Fed up with Sonos updates - lost one of my speakers

Don’t factory reset anything without further consult.

Which device are you attempting to use to control the system? Which operating system is this device using? Which SONOS units are wired? Wireless?

Too late 😣 now I can't do anything as my android phone is 7.0 and I don't have access to a new Android OS so I can't use the app to create system anymore.

Any suggestions to Sonos that I can stream music from my nas? Either that or I have to buy a new smartphone (my Moto G4 won't update to rev 8)

This is sickening.

P.s

When this has happened in the past I have added speakers back onto the system, both with and without factory reset. The problem here is the Sonos 1 app doesn't support android 7 with the features to enable me to add products to the system. Very very poor and a major design flaw IMO

Probably the quickest, easiest plan would be to Invite a friend to diner -- if they have a more modern pad/phone. Once you get the system operating you can use the W10 controller to operate the system. Actually I prefer the desktop controllers when operating the system.

Another path would be to purchase an inexpensive Android pad, but  research its operating system carefully because the cheapest pads will probably have Android 7 or 8. 

I had one flash of inspiration and that was to use my old xp pc that I originally set the system up with, it will have had the original controller.  Booting up the pc and Sonos controller, again before I could do anything the Sonos controller demanded an update... So I'm even unable to use the controller that came on the CD when I bought the Sonos.  This is very poor and short sighted.

You're idea sounds ok in principle, but I shouldn't have to do that, and it means installation of software on a friend's phone they may not want, and I shouldn't be in this situation in the first place. Even Microsoft don't do this! Sonos forced me to update the controller with no warning of the implications.

I’d just like to add also that I believe the Sonos system is not fit for purpose.  Essentially under the UK Consumers act, when you buy a product that’s designed to work with an app, it should be of satisfactory quality, fit for a particular purpose and as described by the seller. 

When I purchased Sonos in 2012 it was never made clear that in the future it may become unusable due to controller updates etc.  I believed that I would always be able to control my sonos system through the controller that shipped with the products on a CD (remember those!).

Sonos is failing to meet these criteria!

5.25am… I have been working on this problem most of the morning (UK time).. I’ve stopped short of rooting my Moto G4 in order to update the OS on that..  this is just one complete nightmare.

I’ve lost sleep, have a bricked audio system and am totally disgusted with the approach Sono’s have taken.  All I want is a blummin windows app that will allow me to manage my system as it was 12 years ago, no updates.. I was happy listenning to my music on my NAS.. now I can’t do that.

Might as well buy an Amazon Echo and stream music from there.

COME ON SONOS SORT THIS OUT!!!!!!!!  I should not expect my hardware to stop working because of blummin’ firmware, well okay, maybe it might!!!!  But I shouldn’t expect to be forced software updates on a speaker/audio system!!

I’m shattered, had little sleep and lost all patience.  I just do not know what to do.  And all I hear is ‘borrow a friends smartphone’…  what if none of my friends have Android 8+ eh?  

And I’m looking at circa £100 for a new smartphone (or £40 for an Amazon Fire) - but why should I have to pay this money to basically get my £600+ system back and running which I invested in 12 years ago.

Crikey, I’m having a right rant here.  Seriously, Sonos :(

Not sure what your rant is about. Sonos requirements are clearly stated on the website: your OS is not up to date anymore. The only thing you can hold against Sonos is that they follow the end of manufacturer support for OS’s more closely than others.

The system needs security updates because it is connected to the internet. In the Sonos system the app (whether it is installed on a phone or on a PC) has to follow suit.

So you know when your OS is no longer supported by its manufacturer, you will lose functionality in the Sonos app sooner or later. Sonos is clear about this, so it shouldn’t come as a surprise. Some investigation on this forum would have saved you a lot of grief and time: you cannot heal a system from an out of date phone (however usable for other purposes) or from a PC.

I would very much like to know what the status of Sonos would be under the consumer legislation you describe, especially since you state you have bought it twelve years ago.

