Have you heard of eBay?  If you put it on there you will find plenty of people willing to pay good money to take it off your hands.

Not quite understand why so many people keep saying “App is useless”, “System is useless” or “Cannot use the system after updates” etc… Software? Hardware? Or networking problems?? Have been using the system for some 5 to 6 years with 16 SONOS devices, but really never found problems as serious as “system is not working and cannot be used” or so… Just curious.

Good question.  I also have a large system that I have used for nine years without a significant glitch.  It is worth bearing in mind that the vast majority of users who have zero issues don’t come onto the Forum.  It’s a place for problems, so you get a very distorted view.

Complaints that the app is useless usually stem from people misunderstanding the role of the app, which in reality is just a remote control.

Most of the ‘system is useless’ complaints are down to local networking and communication issues.  Not necessarily faults with the local network, just things that don’t gel well with Sonos, and need careful setting up.  That can still be immensely frustrating for the small number who experience constant difficulties, of course. 

Virtually everything is resolvable.

I think the transition to S1 / S2 has not been smooth for some users, and the process wasn’t as clearly set out by Sonos as it might have been.  This has created some genuine issues for some users lately.

Yes I totally agree that the community/forum is a place for problems and complaints, and I have read a lot of course… but just don’t understand why they have such problems and would like to learn more. Like what the problem they are having for the transition from S1 to S2? What’s wrong after the updates? 

Haters will always hate. 

Lots of them are here to whinge in general and can’t even explain what is wrong with their system. How to help when they can’t even articulate the problem other than cry like a self entitled consumers who always claim to spend lots of money on many SONOS products - Why did they buy more than 1 when they have issue?

I think SONOS need to put some buyers restriction on their products. Example:-

*** Warning ***

1. Products always work in a normal home network environment. 
2. If you have problem downloading Sonos apps and connecting to new Sonos speakers in the first instance, please immediately return the product as the product is not suitable for you or your home network.
3. If you choose to keep the Sonos product, please ensure you are able to articulate the issues by writing down the What / Where / When / How observations.
4. We are here to help, if you want to get help.
5. There is no age restrictions but if you are not mature in your way of thinking it is not suitable for you, … at all. 
6.  Sonos occasionally have softwares update and if you have issue, please see point 1. 

Sonos used to be great now it’s jammed with issues I never used to have before. I spent 1.5 hours on the phone with a very nice technician but the issues persist. The company keeps blaming it on people’s wifi set up. I am sorry but needing to update my Music Library every day is not a wifi issue it’s a sonos issue. Or speakers suddenly disappearing and having to spend 2 hours trying to reconnect them is not a wifi issue it’s a Sonos issue. Please get your act together !  The product used to be great until they started upgrading it all the time. Get the basics fixed because offering enhancements please! I am a Sonos believer but they are letting me down. 

1. Products always work in a normal home network environment.
   What’s “normal” ? My wifi did not change but Sonos started acting up 
2. If you have problem downloading Sonos apps and connecting to new Sonos speakers in the first instance, please immediately return the product as the product is not suitable for you or your home network.
   I have had it for years and only started having issues recentty and NO nothing changed with my network.
3. If you choose to keep the Sonos product, please ensure you are able to articulate the issues by writing down the What / Where / When / How observations.
   I believe I am fairly articulate when speaking with tech support (very nice people by the way) but they are dealing with a very unstable product (as of late… it used to be great with no issues at all)
4. We are here to help, if you want to get help.
   I know and thank you for that but there are some basics that need to be addressed. Are you keeping tabs on the increase of issues in the past year or so?
5. There is no age restrictions but if you are not mature in your way of thinking it is not suitable for you, … at all. 
   This comment is not mature. Just fix the product please.
6.  Sonos occasionally have softwares update and if you have issue, please see point 1. 
   My Sonos is fully up to date tey it keeps having issues.
   
   Cheers.

So, you’re not familiar with duplicate IP addresses being handed out by router’s that are in a bad state? Certainly that can happen, even if you haven’t changed your network in any way. And it doesn’t require Wi-Fi, IP addresses are used by both Wi-Fi and wired devices in a network. Sonos, due to the fact that they soft reboot during the software update (just like a computer does when you update its OS) and results in a request for a new IP address from your router. If they receive a duplicate IP address, then there are all sorts of potential issues. Since the fault is in the router, which is responding to a simple IP request from Sonos, the Sonos System has no way of knowing that the router has given them a bad address, and there’s no amount of software changes that Sonos can make to fix potential issues with the router.

In fact, it’s not uncommon for router’s to update their OS as well in the background, without notifying you, depending on the settings available in their software. Again, you didn’t change anything in your network, but your network changed, none the less.

And we haven’t even gotten in to wifi interference, and all of the potential external influences that can affect it.

Feel free to blame Sonos if you want, but be aware that in the grand majority of cases, Sonos is not at fault. And I’ve been using S2 since it came out, on 19 devices, with zero issues. 

Cannot agree more!

I understand all of the above points about the network being at fault. I have been working in IT and network support since 1993.

However, when the Sonos system demands that you update the software, before it lets you use your speakers and then does not work, because the speakers are Gen 1, does not help the case for Sonos.

I did this, and now I cannot use my Gen 1 Play 5 x2, or my ZP90. The playbar which is Gen2 does work.

The system is connected using a bridge hardwired to my router, and I do not use DHCP on the router, so I dish out addresses manually, (just a paranoid security thing for me).

I don’t want the new features, I just want to be able to use my sonos, and I don’t quite understand why I am still an advocate for the system, but I am.

