customer base and why it seems to believe dissing its diehard ‘fans’ won’t have adverse consequences.

Because it will.

Sonos are anythng but quick, they have been working on cloud tech behind new app for 5 years, and this is as good as they could get it...

Sonos..

Please, please, please make your system usable again.

2min and 50sec to open the app, usually i only have to restart it 4-5 times, so that is better?!…

IOS: 17.5.1

Sonos: 80.04.04

Hi @IdontLikeit 

Sorry to see that issue you are having - it looks annoying. I see you have 38 app updates available on the App Store - any chance one of those is for our app? If so, please update to the latest version.

I hope this helps.

@IdontLikeit

See attached screenshot taken from your video - my thoughts are to switch off the mobile data connection, just for the App only and see if that makes a difference. It struck me your device has fallen back to that LTE connection, as there is perhaps a temporary issue with the mobile WiFi connection. I definitely do not see such a data link on my controller device.

@IdontLikeit,

Aswell as any updates, some further thoughts are to also perhaps ensure you have provided the Sonos App the ‘usual’ five permissions required…Access to:

• LAN
• Bluetooth
• Mic
• Location (precise) 
• Notifications

…and perhaps see if that might help to sort the start-up issue too

Edit: In my own use-case I have quite a few Sonos products and around 17 music services installed and I choose to switch off the Apps ‘fallback’ to mobile data - here is what I see with the latest App (all permissions granted0. So it should open reasonably quickly if all is well. (See attached recorded a few moments ago).

First off, I’m not particularly computer savy. Like many, I expect to turn a product on and have it work - I don’t have the desire nor the time to implement work around solutions for a product I used to enjoy but through no fault of my own now can’t.

I read the LinkedIn article What happened to the Sonos app? A technical analysis by Any Penell and came away with the following impressions:

• When Sonos scrapped the old app for the nightmare new one, they knew exactly what they were doing and did it anyway. This wasn’t a “courageous decision” but a premeditated and calculated business decision of the utmost hubris.
• Sonos is in denial about what a mistake this was and in my opinion apparently has no intention of admitting fault or fully correct the current app’s deficiencies.
• More than likely, Sonos will lose long-time customers who bought Sonos products for their ease of use and speaker quality as well as new customers who are frustrated with products that won’t function.
• Should Sonos “deprecate their desktop apps at some unspecific point in the future” as Andy Pennell states they are likely to do, my sense is things will get worse.

What a sad chapter for a company that had a quality product that was relatively easy to use.

Just my 2¢; your results will most certainly vary.
 

From what ive read, sonos are going for mobile market, hence web based api so music goes with you when you leave the house with new headphones and your phone, mobile speakers, can see car interface coming, sonos app just keeps playing same track where ever you go. 

Therefore local tied to house music and tech, maybe pc apps will be side lined, let plex sort that out , besides nobody buys local music anymore….

But are most home wifi installs upto the change…..

@paulrw 

unfortunately I own a house based speaker system and don’t intend buying Sonos headphones as I already own 4 pairs of Bluetooth headphones that function perfectly 

I don’t use headphones in my house that often to pair with my arc and my hearing is not impaired to need help hearing dialogue 

as my speakers are housebound and are not going everywhere with me I see no value in the web based application being rolled out especially as it has no secondary security as in TFA

luckily for me I haven’t updated so I have no issues with my system at the moment but that could change in the future at that time I guess I will be moving on 

Sonos might have to backtrack, they have done it before, and revert to local API control for S2 to keep customers with local music and crap wifi, and this fully blown mobile utopia dream/disaster.

Audi Q3 had sonos speakers in 2023, so maybe sonos have been working on car systems…..

After all what’s wrong with bluetooth for mobile experiences... 

I have a similar problem but mine just crashes repeatedly. Brutal app experience. I’m not happy being a beta tester for this POS. 
 

Does the desktop app work for you? It’s working

for me so I know it’s not my network. 
 

@Corry P , @Ken_Griffiths , @IdontLikeit 

I am continuing to see similar load issues, as detailed above, with application load taking several minutes if it loads at all. This is on new Android application UK based.

As far as I can determine this is NOT down to network or application permission issues, just down to the 'courageous' new Sonos application and architecture…

Until the new application starts to load quickly and reliably I will continue to use version 16.1 - just can't wait 5 minutes + to skip a track or adjust volume - ridiculous! 

Other 3rd party applications and network discovery tools find all speakers very quickly using mDNS (as well as UPnP) on the same network - it is just Sonos! 

@User117655,
My Android (tablet) controller App has always loaded quickly here too, strange how the same App (iOS or Android) is fine with my network and all my speakers are discovered (always) almost instantly too.

Have you spoken with Sonos Support about your ‘device discovery’ issue? If not, here is a link to perhaps get in touch with the Staff…

https://support.sonos.com/s/contact

Same for me, app just crashes over, and over, and over.

Yes, same here, desktop works as it should.

Less then 1 sec from start of app to being able to control the speakers. 

Hi @IdontLikeit 

It bears repeating, so I’ll repeat it - do you have a Sonos app update pending in your App Store, along with the other 37? Please install it if so.

I hope this helps.

@Ken_Griffiths Thanks for your quick reply but I don't need to trouble shoot my network (as that is not the issue) with support. I run business grade modem, dhcp/firewall, and network distribution not a 60 pence ISP router. This is a Sonos issue, not for all but for at least a big and significant minority.

To quote the very informative LinkedIn article (oh and incidentally, could Sonos not have provided something similar):

"... Others have not been so lucky, and right now, two months after the new app's release, something still stinks in the Sonos device discovery code, based on Facebook and Reddit anecdotal data..."

And, of course, the continued stream of users having the issue and reporting to this forum…

I really hope the Sonos experience will improve this month but, frankly, I am beginning to loose patience. I was about to embark on a large upgrade of Sonos equipment over two locations - many £'s on top of what has been an ongoing investment. This experience has put that on hold and I am now coming close to abandoning Sonos for another ecosystem, which saddens me ☹️

Can you simply re-release the old app while you work on fixing the new app?  

No, latest IOS and app updates of course, and also latest firmware on all speakers.

It’s such a terrible experience, the fact that the app crashes is so telling for bad code / programming.

Desktop mac app works 100% and starts within 1 sec every time.

This is not an error in connection, i have 2 sims so the lower part is the connection status for my e-sim.

Wifi /connection is not the problem, and allowing Sonos to have access to all phone functions makes no difference.

The only needed permission is “Local network” for everyday use.

The app is garbage, that’s it. It worked before 100% and now it doesn't.

And as mentioned, the mac desktop app access the system in < 1sec every time without issues.

You need to focus on SONOS not on the intelligence of your users

Agree completely with this comment, CLEARY there are issues with the new app, full stop.