I totally disagree, when I purchased this system 12 odd years ago, there was no indication that the system would stop functioning as OS went out of date.  This was always intended as a home music system, running my own music, why would the app and speakers *need* to be updated (through no choice I add!!).

You wouldn’t buy a audio amplifier that would stop working if you didn’t fit a new plug every 5 years, bad analogy I know but this product clearly has a limited life and for those of us who don’t buy the latest smart gadget every two years can’t use this anymore.

Basically this was not made clear at the time I purchased the product.  I’m not even sure it was in the small print.  In the early days I did not need to login into Sonos to add speakers!

But we are where we are, and I’ve just bought a new phone so that I can use sonos again.

Windows XP still works, its unsupported but you can still use it! (and install old software).

Nope - Sonos’ removed the management features from the windows app, and I don’t know why.

I still think you expect to much from internet connected consumer electronics. You could have stopped the system and the app from updating a long time ago since you did not need internet access. You didn't do that at the time  and you accepted all user terms in the meantime. Other users (dare I say most users) have enjoyed the internet connected features. 

If I remember it well Sonos said it removed the management features from the Windows app to save valuable development and maintenance time. As I have explained the app needs to move with te system software, so you cannot manage an up to date system with an out of dtae (Windows XP) app.

I think your anger should be directed at your phone maker that stops updating the OS after a period that is (way) shorter than the time you want to enjoy your phone. Sonos just follows this lead (though it must be said closer than other manufacturers).

He is making a valid point.

Sonos is taking deliberate action to cripple software that previously worked.

I could give numerous examples of applications that continue to work for many years after they were first released.

The point (made repeatedly here) that older versions of Android are insecure is demonstrably nonsense, because there are many online banking apps that still work OK with Android 5.

In my opinion it’s right to criticise Sonos for this policy. It is purely a profit-maximising exercise, with little regard for customers who bought into Sonos a few years ago and don’t want to be forced into buying new phones/tablets so that they can continue using products that they have already paid for.

Eyupp,

With respect to audio equipment the mindset has been “buy once, use forever”. It was similar with old telco landline phones. At least in the US the customer did not own the phones and only equipment owned and approved by the phone company was allowed to be connected to the wires (by law). The phone company’s business plan designed a 20 year lifespan into each piece of equipment. Imagine the utility of a 20 year “innovation” cycle. Early “portable” phones were suitcase sized devices. Imagine being required to carry such a device for 20 years before you could replace it with a “small” device you could best be described as a briefcase. Then another 20 years before a handheld device might have become available. I’m not sure that we would yet have pocket sized devices.

Early phone and personal computer innovation was driven scrappy small companies. In many ways this is still true. A small company will develop a small innovation that is then sold to a large company that has the resources to build the innovation on a large scale.

I too had to purchase a new phone last year. My phone was much older than yours and was stuck at Android 4.x. In addition to SONOS, Apps that I needed for my day job were being locked out. The final straw was the notice from my cell service provider that it will soon stop connecting this phone to the cell network. Otherwise, the phone was in near perfect condition. Yes, I was annoyed.

You might have noticed that you have had to replace all of your TV’s. In addition to higher resolution screens, the new TV’s allow stations to be packed closer together. The old TV’s could not operate in the current environment. The old system required a certain amount of space between channels -- “blank” channels if you like. The new scheme does not require any blanks and the whole TV band can be compressed, releasing spectrum for use by other technology, such as expanded cellphone speed and features.

You are missing the point.

There are plenty of cases where technology moves on and things no longer work. But this is not one of them.

Sonos is choosing to deliberately stop their app working properly, even though it could work fine on older versions with minimal maintenance.

The aim here is simply cost-saving (i.e. profit-maximising) by Sonos.

I could go on to explain why it is a very very poor policy in terms of customer psychology and satisfaction, but I’m not going to bother - because the fanboys here won’t want to listen...

Saying someone that does not (completely) agree with you is a “fanboy” is a cop out. In my explanation I did criticize Sonos about following the OS-makers in not supporting older OS's. But that is where the problem starts: stopping support for an OS version will make it unsafe after a certain time. So your first complaint should go to Apple or Google, or Samsung. 