You should be using the S1 software. It sounds like the Playbar somehow got updated to S2. I suggest you:

• factory reset the Playbar
• remove any S2 controller apps, and reinstall the S1 app
• when the app starts tell it to connect to an existing system
• check that the Play:5s and ZP90 are visible
• add the Playbar to the system and, hopefully, it should downgrade itself to S1

Unless you sit there as a personal DHCP server waiting to respond to requests I don’t see how. Sonos units cannot be configured with static addresses. Or did you simply mean that you reserve IPs for all your devices?

Ratty,

I do use reserve addressing, as you are right, it is not possible to assign an address to a sonos device any other way. I have several sonos devices, bridge cr200, zp90, 2 x play 5, and soundbar. The play 5 are switched off, as they don’t work, and the cr200 is sat trying to update itself, as it has been for the last year, but out of sight, out of mind. It’s in a cupboard along with my music server. 

On christmas day wife wanted music whilst having dinner, so I thought, well better try a play 5, and switched it on. when it came up, it appeared in the S1 app on iphone, and wanted to update. Unable to use until it updated, so gave it a try. After this update completed, previous ones had not, then it was available and ready to use. To my surprise it worked. I then switched on other play 5 and after update that also worked. I have not been able to use the play 5 for over a year as they were borked by an update that was unasked for.

I’m a happy bunny, but still would like to be able to refuse updates and still have my kit working. None of the IT OS manufacturers force updates on you, so why does sonos?

Too right. My working system no longer works because it kept nagging to update to S2 and someone in the building presses that button to do so. Now all our Crestron touch panels won’t control Sonos. So much for us choosing the system because of the Crestron/Sonos partnership.

Downgrade to S1? The documented method of factory reset doesn’t downgrade the OS from S2 to S1 on any of my devices. And even if it did, how am I going to stop someone random pressing that nagging update button & having this problem occur again?

Upgrade the Crestron controller to S2? No, Crestron doesn’t support that despite its partnership with Sonos.

It doesn’t. You can disable the regular check that the system makes for firmware updates, via Settings/System/System Updates.

However you’d also have to take parallel steps to prevent automatic controller app updates. By default iOS and Android devices autoupdate their installed apps. Since controllers and player firmware have to be matched the update of one may require the update of the other before the system will work.

As an aside, most cases of “borking by an update” are typically caused by a duplicated IP after the units reboot post update. 

So, the system was able to update entirely to S2. And because a third party external controller, about which the system had no knowledge, is unable to stay in step it’s somehow Sonos’ fault?

The system may not have had knowledge of it, but the company certainly did. Crestron & Sonos had a working partnership, which was openly advertised as a selling point for both their systems. And it was on this basis that we invested in Sonos. So why didn’t Sonos the company make sure that Sonos the system know about this partnership?

The problem would not have been a problem if the Sonos system didn’t keep nagging to update. The user should be given the options of Upgrade, Remind Me Later or Don’t Remind Me Again. 

Systems are never constrained by controllers. Controllers are entirely optional; they can come and go at any time.

It strikes me that your complaint ought to be levelled at Crestron as you’re their customer.

Mine doesn’t disable the regular check. I only have an option for automatic update or not. It still checks and it still nags even if you disable the automatic update. 

That was in response to the previous poster’s

None of the IT OS manufacturers force updates on you, so why does sonos?

I don’t quite understand this. I as the customer shouldn’t be thinking Controllers come and go. Before I used Sonos, I didn’t even know what a Sonos Controller was. Sonos advertised themselves as compatible with Crestron. Crestron advertised themselves as compatible with Sonos. Now they don’t work. Crestron didn’t change. Sonos changed. I don’t see how that’s a Crestron problem.

I have another thread where I’ve asked for advice, but one problem I have is that should I actually manage to downgrade my system to S1, what’s going to stop a random “helpful” user in the building from pressing the nagging Update button on the Sonos Controller app on a Crestron screen? Why can’t I (as the system admin) turn that nagging notification off?

I can understand the desire to dismiss nags, but in this case the system detects an S2-compatible system and is obviously keen to ‘encourage’ an update from S1. The system itself can see no reason not to upgrade. It’s not being held back by any legacy Sonos hardware.

As for Crestron’s development decisions I can offer no comment at all. Sonos S2 has been around for quite some time. Operating systems and interfaces change. It’s the relentless way of the tech world. 

Going a little OT here, but my understanding is that it’s actually not Crestron’s decision. The Crestron touch panels run Android. The Android OS can’t be updated because of hardware limitations, or because Android is hard to update, I don’t know. In any case, the Android version is fixed. The Sonos Controller app running on the touch panel is written by Sonos & Sonos aren’t writing an S2 app for this version of Android. Upgrade the touch panel perhaps? Whoa there, these aren’t phones or computers. They are fixed panels installed into buildings all over the world, working hand in hand with other components fixed into buildings. OS’s & interfaces change, but interfaces fixed into buildings shouldn’t change in such a drastic way. If partnering with a company like Crestron, Sonos needs to think like a company that does fixed installations. Otherwise, don’t partner. And I wouldn’t have chosen Sonos.

On that basis perhaps it’s a bit surprising that Android was chosen by Crestron for what are such long-lived and firmly integrated bits of kit. Android’s relatively short release cycles and support periods are well known. Sonos, for their part, generally try to support controller apps as long as is feasible, though lack of ongoing maintenance from the OS supplier inevitably brings down the shutters sooner or later.

I think it’s set and forget. No need to update. No need to change anything. The short release cycles aren’t a problem.

Well plainly they are, if part of one’s value proposition is to continue to host actively developed third party apps (e.g. Sonos) on the platform. 

I haven’t bothered to go digging, but presumably later Creston models do support an Android version recent enough to run Sonos S2?