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Speakers disappearing from app, but not from the controllers on my Mac or PC

  • 12 October 2023
  • 3 replies
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Every other day, some of my speakers disappear from the app. It’s not always the same speakers, and checking with two phones might sometimes show different parts of the Sonos system on each phone. The speakers usually reappear after a while (or after power cycling them). But strangely, even when my phone is not showing any speakers at all (yes, this also does happen), I can always see the whole system in the controller on my Windows PC or my Mac. Apparently, the speakers are connected the whole time, for the following reasons:

  • Windows and Mac controllers can always see and control them.
  • I can ping the “missing” speakers from any device on the network.
  • My access points report uninterrupted connectivity to the speakers with great connection quality.
  • The speakers keep playing even while the app doesn’t see them.

My setup:

  • 5x One SL + 1x Move (all spread across the house, on different floors)
  • Ubiquiti Unifi network devices
    • USW Pro 24 (main switch)
    • Various access points (Flex HD, U6+), all wired to the main switch
  • I’m not using SonosNet since the speakers are too far apart and the materials used to build my house (and the floor heating system) prevent radio waves from spreading far enough. My WiFi access points provide great coverage, though, and every single Sonos speaker is located within one to three meters distance with direct line of sight to the respective access point.
  • All speakers have static IP addresses and are on the same subnet as the phones and the Windows and Mac computers (which have static IPs as well).
  • The access points with overlapping coverage areas are using different channels, but share the same SSID.
  • The Unifi controller is forcing each speaker to stay on its access point (the closest one to the respective speaker) instead of hopping between access points (if it can hear more than one), so the whole network topology should be totally static. The only exception here would be the phones hopping from access point to access point while we move through the house. The Windows PC is wired to the main switch, the Mac(Book) is using WiFi.

After reading loads of similar posts and trying all the different “solutions” and approaches like power cycling speakers, restarting routers and access points, reinstalling the app, checking for WiFi interference or IP address related issues, I’m out of ideas now.

I also don’t understand the dynamics of this issue. There doesn’t seem to be a general problem with my setup because it works most of the time. It is unclear what makes the speakers disappear temporarily.

One thing that just came to my mind while writing this: I’ve noticed an “interesting” behaviour the last time this happened. The app on my phone was again showing only some of the speakers while the Windows controller was showing the whole system. I then used the Windows controller to group one of the speakers that the app was still showing and of one of the ones which were missing in the app. As soon as the “visible” speaker joined the group, it disappeared from the app on the phone. I was able to repeat this with all visible speakers, making them disappear one after the other until the phone was showing an empty system. Force closing and reopening the app still showed an empty system, but when I tried the same again a few minutes later, the app suddenly was listing all speakers again.

So, any ideas?

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Best answer by Ken_Griffiths 12 October 2023, 22:55

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3 replies

First see this link:

http://jaredrobinson.com/blog/upnp-ssdp-mdns-llmnr-etc-on-the-home-network/

The Sonos controller uses SSDP to initially discover the players, multicasting via UDP to 239.255.255.250:1900 and, for good measure, broadcasting to 255.255.255.255:1900. 

Thereafter communication is unicast.

My guess is your network, with its various access points operating on different wireless channels, is having ‘device discovery’ issues due to the multicast packets not getting through to their destination.

It would explain why your various controllers are each seeing different devices.     

As it’s a Unifi network setup, perhaps take a look at this link and suggested settings…

https://github.com/IngmarStein/unifi-sonos-doc

I would maybe also try putting all the network access point hubs/satellites on the same WiFi channels too and see if it may help improve Sonos device discovery. 

 

Thank you for your answer. After reading both of your references and another ton of threads in the Ubiquity community, I’ve tried several proposed solutions which still didn’t help. My network was already configured as suggested by IngmarStein, and when I switched the whole network from RSTP to STP (just to be able to say that I’ve tried), things got a lot worse so I quickly went back to RSTP.

Fortunately, I now seem to have found a way to make Sonos work again. It has been stable for a couple of days now and I haven’t seen any speakers disappear from the app, no matter where I am in the house and which access point my phone is connected to.

I don’t know exactly which detail did the trick in the end, and I won’t touch any settings for a while unless I run into issues again, but here’s what I did:

I’ve created a new SSID which is now being used exclusively by the Sonos speakers and which has the following configuration:

  • Same VLAN as the SSID used by my mobile devices, PCs etc. which are running the controller software or app, so my phone and the speakers still end up in the same network segment / subnet.
  • Only broadcasted by the access points that the speakers need to connect to.
  • 2.4 GHz only
  • Almost every option turned OFF:
    • Band Steering
    • Hide WiFi Name
    • Client Device Isolation
    • Proxy ARP
    • BSS Transition
    • UAPSD
    • Fast Roaming
    • WiFi Speed Limit
    • Multicast Enhancement
    • Multicast and Broadcast Control
  • 802.11 DTIM Period set to “Auto”
  • Minimum Data Rate Control set to “Manual” and to the lowest possible value (1 Mbps)
  • Security Protocol set to WPA3, Group Rekey Interval to 3600 seconds and SAE anti-clogging and Sync time both to 5.

The rest of my configuration stayed the same, so the speakers still have static IPs and are locked to their closest access points (except for the Sonos Move which may still roam).

Feel free to try this if you’re having similar issues as I had, but note that this is only for Sonos systems without any wired speakers and which are purely based on your own WiFi (not SonosNet!).

I think a recent update screwed up the way some sonos speakers handle WPA3 encryption so if your access points are using both WPA2 and 3 they now choke on 3 when they used to work fine.  Disable WPA3 on your APs and reboot and try again.