Since no one here knows what it would cost Sonos (either in money terms or in time spent better in other developments) to keep supporting older OS's, saying this would only need minimal maintenance is an unsupported claim. It could be profit maximising, it could be something else. We just dont know.

With respect to Apple, they will make a change in their API, perhaps removing something. If an App does not migrate to the “new improved” replacement, the App will be dropped from the store. In many cases “new improved” does not work on older iOS versions. 

In fairness I didn’t call you a fanboy. I said that the fanboys here would not want to listen.

The claim that we should blame Google first is a diversion. As has been pointed out before, Google may have stopped supporting the version of Android on my phone, but they haven’t stopped me using it as a phone!

My real point is this:

If I don’t speak out about having obsolescence forced upon us by companies like Sonos, who will?

Should we just accept it, and throw (collectively) millions of perfectly good mobile phones away?

Sonos should try harder to do the right thing environmentally.

You blaming Sonos for the environmental impact of the cell phone sales model is like me blaming the company making the shampoo I just bought on Amazon for the environmental impact of cardboard shipping boxes.

“The cell phone sales model” is the same diversion, yet again.

Let me see if I can explain in a way that you can understand: My cell phone still works!

It’s Sonos that has chosen to change the app so that, although it would work properly yesterday, it won’t work properly today.

Can you see the difference?

Just because you can use a phone with a no longer supported OS does not mean, over time, you should…… https://www.ncsc.gov.uk/collection/mobile-device-guidance/managing-the-risks-from-obsolete-products

I said nothing about your cell phone, and it isn’t even germane to the point, which was your silly mention of the environment in this sentence - “Sonos should try harder to do the right thing environmentally.”   When the entire ½ trillion dollar per year cell phone industry’s marketing push is to sell the latest and greatest model, Sonos’ contribution to the cell phone’s environmental impact is nil.  As I said, it’s like blaming the shampoo company for Amazon’s waste of cardboard.

You’ve missed my point, yet again.

My (roughly) 4 year old Motorola phone works just fine. The “cell phone industry’s marketing push” does nothing to stop it from working, nor any other app on it.

Sonos has modified their app so that it won’t run properly on my (roughly) four year old phone. It’s the only app that I use on the phone that worked yesterday but won’t work today because Sonos modified it so that it can’t.

That is what is making my phone obsolete - not the “cell phone industry’s marketing push”.

Do you understand? No - because you don’t want to understand.

Meh, you are in a distinct minority of people who are not affected by the cell phone industry's marketing push.  Why should Sonos worry about you instead of the vast majority of people who upgrade every year or so and want the latest and greatest software features, which are what drives the abandoning of older devices? Ditto to why Sonos should worry about environmental impact of not supporting older OS version.

Am I in a distinct minority? How do you know? Perhaps because you think you are in the majority - that your world view is somehow more valid than mine?

It’s not just my phone that will be affected. I have two 10” Lenovo tablets that are dedicated to controlling my system. When Sonos decide that they won’t let me run their app on those tablets, they too will be obsolete.

Why do I say that this is very bad policy on Sonos’ part? Because to some users, it looks arrogant. It is Sonos, saying to its customers “you think that it’s your system, to use as you want, but we will show you that when we decide you can’t use a piece of your equipment any more, we won’t consult you - we will just change our software so that you can’t”.

The one thing that any company needs more than anything else (IMO) is the trust of its customers. And their arrogance undermines that trust.

Sorry, but I find when human traits such as arrogance or trustworthiness are being ascribed to faceless. corporations, it's time to bow out.  Someone has far too much emotional investment to rationally discuss the topic.  

Perhaps you think it’s irrational that analysts study what causes people to continue to buy products from one company, rather than hopping from one competitor to another?

That sort of analysis makes sense to a corporation - it’s not “emotional investment” on their part.

It may not be the primary thing that drives people’s buying habits, but concern for what we are doing to the environment is playing a bigger part in consumer choice now than it ever did in the past.

Sonos should take care that they don’t alienate their customer base through actions that clearly are not in the best interests of the environment.